Talk:Myanmar civil war (2021–present)

Found more areas controlled by Indian EAOs
"Pounyu village and Woilan Kingphu village" in Lahe township near New Pangsha village https://morungexpress.com/general-store-at-itc-dan-a-lifeline-for-naga-villages-under-myanmar

Also PDF forces have a presence along the Hkamti-Lahe road IdioticAnarchist (talk) 03:17, 28 May 2024 (UTC)


 * Likely coords for those villages are: ပုံညိုရွာ၊ လဟယ်မြို့နယ် and ဝေလံရွာ၊ လဟယ်မြို့နယ်- with Wailan being in Ponyu village tract. I've included these and Chen Hoyat in UNFLWESEA's control on the new map.  EmeraldRange  (talk/contribs) 01:43, 29 May 2024 (UTC)
 * Where is Pounyu, Woilan, and Chen Hoyat on the map? It appears that Pounya and Woilan are in Lahe Township, while the map only shows IIG (Indian Insurgent Group) territory in Layshi? Also, I don't think I've found a map of Chen Hoyat so I don't know where it is, but I may have just forgotten considering I have pretty bad memory. IdioticAnarchist (talk) 20:19, 30 May 2024 (UTC)
 * Alright, using Google Earth I've found the location of both Chen Hoyat and Chen Throilo (which I've seen mentioned in several articles) and both are in Lahe Township near Pounyu and Woilan, which is not shown on the map. IdioticAnarchist (talk) 23:09, 30 May 2024 (UTC)
 * Ah thats my bad I confused the border squiggle with the wrong squiggle. You can get the locations of Ponyu and Wailan on the burmese articles I linked.
 * I can probably update the map again later tonight-
 * 1) What's the change with Tedim, just that it's contested?
 * 2) I think I agree with Hsi Hseng contested- but you wanted hold off. Still disagree right?  EmeraldRange  (talk/contribs) 23:19, 30 May 2024 (UTC)
 * I'd say that putting Hsi Hseng as contested is right; and yes, Tedim is contested. IdioticAnarchist (talk) 23:31, 30 May 2024 (UTC)
 * I'm very sorry, I completely forgot to mention this, but apparently the DKBA-5 controls the Three Pagodas Pass https://www.bnionline.net/en/news/chinese-telecom-scammers-expand-operations-three-pagoda-pass and the KNLA de facto control most of Payathonzu https://www.bnionline.net/en/news/knu-consolidates-full-control-over-three-pagodas-pass-payathonzu-area-administration-spite (and a few months ago Kyaikdon was captured by KNLA forces https://www.irrawaddy.com/news/burma/myanmar-military-commanders-replaced-in-rakhine-mon-and-karen-states-sources.html) IdioticAnarchist (talk) 01:49, 1 June 2024 (UTC)

I need some help with this source about Border Guard Forces (+NDA-K areas)
https://mmpeacemonitor.org/313251/border-guard-force-scheme/ This source includes the actual areas controlled by Border Guard Forces, not just their townships. Most of these are self-explanatory and I can find them on maps, but there's areas noted that I'm gonna suppose are smaller towns that I cannot find. These include: If anyone knows at least a bit of Burmese, can you perhaps give a little help here?
 * "Gant Gwan", Kachin (I'm guessing Gawyawm?)
 * "Lupi", Kachin (Found on this map as north of Pang War https://reliefweb.int/map/myanmar/myanmar-chipwi-township-kachin-state-20-april-2020-enmy)
 * "Sin Kyaing", Kachin (Maybe "Shan Keng"? https://www.themimu.info/sites/themimu.info/files/documents/Tsp_Map_VL_Waingmaw_-_Kachin_MIMU154v05_20Apr2020_A1_Eng.pdf)
 * "Pantain", Kayah
 * "Soppai", Kayah
 * "Pantawmi", Kayin
 * "Kyonhtaw", Kayin
 * "Kataihte", Kayin
 * "Tanta-Oo", Kayin
 * "Dawlan", Kayin
 * "Maepalae", Kayin (I'm guessing Mepale?)
 * "Taw-Oak", Kayin
 * "Htiwakalay", Kayin
 * "Hteehuthan", Kayin
 * "Atwin-kwin-kalay", Kayin

Also, apparently the New Democratic Army - Kachin controls Tsawlaw https://asiafoundation.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/Militias-in-Myanmar.pdf the "Sidone" area of Waingmaw https://www.frontiermyanmar.net/en/divide-and-rule-in-kachin-state/ and maybe Hpimaw and Kambaiti (which might be referring to the Pass https://geographic.org/geographic_names/name.php?uni=-614015&fid=687&c=burma) https://www.irrawaddy.com/news/burma/pro-govt-militias-fueling-drugs-crisis-northern-burma-report.htmlIdioticAnarchist (talk) 02:59, 1 June 2024 (UTC)

Mon and PDF Resistance control along the Union Highway
"The Mon State Revolutionary Force and allies have managed to secure control over a section of the Union Highway running from southern Ye Township to Yebyu Township in Tanintharyi Region." https://www.frontiermyanmar.net/en/a-fledgling-mon-resistance-spreads-its-wings/ And PDF https://www.bnionline.net/en/news/intense-battle-junta-over-control-ye-dawei-road IdioticAnarchist (talk) 16:12, 11 June 2024 (UTC)

Map edits (June)
It's the end of the month, therefore it's time to update the map. Cheers y'all!

Nitpicks and suggestions:
 * Mohnyin is not disputed
 * I believe that small villages shouldn't be included on the map because of how minor they are
 * Should the Chin Council and Chin Brotherhood be shown as seperate entities (considering they're kinda enemies and don't like each other)? It can confuse people if, on the map, enemies are shown as the same colour.

Indisputable Edits:
 * AA presence around the Thandwe-Taungup highway (Gawt village captured) https://www.irrawaddy.com/news/burma/arakan-army-less-than-2-km-from-myanmars-thandwe-airport.html https://www.bnionline.net/en/news/battle-thandwes-ma-zin-airports-underway-hotel-residents-trapped-junta-battalions-fight-prevent
 * AA Taungup contested (from the north via Taungup University) https://www.bnionline.net/en/news/aa-launches-offensive-capture-tanungup
 * AA presence around Taungup-Pandaung road https://www.bnionline.net/en/news/aa-ambushes-junta-troops-en-route-taungup
 * AA captured Thandwe Airport https://www.irrawaddy.com/news/war-against-the-junta/aa-seizes-thandwe-airport-near-rakhines-ngapali-beach-local-sources-say.html
 * AA presence around Ngapai Beach https://www.bnionline.net/en/news/fighting-famous-ngapali-beach-aa-army-tries-knock-out-2-last-junta-bases-thandwe
 * CDF-Matupi captured township's district administrative office on the Matupi-Hakha road https://www.irrawaddy.com/news/war-against-the-junta/operation-chin-brotherhood-sees-swift-success-against-myanmar-junta-troops.html
 * CBA captured Matupi and surrounding junta bases https://www.rfa.org/burmese/news/matupi-chin-brotherhood-occupied-06292024125225.html
 * TNLA captured Kyaukme https://www.irrawaddy.com/news/war-against-the-junta/op-1027-update-tnla-captures-seven-myanmar-junta-bases-two-battalion-hqs.html
 * TNLA + PDF captured Naunghkio https://www.irrawaddy.com/news/war-against-the-junta/tnla-seizes-town-and-myanmar-regime-positions-in-northern-shan-state.html
 * TNLA captured Kyatpyin Police Station and entered eastern Mogok (attempting to encircled junta forces in Mogok) https://bur.mizzima.com/2024/06/27/25670
 * TNLA cut off Mongmit https://myanmar-now.org/en/news/military-shells-bombs-kyaukme-as-clashes-continue-in-northern-shan-state-mandalay-region/ https://www.irrawaddy.com/news/war-against-the-junta/op-1027-update-tnla-captures-seven-myanmar-junta-bases-two-battalion-hqs.html
 * PDF attacked Budalin https://bur.mizzima.com/2024/06/29/25807
 * KIA captured Waingmaw-Sadung-Kanpaikti road (captured Sadung) https://www.bnionline.net/en/news/kia-captures-5-military-bases-one-day-sadung-waingmaw-road-declared-junta-free-zone
 * NDA-K control Phimaw (Hpimaw) https://www.irrawaddy.com/news/war-against-the-junta/kia-seizes-three-junta-positions-in-battle-for-myanmar-china-trade-route.html
 * junta control Hsi Hseng https://www.bnionline.net/en/news/junta-column-advances-hsihseng-mongpai-loikaw-intersection-southern-shan-state
 * Junta captured Loikaw-Mobye-Hsi Hseng intersection https://www.bnionline.net/en/news/junta-column-advances-hsihseng-mongpai-loikaw-intersection-southern-shan-state
 * Karenni captured Maesalawng Hill https://www.bnionline.net/en/news/resistance-forces-seize-junta-base-maesalawng-hill
 * KNLA captured Kyaikdon a while ago https://www.irrawaddy.com/news/burma/myanmar-military-commanders-replaced-in-rakhine-mon-and-karen-states-sources.html
 * Mon/Karen/PDF control Ye-Dawei Union Highway https://www.bnionline.net/en/news/junta-prepares-counter-offensive-recapture-gains-made-mon-resistance https://www.frontiermyanmar.net/en/a-fledgling-mon-resistance-spreads-its-wings/ https://www.bnionline.net/en/news/intense-battle-junta-over-control-ye-dawei-road

Disputable Edits:
 * TNLA attacking Hsipaw and (possibly) Momeik https://www.rfa.org/burmese/news/tnla-military-posts-seized-06272024120947.html
 * NDA-K control "Gant Gwan", Lupi, and "Sin Kyaing" https://mmpeacemonitor.org/313251/border-guard-force-scheme/ (Found Lupi on this map, but cannot find the other villages)

Very Disputable Edits: (needs more research or has articles disputing it, but good to note) IdioticAnarchist (talk) 19:16, 30 June 2024 (UTC)
 * DKBA and KNLA de facto control Three Pagodas Pass and Payathonzu https://www.bnionline.net/en/news/chinese-telecom-scammers-expand-operations-three-pagoda-pass https://www.bnionline.net/en/news/knu-consolidates-full-control-over-three-pagodas-pass-payathonzu-area-administration-spite
 * NDA-K control "Sidone" https://www.frontiermyanmar.net/en/divide-and-rule-in-kachin-state/ (old source)
 * NDA-K maybe controls Tsawlaw and Chipwi https://asiafoundation.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/Militias-in-Myanmar.pdf https://mmpeacemonitor.org/313251/border-guard-force-scheme/ (They probably don't and these sources are giving rough estimations of the area they control)


 * What do you mean by small villages? Right now the standard that the base map uses and that I've modified is- township capitals are shown. Smaller villagers are shown if particularly relevant to the specific update (e.g. Chinshwehaw when it was taken, Dotphonenyan when it was taken, etc.); i don't remove those dots but will remove the labelled name to reduce clutter.  EmeraldRange  (talk/contribs) 21:21, 30 June 2024 (UTC)
 * By "small villages" I was specifically talking about Somra and possibly Moe Bye. I just think that the map should only include larger, more important settlements (towns and higher). Of course, that is just my opinion. Also, I was under the impression that Chinshwehaw and Dotphonenyan were towns? Google says they are. IdioticAnarchist (talk) 21:32, 30 June 2024 (UTC)
 * They are but not township capitals. Mobye is a village but it used to be the capital of the relatively large historical Karenni state iirc- It's also three times larger than Pekon, the township capital so tbh I'm always surprised when I remember that it's not even a town, much less having its own township.  EmeraldRange  (talk/contribs) 00:14, 1 July 2024 (UTC)
 * Wow, I did not know any of that! That's good to know! It does seem a bit strange that it isn't "Moebye Township". IdioticAnarchist (talk) 02:06, 1 July 2024 (UTC)
 * So @IdioticAnarchist, looks like @Borysk5 updated the map using Thomas. I will go through it later tonight based on this discussion here and edit it, since there's definitely a lot of unsourced things that Thomas just map-painted (like half of Ann Township falling? No source on that besides a presence Taungup-Pandaung road, which got removed for some reason).
 * My question here is: I agree that Chin Council and Chin Brotherhood should be shown as seperate entities, but there's very little sources on the exact control- some villages reported as one or the other but not much on the frontlines or control outside those villages. I do see what you mean though, random villages like Camp Victoria don't need to be on the map.  EmeraldRange  (talk/contribs) 19:22, 2 July 2024 (UTC)
 * Honestly, I was planning on mentioning that when I woke up, but it appears you beat me to it (I just woke up). Thomas Van Linge, while helpful, can make some...outlandish claims in his maps (usually with no evidence). Like you said with Ann Township, or the supposed "gains" made by the SSPP and the RCSS. I've tried to call him out a few times for this on his Twitter, but he never responds. So, to @Borysk5, while your edits are well-appreciated and in good faith, it's far more constructive to make edits which have credible sources backing them up. If a map change has no source backing it up, don't add it.
 * Anyway, I'm also unsure on the CC and CB, perhaps we can use the "Stakeholders" map on the Chinland page? I think that's kinda the best we got. I can look around for some other maps, but it likely won't lead to much. IdioticAnarchist (talk) 20:00, 2 July 2024 (UTC)
 * Oh, sure. As for Chinland, when you look what names are mentioned for captured of Chin cities, it looks roughly like this. Borysk5 (talk) 20:35, 2 July 2024 (UTC)
 * Could you perhaps send the image in a different way, I cannot see it? IdioticAnarchist (talk) 22:18, 2 July 2024 (UTC)
 * I can use this and WP:AGF that you checked the sources. Thanks!  EmeraldRange  (talk/contribs) 23:21, 2 July 2024 (UTC)
 * I don't know if the source directly states that Hsi Hseng town is under the control of the SAC - it could be referring to the township, and I haven't seen anything else that indicates the town was successfully retaken by the junta.
 * Also, you should put this information on the towns' respective pages so that the detailed map can be updated (please im desperate). CrazyMagicPickle (talk) 20:48, 2 July 2024 (UTC)
 * I've done the update now-
 * The source for Mongmit doesn't say it's cut off. I moved the TNLA frontline to capture areas where the bases mentioned in that article are.
 * Divided Chin into three groups, kept them similar but let me know if you don't like the colours for accessibility etc. I made Arakan's cities a bit darker for that reason.
 * Hsihseng is indeed not taken, the article says they arrived at a junction on the Hsihseng-Loikaw road, so it's actually great junta control in Karenni.  EmeraldRange  (talk/contribs) 03:07, 3 July 2024 (UTC)
 * I, like usual (I'm admittedly quite stubborn), have a few nitpicks:
 * Somra still named on map despite being incredibly small and minor.
 * This is completely my fault, but I added the wrong source for Mongmit. My bad "Resistance fighters have attacked Mandalay’s ruby town of Mogoke, cutting off Momeik (Momgmit)" https://www.irrawaddy.com/opinion/analysis/myanmar-junta-running-out-of-options-in-northern-shan-as-fighting-resumes.html
 * Also, why isn't Mogok shown as contested? TNLA forces have entered the eastern parts of the town? https://bur.mizzima.com/2024/06/27/25670 also there's clashes in the western part https://www.rfa.org/burmese/news/tnla-moekot-seized-07022024041707.html
 * TNLA + PLA control a road in Thabeikkyin Township (not your fault for not adding, considering its new news) https://bur.mizzima.com/2024/07/02/26063
 * Area around Lashio attacked https://bur.mizzima.com/2024/07/03/26182
 * The CNDF is part of the Chin Brotherhood through their political wing, the Chin National Organisation. (I'd suggest using that dark green colour for the CBA for no other reason than that it looks nice).
 * I'd say that the situation shown in Loikaw as shown on Thomas Van Linge's map is more accurate, as the junta is using the Hsihseng-Hteesekhar-Loikaw road to advance and have crossed the Shan-Karenni State border. Also the junta has advanced south of Pinlaung https://myanmar-now.org/en/news/clashes-break-out-between-myanmar-junta-and-karenni-fighters-in-southern-shan-state/
 * I feel as though its best to show the area north of Sadung as captured by KIA forces too, like the Thomas Van Linge map. Sources say that the junta is "effectively cornered in Kanpiketi as the KIA controls the rest of the border trade route." https://www.irrawaddy.com/news/war-against-the-junta/kia-seizes-myanmar-juntas-last-remaining-china-trade-route-in-kachin-state.html Also, the KIA control Laphai, and I'm not sure if that's shown on the map. The NDA-K previously controlled Laphai, so it makes sense to extend their area of control to around there. Also, why'd you get rid of KIA control in Hpare? And where did the KIA control over the Chipwi-Tsawlaw road come from?
 * Also, this may be small, but again its my fault that I forgot to add it, KIA controls between Indawgyi Lake and Hpakant https://kachinnews.com/2024/06/26/kia-topples-junta-camps-between-indawgyi-lake-and-hpakant/
 * This is just a suggestion, and I have no sources backing this up, but it makes sense if the NDA-K control the border from Pangwa-Phimaw.
 * Shouldn't Thandwe be shown as contested?
 * Of course, don't take any of this personally. You did an amazing job on the map (like always), I just nitpick very small things which I don't see as right. Good job on the map! IdioticAnarchist (talk) 04:57, 3 July 2024 (UTC)
 * Fixed see upload on imgur while I wait for some responses
 * Added a bit to Ann Township reflecting a few sources capturing Kazukaing west of Ann https://eng.mizzima.com/2024/06/26/11178
 * Added some PDF growth in Mandaly from sources: https://www.irrawaddy.com/news/war-against-the-junta/scores-of-myanmar-junta-troops-killed-in-3-weeks-of-clashes-in-mandalay-region.html https://myanmar-now.org/en/news/operation-1027-expands-into-sagaing-region-as-pdf-launches-attacks-in-central-myanmar/ https://www.irrawaddy.com/news/burma/myanmar-junta-swift-to-deny-killing-32-civilians-in-pro-military-village.html
 * Mongmit source still not really saying much beyond what I showed in Mogok; but your sources on contested is new- didn't see much on the town before
 * Lashio contested- source mentions Ward 1 in the city
 * It looks like the CNDFs are split or is otherwise unclear from the sources I could look at
 * Kanpiketi is effectively cut off with the road taken so I don't think it means it's encircled, I made Kanpikeit back to junta control
 * Where the hell is Laphai? Is it over in Monhnyin? That's pretty far away for the NDA-K
 * Hpare wasn't in your sources- only on Thomas, I moved that control back and that's where the Chipwi-Tsawlaw came from
 * Thandwe sources have mostly been talking about Ngapali- where Thandwe airport is, not Thandwe proper yet  EmeraldRange  (talk/contribs) 12:11, 3 July 2024 (UTC)
 * It's funny how the map is literally changing as we're talking about updating it https://www.irrawaddy.com/news/war-against-the-junta/myanmars-mndaa-launches-offensive-to-seize-northern-shan-capital.html
 * CNDF, from my research, is one group based in Falam Township, and it is one of the original members of the Chin Brotherhood Alliance https://www.stimson.org/2024/chinland-council-established-in-myanmar/
 * I wouldn't change Kanpikeit to junta, as it is still guarded by the NDA-K Battalion 3. Junta forces are stationed throughout Kachin State Special Region 1 and the Pa-O SAZ, but they aren't shown on the map.
 * Laphai is Northeast of Sadung (as shown in this map as La Hpai) its also on Google Earth.
 * Hpare was in last month's map update, that's why it was originally added to the map. Look at the map from last month, and you'll see Hpare on there. "KIA control over Hpare https://www.globalwitness.org/en/campaigns/natural-resource-governance/fuelling-the-future-poisoning-the-present-myanmars-rare-earth-boom/"
 * Isn't Thandwe Airport in Thandwe city limits? Google Earth shows it as, but then again Earth gets stuff wrong quite often.
 * IdioticAnarchist (talk) 20:20, 3 July 2024 (UTC)
 * Thanks for that! I've pushed the new update out, including Lashio. Expanded NDA-K to include Kanpikeit and gave KIA Hpare- I was confused because Hpare wasn't actually in that KIA blob in last month's map; probably my own oversight.
 * Thandwe Airport isn't in the city limits, Google Earth highlights the township. It's in Ziphyukyun village tract according to the GAD https://themimu.info/sites/themimu.info/files/documents/TspProfiles_GAD_Thandwe_2019_MMR.pdf (page 13).  EmeraldRange  (talk/contribs) 23:19, 3 July 2024 (UTC)
 * The source doesn't seem to state that Kyiakdon was captured - just that a junta outpost was taken. I'm not sure if that's enough to ascribe control of the entire town to the KNLA. CrazyMagicPickle (talk) 05:57, 8 July 2024 (UTC)
 * ''"Junta has also lost control of Kyaikdon Sub-township" IdioticAnarchist (talk) 06:12, 8 July 2024 (UTC)
 * Yeah, that doesnt say the town was taken- lost control of the subtownship could mean many things- looks like this is specifically about enforcing conscription  EmeraldRange  (talk/contribs) 07:22, 8 July 2024 (UTC)

Btw with so many different factions currently on map I wonder if it wouldn't be better to just directly embed faction names on the map like I did in File:War in Central African Republic.svg instead of using legend. Borysk5 (talk) 04:21, 3 July 2024 (UTC)


 * I agree, that kind of key would make it very useful. I can work on adding it, but I also want to update the colours being used- since PDF is usually depicted as red with junta as green within burma; those should really get flipped IMO. Most likely I won't be able to get those making this until next week- so feel free to add a key if you want  EmeraldRange  (talk/contribs) 12:15, 3 July 2024 (UTC)
 * I feel like a key similar to the ones Thomas Van Linge uses (a key at the side listing the different groups and their colours) would be helpful. I don't mean to be rude, the embedding faction names directly onto their territory isn't aesthetically pleasing, and also it doesn't show the full extent of who controls what. That's why I added all the little footnotes on the infobox key. IdioticAnarchist (talk) 19:56, 3 July 2024 (UTC)
 * Agree, I find the names of the combatant groups quite bad looking on the map, I think the best option would be putting a legend inside the map (in a corner of it possibly) but I have no idea how to do it or if it's possible to do it. Wikidoge04 (talk) 01:35, 4 July 2024 (UTC)
 * My main concern is, with so many similar colors trying to find a group on the map especially for people with limited color vision may be challenging. We could do it differently, like having Anne's outside the map and connecting them by lines or smth similar. Borysk5 (talk) 05:49, 4 July 2024 (UTC)
 * I think similar to the CAR map, callout names outside the borders would be good- especially with a few disconnected entities making colour harder to use  EmeraldRange  (talk/contribs) 12:25, 4 July 2024 (UTC)
 * Maybe we could, instead of putting names over the EAO's, put numbers. Then we can have a key at the bottom saying what number is what entity. IdioticAnarchist (talk) 19:37, 4 July 2024 (UTC)

UWSA and SSA-N moving to stop rebel advance on Laisho
As of now, these two armed groups are not allied the junta, but are moving to contain the MNDAA and the TNLA, with their claimed motives to protect their sphere of influence and to protect civilians.

https://apnews.com/article/myanmar-conflict-wa-shan-militia-lashio-kokang-c3d35e0dc24b04fbb960f1afd3084af5 LordOfWalruses (talk) 15:45, 15 July 2024 (UTC)