Talk:Mythomania

early comments

 * It needs addition, but it seems to me that it also may be slightly incorrect. A mythomaniac may lie for his own benefit and still get the diagnosis.--Lindorm 18:50, 19 July 2006 (UTC)

I have removed the redirect from Pseudologia fantastica from here, as I have now expanded the Pseudologia article in its own right - I link to this page however.Grahbudd 10:29, 18 November 2006 (UTC)

Copied from pathological liar
what is someone who make one little lie, and then makes thousands more to cover up that one?? and then constantly lies, basically waht is the DEFINITION of a compulsive liar? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 68.74.155.231 (talk • contribs) 06:44, September 5, 2005 (UTC)

Acting
I know many people percieve acting as just a form of lying, but it is not. Since the audience knows that a play or movie is not real, it is not a lie, it is pretend. A reality show like the one cited in this article is different and neither Hagen nor Olivier would probably call that proper acting. The bit comparing acting and pathological lying should probably be either be removed or elaborated upon. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 12.176.81.65 (talk • contribs) 04:52, September 26, 2005 (UTC)

That Link
The link to "liar" at the beginning of the article should probably be changed to "lie", but since I've never messed with wiki and someone else might think a disambiguation or further article would be a better idea, I'll just leave this comment for now.

Why change it? Because the only "liar" page is one about a band called Liar, whereas lie is the most relevant article of which I'm aware. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 71.67.131.17 (talk • contribs) 16:19, January 9, 2006 (UTC)

Weasel words
Weasel words should be avoided. A copy of this article with weasel terms bolded is shown below.

A pathological liar is someone who often embellishes his or her stories in a way that he or she believes will impress people. Some think a pathological liar is different from a normal liar in that a pathological liar believes the lie he or she is telling to be true—at least in public—and is "playing" the role. It is not clear, however, that this is the case, and others hold that pathological liars know precisely what they are doing. Making up stories and at the same time believing them is known as confabulation. The term "pathological liar" is not an official clinical diagnosis however most psychiatrists agree that pathological lying is often the result of a mental disorder or low self-esteem.

Which people specifically believe this? Invitatious 15:39, 8 June 2006 (UTC)

Wow virtually every sentenced in this article starts with weasel words. Just a comment SirCollin —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 24.147.103.62 (talk • contribs) 02:07, 13 Jul 2006 (UTC)

Totally redone
I've redone the entire page. All of the weasel words have been removed. I may have mis-spelled some words. Tiny.ian 00:13, 4 October 2006 (UTC)

Red Link
The last sentence says:

"A good example of a pathological liar is Vittorio Mamon."

But it's red link.

This leads me to believe that Vittorio is not such a great example, because if he was he would be very well known and/or would at least have his own article. Please change Vittorio Mamon to someone more identifiable.

...Additionally, Google searching indicates that "Vittorio Mamon" is a name that has popped up and been disposed of from a number of other Wikipedia articles (including his own page), which might indicate this is simply spurious information in the form of Wiki vandalism?

correction of self-esteem vs. self-worth
The sentence that reads "...pathological lying is often the result of a mental disorder or low self-esteem." I believe that this sentence mistakenly uses the word "self-esteem" when the correct word should be "self-worth". These two words are frequently misused by reversing them, but they are not the same at all. Let me give a brief definition. Self-esteem is the conditional love of ourselves or ego-strength, based on externally validated temporary sources. Self-worth is the unconditional love of ourselves, based on internally validated permanent sources.

It is more likely that people who pathologically lie, do so because they have low self-worth, not low self-esteem. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Brewhaha@edmc.net (talk • contribs)

Page Protection Needed
This article, which is constantly getting vandalized by people who want to take potshots at others whom they don't like, needs protection or at least semi-protection. Doczilla 05:47, 11 October 2007 (UTC)

Incorrect Statement
"Even though pathological lying is not recognized as a clinical disorder"

Actually pathological lying is recognised as a clinical disorder. It comes under the Chapter on Factitious Disorders in the DSM and includes 301.51, (with physical symptoms), 300.16 (with psychological symptoms), and 300.19 (NOS).

other helpful URL's for reference might be Wikipedia DSM codes Alphabetical Wikipedia DSM codes

300.19 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 124.183.220.186 (talk) 22:36, 4 December 2007 (UTC)


 * No no no. Factitious disorder includes a lot of lying but is not itself pathological lying. Analogy: A chimpanzee's body includes chimp ears, but a chimpanzee is not an ear. Doczilla (talk) 08:12, 5 December 2007 (UTC)

Well since you want to talk in object orientated analogies Doczilla, chimpanzee is to ape as pathological lying is to Factitious Disorder, or perhaps all apes have ears but not all apes are chimpanzee's, as all Factitous Disorders have lies, but not all Factitious Disorders are pathological lies....... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 124.183.220.186 (talk) 12:32, 7 December 2007 (UTC)


 * No. Pathological lying is not a kind of factitious disorder. It is one behavior among many shown as part of factitious disorder. It is a piece of factitious disorder, not a form of it. Doczilla (talk) 02:32, 8 December 2007 (UTC)

Your arguments lack sense, is a peice of cake not a form of cake, Dictionary definitions.... Factitious - Produced artificially - Lacking authenticity or genuineness - 1646, from L. factitius "artificial," Disorder - A disturbance or derangement that affects the function of mind or body, such as an eating disorder or the abuse of a drug. Thereby one can presume that a Factitious Disorder must involve the telling of non truths or made up things, therefore any form of lying must be some kind of Factitious Disorder,

now stay with me here Doczilla,

Pathological - caused by or evidencing a mentally disturbed condition; "a pathological liar", "a pathological urge to succeed"

"pathological lying is not recognized as a clinical disorder" quite simply is an incorrect statement, it can be clinically diagnosed by doctor, or a psycologist using the definitions in the DSM as shown above. You might as well argue that 200 fairies can dance on the head of a pin as bring chimpanzee's ears into the discussion, neither make any sense and only work to distract from the discussion. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 124.183.220.186 (talk • contribs)


 * A dictionary definition of factitious is irrelevant because that's not the source we're talking about. You started this section with a claim about what was recognized as a clinical disorder, and you pulled out the DSM's factitious disorder. Without citing specifically where the DSM says pathological lying is a form of factitious disorder, this is a pointless discussion. The definition of factitious disorder specifically requires that they are faking illness. They're lying about illness. Lying in general is irrelevant if they are not persistently lying about being sick. The defining quality is obsessively wanting medical attention and faking illness and injury to get it. Factious disorder can include the symptom of pathological lying. That does not make pathological lying in and of itself a clinical disorder. Sneezing is a symptom of many diseases. That does not make sneezing in and of itself a disease. Doczilla (talk) 08:12, 9 December 2007 (UTC)

Does it bother anyone else that the linked text is from 1915? Is there nothing more current? BTW, the above argument is silly. Doczilla is clearly right and our anonymous friend is clearly wrong. No manner or frequency of lying about non-medical issues would meet the criteria for factitious disorder, so most compulsive liars would not qualify for the diagnosis. Tpagester (talk) 16:41, 22 December 2007 (UTC)tpagester

I do not agree with part of the first line of this article: "Mythomania is a condition involving compulsive lying by a person with no obvious motivation." I do not agree that a person has to have no obvious motivation to be a pathological/compulsive liar. I have known several pathological liars over the last decade and every one of them had a motive or motivation to do so. One lied for money and the other lied to gain friends and to have people feel so endeared to him that they would be willing to do just about anything for him--even give him a free place to live. He would tell one person he was a medical student and tell another that he was down and out and had no money to go to school. He'd tell one person (usually a female) that he was Italian and tell another person he was Spanish, etc. While some chronic liars might do so just because, or for reason they are unaware of, there are many chronic liars who have a purpose for lying as a way of life. In most cases, the lying is intended to affect others in a specific way and cause a specific outcome that is positive for the chronic/practiced liar. I feel the definition in the first line needs to be changed. Thanks.67.142.130.14 (talk) 19:41, 15 June 2008 (UTC)