Talk:Name of the Czech Republic

Bad revisions recently.
We've already discussed this many times before... but please... stop synthesizing WP:primary sources (which are not good sources to use) without reliable journalistic secondary sources.(WP:RELIABLE) That is WP:ORIGINALRESEARCH and is not acceptable. Also, we should keep the section Adoption of Czechia centered around reliably sourced information pertaining to governmental usage, not corporations. That's the bulk of the section, anyway. And anymore focus on the singular entities that "use the name" is blatantly against WP:UNDUE. We don't need a list of that. See also WP:WHATWIKIPEDIAISNOT. - R9tgokunks   ⭕  06:45, 17 September 2019 (UTC)
 * Google maps were relevant for good secondary sources describing the progress (you deleted), so your evaluations like "only goverment is important" are just your POV. One sentence about huge corporations is completely OK when sourced well. Chrzwzcz (talk) 16:28, 17 September 2019 (UTC)
 * Also: Google maps survived your previous improvements so why is it bad now, all of a sudden? Chrzwzcz (talk) 21:59, 17 September 2019 (UTC)
 * I've already discussed it before, as have other users. It's WP:undue. this section is on governmental usage. gauging company usage verges on WP:WHAT WIKIPEDIA IS NOT. This is why WP:UNDUE exists. It doesn't fit in the section. - R9tgokunks   ⭕  01:03, 29 December 2019 (UTC)
 * Your opinion against others. Well souced, interesting enough for secondary sources so... stop pushing your opinion as decisive. Chrzwzcz (talk) 10:04, 29 December 2019 (UTC)

Name change
English Wikipedia don't use Czechia as normal geographical name of CZ. It still uses Czech Republic. Comparison: Czechia -> Slovakia. It already need to be changed. Outdated. This is suggestion. 178.255.168.41 (talk) 16:04, 2 February 2022 (UTC)
 * We will change it when actual English language usage changes. As English language usage is still Czech Republic, it is demonstrably not outdated. --User:Khajidha (talk) (contributions) 17:54, 2 February 2022 (UTC)
 * Are English speakers really always using the long form? Nobody says e.g. "I am travelling to the French Republic" (even if the official name of the country is "République française"). Long forms are mostly used in treaties and such official documents. I Sweden (where I come from) the official long form for Tjeckien strangely enough is Republiken Tjeckien and not Tjeckiska republiken (so the adjective form is almost never used). Why is this such a big and eternal problem in English, but not in most other languages (se list above)? --Andhanq (talk) 15:10, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
 * Different languages do different things at different paces. For example, Swedish apparently still calls Beijing Peking 40 years on and refers to Kyiv as Kiev 30 years on. It's not up to Wikipedia to engineer language change in English, Swedish, or any other language. Doremo (talk) 15:25, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
 * Easy. Czechs does not speak Swedish, so they let Swedes decide. But Czechs think they know English and in past lost their (our) chance to promote one clear name. Results? Czechoslovakia, Czechland, Bohemia, Czech R., Czech Republic, Czecho and Czechia... We will see what future brings. BTW in Czech it is and will be Peking. Why to change. It is different topic than long name short name. Chrz (talk) 16:22, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
 * Maybe, maybe yes, maybe no, maybe it's Czechomoravia.--Pavel Fric (talk) 08:02, 3 January 2023 (UTC)
 * Yes, we really do say "I am traveling to the Czech Republic." There aren't many countries where we use the long form like this, but this is one. Why do you assume that English using this name is a problem? I would never think to tell Swedes how to speak their language, why do you feel the right to tell me how to speak mine? To me THAT is a problem. --User:Khajidha (talk) (contributions) 16:29, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
 * Czechs DID tell "Czech Republic" you and now you think that was your own idea :) Now Czechs say like "maybe use Czechia too" and you are like "nah, my language, go away". English is most spoken language in the world, most widely learned second languag, so it matters for Swedes, Czechs and others, duh, big surprise :) Chrz (talk) 16:45, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
 * Czechs named their country the Czech Republic, and English decided to adopt it. The important part there is not the Czech naming, but the English adoption. You accept the English language community's choice to adopt Czech Republic but you reject its choice not to adopt Czechia. If I were learning a second language, I wouldn't care whether that language called my country an exact translation of my own name for it or came up with an entirely new word with no relation to my own name for it. I would simply learn and use it just as I would any other word. So, no, I can't see why this matters to Swedes, Czechs, etc. --User:Khajidha (talk) (contributions) 16:57, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
 * Bad example. The issue is not "close - exact translation" or not. The issue is unnecessary long name for all purposes, eg. in sports it sticks like a sore thumb. So Abedefghland would be OK name for the country ;) but Great Abecedefghan Socialist Republic would not. Chrz (talk) 17:07, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
 * It only sticks out if you expect all country names in a language to follow a pattern. Looks perfectly normal to me.
 * If you are wondering: No you won't see "Czechia" on 2022 olympic games. But it is expected to be the last olympic games for "the Czech Republic", the deal is almost done. But you WILL see Czechia on 2022 IIHF World Championship because Czechs and other do have every right to tell you under what name they want to be registered and compete, and English happened to be the registering language, shock. Chrz (talk) 16:50, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
 * And? Usage by a particular sports organization is bound by the rules of that organization. General English usage isn't. --User:Khajidha (talk) (contributions) 16:59, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
 * And there you have it. "Loophole" though which languages do affect how they want to be called in English, we will see how big loophole and if usage in sports speeds up Czechia adoption. Chrz (talk) 17:09, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
 * Taiwan calls itself the Republic of China and competes at the Olympics as Chinese Taipei. Neither has much affect on general English usage. --User:Khajidha (talk) (contributions) 17:47, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
 * Taiwan is a whole different deal, not being officially recognized, Chinese influence and all... Not the case here. We will see. Chrz (talk) 18:52, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
 * If and when it happens, then it happens. But all the "you should do it this way"s and "why hasn't this happened yet"s aren't helping. --User:Khajidha (talk) (contributions) 19:00, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
 * What does not help? Condescending messages like: Do not care what "my" language uses because I don't care for your language either. Czechia has made it into English language., so... there. Is it the primary term for the country (in general)? It is not. It it the only thing to consider - frequency? Major, but not the definitive one, hence occasional RMs. Each RM more promising (for Czechia) than the last one, I don't know how many iterations will it take, how quickly can newer and newer sources help. The RM moratorium expires on August, I would advice against opening the new one ASAP. But it would be a nice gift for Czech Republic's 30th birthday (1/1/2023): to lose its name :D Chrz (talk) 20:45, 3 February 2022 (UTC)
 * A gift awaits you in the article.--Pavel Fric (talk) 08:17, 3 January 2023 (UTC)

Product placement/bias?
I have nothing against saying that Google, Apple, and Microsoft have adopted Czechia for their respective map applications, as I think this is significant in terms of the adoption of the name. However, the second to last paragraph of the English-language section mentions Google and Apple by name only and then goes on to solely talk about Microsoft products.

I have copied the paragraph as it is currently written below.

"Multinational technology companies that adopted the name Czechia include Google,[48] Apple,[49] and Microsoft with Bing Maps.[50] The business network LinkedIn updated its locations to Czechia in October 2020.[51] Microsoft updated its Microsoft Dynamics 365 Business Central to Czechia in January 2021.[52]" 84.65.9.65 (talk) 19:16, 14 April 2022 (UTC)


 * Agreed, removed it. Dan Palraz (talk) 22:31, 27 October 2023 (UTC)

Quality of the article from ‘The Atlantic’
The sentence ‘However, most English speakers use [the] Czech Republic in all contexts.’ is sourced from the article Scandal in Czechia. I don't find it so quality and up to date to figure as a source here. The article comes from 2016 but describes the situation until the year 2008 (so the data are more than 10 years old). The described situation could have changed. The article has also another big problem. The author did not describe the idea of a short name quite well. (Short name does not mean that it is a one-word name.) I'm not going to evaluate the letter-counting part. Because of described reasons, I don't think it is a good idea to link it as a reliable source here. The sentence that is sourced from this article should be rewritten or deleted. --Martin Tauchman (talk) 15:12, 16 May 2022 (UTC) PS: Let me ping who has added the reference. --Martin Tauchman (talk) 08:30, 22 May 2022 (UTC)
 * It's certainly still accurate based on usage patterns, and it is a reliable source. If you find an article that claims most English speakers use Czechia, you're welcome to cite it. Doremo (talk) 15:37, 22 May 2022 (UTC)
 * Would not be better to use the Google N-Gram as a reference? Since the concept of short country names is described wrongly. Martin Tauchman (talk) 20:46, 4 June 2022 (UTC)

LinkedIn Citation
Not sure if this pointed to a different URL at one point but I have no idea if there's a quick / easy way to find out.

DarklitShadow (talk) 23:15, 28 January 2023 (UTC)