Talk:Naomi Klein/Archive 2

Criticisms?
Where is the criticisms section? Ive read a huge amount of criticism about Klein from left and right, isnt it usually wikipedia policy to have criticism sections on a popular thinker like this? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 89.126.25.46 (talk) 22:12, 9 September 2011 (UTC)


 * Good question! A criticism section is sorely missing. Another thing, I think that there are too many quotes from reviews of her books - The Shock Doctrine has its own detailed article where they belong. Who will pick up the glove and fix the article? Bazuz (talk) 13:16, 30 September 2011 (UTC)


 * It is kinda hard to criticize a person. :-) Her books have their own section. I guess something could be made out of those? You can pick up the glove. :) --OpenFuture (talk) 14:17, 30 September 2011 (UTC)


 * Point taken :) What I meant, of course, is criticism of her theories and philosophy, not her as a person. Bazuz (talk) 00:05, 1 October 2011 (UTC)


 * She doesn't have much of that. Her books are just a collection of seemingly any sort of anti-capitalist argument she can find. There isn't much coherent philosophy as a base. So a summary of criticism against the books could work, if you can make one that isn't WP:SYN. --OpenFuture (talk) 04:04, 1 October 2011 (UTC)


 * She said Bush was going to refuse to give up the presidency and institute a dictatorship. That's kind of a hyperbolic prediction. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Snookumz (talk • contribs) 14:00, 28 August 2012 (UTC)


 * Yes, this article needs a "Criticism" section to keep it "NPOV". But, if a "Criticism" is added to the article on, say, Ayn Rand or Milton Friedman, that violates "NPOV".  The pro-capitalist meta-POV of the Wikipedia geeks can be a source of high hilarity sometimes...108.17.71.242 (talk) 01:41, 21 September 2014 (UTC)

As Wall Street loving Republican, I enjoyed hearing her speak. She was entertaining with an opinion on everything. However, she does seem to be a bigot towards hedge fund managers who are "35 and earning 100 times more than a brain surgeon." Should people be judged (or applauded) for how much money they make,... or should they be judged instead by how they use what they have, regardless of their income? Klien asserts that these very high income earners are able to do so due to greed, hubris, and overconfidence. Does every consumer who bought more house than they could afford (or who charged more debt on their credit cards than they could afford) also not act out of greed, hubris, and overconfidence? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 208.90.11.207 (talk) 04:51, 9 November 2012 (UTC)


 * I understood that Wikipedia is moving away from criticism sections? fishhead64 (talk) 06:23, 2 January 2015 (UTC)

External links modified
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I have just added archive links to 4 one external links on Naomi Klein. Please take a moment to review my edit. If necessary, add after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/20150428050703/https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hA736oK9FPg/ to https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hA736oK9FPg/
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/20130604182746/http://www.collectionscanada.gc.ca/women/002026-704-e.html to http://www.collectionscanada.gc.ca/women/002026-704-e.html
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 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/20081020111515/http://www.randomhouse.ca:80/author/results.pperl?authorid=15909 to http://www.randomhouse.ca/author/results.pperl?authorid=15909

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Links
I suggest to add This Changes Everything (2015 film) in the list of works, to add the template Template:Naomi Klein with the other navigation boxes at the bottom of the page and to add the "Category:Naomi Klein" in the relevant section. Thank you. Charlotte Yiley (talk) 09:15, 26 August 2016 (UTC).
 * Done. Pisobe Solela (talk) 12:53, 27 August 2016 (UTC).

Sourcing?
User:Gab4gab what refs do you find unreliable? I took a quick scan and so no major problems, but perhaps i missed something. This particular global tag is generally unhelpful btw. Jytdog (talk) 16:39, 10 August 2017 (UTC)
 * I've adjusted the tag. It's interesting what different editors feel is helpful and important. Quickly scanning I found it interesting that so few of the citations were to what had been written about the subject. Gab4gab (talk) 18:11, 10 August 2017 (UTC)
 * fixed the imdb issues. tags are super helpful but not when they are that nonspecific. when you say "what had been written about the subject" are you saying that there are too many primary sources and not enough secondary? if so then then template:third party tag would be appropriate.  Jytdog (talk) 18:15, 10 August 2017 (UTC)
 * I tag things as I find then and follow up as I have time. We all work at our own speed. (And I make mistakes now and then) Thanks for chasing things down Yytdog. Gab4gab (talk) 18:26, 10 August 2017 (UTC)

Grandfather worked to Walt Disney
It was said on Desert Island Discs today (Friday December 1 2017) that Klein had a grandfather who worked for Walt Disney, drawing cartoons. This could go in the section on Klein's family. Vorbee (talk) 09:19, 1 December 2017 (UTC)

External links modified
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 * Corrected formatting/usage for https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hA736oK9FPg%2F
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 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20090122050446/http://www.commondreams.org/views/092300-103.htm to http://www.commondreams.org/views/092300-103.htm
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20080110090803/http://www.nplusonemag.com/klein.html to http://www.nplusonemag.com/klein.html
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20090330150629/http://www.counterpunch.org/cockburn09222007.html to http://www.counterpunch.org/cockburn09222007.html
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 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20090930160551/http://www.prospectmagazine.co.uk/2008/07/intellectualstheresults/ to http://www.prospectmagazine.co.uk/2008/07/intellectualstheresults/

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Lede needs expanding.
I notice the lede section is only 2 paragraphs long, and it's rather dry and dusty. ("Encyclopedic" does NOT mean dead and boring.) Suggest writing about her as a professional person,  NOT just a list  of her accomplishments. For example, what she cares about, her writing style, what she does besides making money, her news making, who she writes for, etc. (This is not "personal life" stuff, this is "whole professional" stuff that your typical Dr. Joe Smith does not have.)

Here's a juicy, if fawning blurb on some of that: https://medium.com/intellectual-property-and-climate-change-book/stay-brave-this-changes-everything-2014-by-naomi-klein-b996c7a4db4  " In her literary style, Naomi Klein is a writer of sweet reason and cool logic. "   ".... has great intellectual curiosity. She ranges far and wide, in terms of her subject matter, and the geographic spread of her investigations...." ...much more there, and all over the web. Cheers! --2602:306:CFCE:1EE0:46C:990E:60AA:8D90 (talk) 19:26, 10 May 2018 (UTC)Doug Bashford

us-american citizenship
could someone add the fact that Klein is holding a dual citizenship (canadian and us-american), please. to my knowledge, she applyied for the american passport in 2011, as she states in her new book On Fire: The (Burning) Case for a Green New Deal. Unfortunatley, I only have the German version of the book available, there she states on pages 191 to 193 that she was eligible to hold an american passport due to her parent's nationality who emigrated to Canada to avoid personal involvement in the Vietnam war. It would be great if someone, who has the English version of her book available, could add this information. Thanks in advance, --LH7605 (talk) 12:04, 5 February 2020 (UTC)

"Far left" label in Views section
An editor has added to the Views section an assertion that Klein is "far left" without further information. I deleted it with the claim that it needed stronger sourcing. It was re-added with a third source, also not adequate IMO. According to our far left article, "The definition of the far-left has varies in the literature and there is not a general agreement on what it entails or consensus on the core characteristics that constitute the far-left, other than being to the left of "the left". Since according to one definition violent overthrow is acceptable and sometimes advocated, I am going to again delete this statement since it would violate BLP guidelines.  Please discuss.  Gandydancer (talk) 15:48, 25 September 2020 (UTC)
 * You were right to delete those additions, as they were clearly WP:UNDUE and WP:OR. Better sources would be needed in order to assert her position is "far-left", which would mean to the left of social democracy, which seems to me to be right where she is on the political spectrum as far as I can tell. At least two of those sources are basically for American audiences, and for most Americans anything to the left of the Democratic Party could be construed as "far-left", even though this flies in the face of what much of the rest of the world deems to be far-left. In her writings, such as This Changes Everything (2014), she has come out against Marxism and the communist states of the 20th century, and she also does not advocate for any kind of revolution to topple capitalism. The quip about The Intercept, "She has been a correspondent for lefty The Intercept", is absolutely inappropriate and outright OR.--C.J. Griffin (talk) 16:17, 25 September 2020 (UTC)

How about Naomi considers herself far left. Per: ”Naomi Klein exclusive: The right is right on climate. Conservatives say the climate change movement is about pushing far-left ideas. So does Naomi Klein.” (title in 2014, still on MSNBC search and so it the content)

http://www.msnbc.com/all-in/watch/klein-exclusive--right-is-right-on-climate-330499139998

Kacziey (talk) 16:36, 25 September 2020 (UTC)
 * This doesn't really mean anything. It is just a caption underneath the video. If you watch the video, Hayes describes her as a "liberal author" and talks of "lefty ideas". He doesn't say anything about Klein being "far-left". Again, poor quality source for such an assertion. One could just as easily use it to brand her as a "liberal".--C.J. Griffin (talk) 16:49, 25 September 2020 (UTC)

Dear CJ, can you at least agree that MSNBC considers her far left. Hence: According to MSNBC Naomi is far-left, or for far left ideas?Kacziey (talk) 17:49, 25 September 2020 (UTC)