Talk:Nathan Larson (criminal)

Requested move 28 April 2023

 * The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: Not moved. (non-admin closure) Silikonz 💬  13:45, 5 May 2023 (UTC)

Nathan Larson (criminal) → Nathan Daniel Larson – middle name is a WP:NATDAB so there isn't any need to haggle over what label to emphasize in a parenthesis LichCake (talk) 06:19, 28 April 2023 (UTC)
 * Comment: As far as I can tell, sources do not generally include his middle name as part of his WP:COMMONNAME. The middle name only seems to be included in very formal settings. In the list of cited sources, his middle name appears in the titles only for formal court proceedings. Unfortunately, I don't have a much better suggestion. —⁠ ⁠BarrelProof (talk) 09:44, 28 April 2023 (UTC)
 * Per WP:MIDDLENAME: Adding given names, or their abbreviations, merely for disambiguation purposes (if that format of the name is used to refer to the person) is not advised. —⁠ ⁠BarrelProof (talk) 11:15, 28 April 2023 (UTC)
 * OpposeAs per above do not generally include his middle name as part of his WP:COMMONNAME. The middle name only seems to be included in very formal settings. In the list of cited sources, his middle name appears in the titles only for formal court proceedings.Pharaoh of the Wizards (talk) 10:20, 28 April 2023 (UTC)
 * NBC uses the full name in https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/alleged-pedophile-white-supremacist-arrested-kidnapping-12-yr-old-girl-n1251832 as does https://www.cnn.com/2020/12/20/us/virginia-kidnapping-12-year-old-fresno-denver/index.html for CNN. LichCake (talk) 00:08, 29 April 2023 (UTC)
 * Although the NBC article contains the full name for the sake of completeness of identification and reporting of exact details, they don't use it as his common name. The sub-heading just has "Nathan Larson", and so does the photo caption. The middle name appears only once in the article, while the shorter version without it is used twice. Similarly, the middle name appears only once in the CNN article (plus once in the caption of the mug shot) – in the rest of that article he's just "Larson". Also, at that point the news they were reporting was very fresh. They may not have known much more than what they were given by the police department. —⁠ ⁠BarrelProof (talk) 01:48, 29 April 2023 (UTC)
 * Oppose per WP:MIDDLENAME. -- Necrothesp (talk) 12:29, 2 May 2023 (UTC)
 * Oppose sources don't use his middle name. Wes sideman (talk) 11:13, 5 May 2023 (UTC)

Image
There's room for debate on whether to use a mugshot or a professional polished photo that makes him look like an officeholder. Per MOS:PERTINENCE, "Images must be relevant in the topic's context" - I don't think a faux-politician photo is relevant, as his actual political career was virtually non-existent. His criminal activities were what made him notable, so personally, I would go with the mugshot, although others may disagree. Wes sideman (talk) 17:37, 6 November 2023 (UTC)
 * +1 on that. The political photo is 15 years old now, and now features further down the page. So IMO, the more recent pic is more appropriate - A l is o n  talk 18:18, 6 November 2023 (UTC)


 * Most generally reliable sources portray Larson in suit and tie:
 * https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/virginia-politics/he-threatened-to-kill-the-president-now-he-is-seeking-public-office/2017/03/08/ec31f768-0381-11e7-b9fa-ed727b644a0b_story.html
 * https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/local/wp/2018/06/01/hes-pro-incest-pedophilia-and-rape-hes-also-running-for-congress-from-his-parents-house/
 * https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2018/06/01/pedophile-white-supremacist-congressional-candidate/663215002/
 * https://news.yahoo.com/37-old-virginia-congressional-candidate-131356264.html
 * https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/nathan-larson-candidate/
 * https://www.cbsnews.com/colorado/news/nathan-larson-denver-airport-pedophilia/ (suit and tie + mugshot)
 * https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/beezlebub-on-the-ballot-nathan-larson-and-the-scary-guys-running-for-congress/2018/06/04/90f1d892-6806-11e8-9e38-24e693b38637_story.html
 * Tabloids and generally unreliable sources will tend more to portray him with the mugshot:
 * https://www.thedailybeast.com/pro-pedophilia-white-supremacist-nathan-larson-forced-girl-to-wear-a-disguise-as-he-kidnapped-her-cops-say
 * https://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/world-news/creep-who-wanted-legalise-child-28270302
 * https://www.insider.com/white-supremacist-discord-kik-alleged-kidnapping-indictment-nathan-larson-2021-2
 * https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9074865/White-supremacist-pedophile-kidnaps-12-year-old-girl-California-home-arrested-flight.html
 * Local and indie news outlets are more mixed. Sometimes they go only with the mugshot, sometimes they use both pictures, a few times only the suit and tie:
 * https://www.fauquier.com/news/article_40ddeba0-4244-11eb-97c5-eb9db5c56fe9.html
 * https://www.nbc12.com/2021/02/17/va-man-appear-court-child-abduction-charges
 * https://wjla.com/news/local/ex-va-congressional-candidate-nathan-larson-abduction-discord-fresno-child
 * https://abc30.com/nathan-larson-child-sex-crime-predator-fresno/10332383/
 * https://www.fresnobee.com/news/local/article267429022.html
 * https://www.princewilliamtimes.com/news/politics/update-delegate-candidate-convicted-in-2009-of-threatening-to-kill-the-president/article_dc76ed39-96d0-58e7-9e88-fa41afc3ef5d.html
 * https://www.kiro7.com/news/trending/extremely-disturbing-virginia-man-accused-abducting-12-year-old-california-girl/O2F2J4HBYNDD5F3IBH73YBMILE/
 * https://bakersfieldnow.com/newsletter-daily/man-in-custody-accused-of-kidnapping-12-year-old-fresno-girl
 * https://kmph.com/news/local/white-supremacist-ex-politician-accused-fresno-child-kidnapper-dies-in-custody-supremecy-pedophile-social-media-president-threat-homeland-security-pornography
 * Most results from WP refs portray him with both the mugshot and the suit and tie (not all sources that show up there are reliable, though). Since there doesn't seem to be a specific guideline about what image is best for using in a BLP infobox, I say we stick to the reliable sources that stood scrutiny over the years in Wikipedia and use the most formal picture. SparklyNights 18:50, 6 November 2023 (UTC)
 * Generally speaking, the practice is to go with the most recent photograph that meets licensing requirements, and/or the photograph that is most relevant to the subject's notability. His notability is because he is a criminal, not because he looks snappy in a suit. The suit photo was uploaded by one of Larson's Wikipedia sockpuppets; in other words, it's the image by which Larson chose to be viewed by Wikipedia readers. I'd leave things as-is, or remove the suit photo. Most of the articles that show a suit photo were written several years before his kidnapping charges, and most of those outlets (if they had written an article about him at all) would have used the mugshot photo.  Risker (talk) 20:23, 6 November 2023 (UTC)