Talk:Nekromantix/Archive 1

Band name
Is it really called the Nekromantix? Most people I know refer to them as Nekromantix only. --67.83.48.21 02:43, 30 November 2005 (UTC)


 * Just Nekromantix. --68.190.244.195 04:02, 22 February 2006 (UTC)


 * Has the name Nekromantik actually got something to do with corpse divination, nekromantia in Greek? --62.47.56.127 15:51, 24 May 2007 (UTC)


 * Well of course it does. It's a combination of "necromancy" and "romantics." There is no "the" in the band name, though it is implied, similar to the Ramones. So, say, if you were to write it in a sentence, you wouldn't capitalize "the" as it isn't part of the name (unless it was the first word in the sentence of course). --IllaZilla 02:27, 22 July 2007 (UTC)

Influences & style
Why no discussion of there influences, nor how much they reference horror. --24.111.164.187 18:02, 29 June 2006 (UTC)


 * I'm working on improving the article, including a section for "style" that will include those elements. Check back another time, it'll be there soon. --IllaZilla 02:27, 22 July 2007 (UTC)

Peek
Anybody know the real name of Peek, the band's original drummer? I was able to find most of the other members' real names in the album credits & added them to the article but I couldn't find his. I don't have the first album so I don't know if he's named in it, but if anyone could provide some source for his name it would help improve the article. Likewise for Tröy Deströy and Andy DeMize. --IllaZilla 05:21, 23 July 2007 (UTC)


 * Peek's real first name is Sebastian and he is not interested in anybody knowing his last name.KimNekroman 05:21, 23 July 2007 (UTC)

Well whether he is interested or not, it would improve the articles by making them more iinformative and accurate. I was hoping that someone could provide a source so it could be referenced. --IllaZilla 19:11, 10 August 2007 (UTC)


 * I'm probably one of the only ones knowing his last name, I respect his wishes and wont tell you. KimNekroman 05:46, 23 July 2007 (UTC)

That's fine, no harm in asking. Just trying to improve the article. --IllaZilla 19:58, 10 August 2007 (UTC)

Photo
We need a photo for the infobox. I haven't had much luck providing photos for band articles, as other editors/admins don't seem to think that fair use justifies using promotional images and any uncopyrighted photo I find on the internet & put in commons just winds up getting deleted later. So if anyone else who is better at getting images approved could provide one, that'd be great. --IllaZilla 15:58, 26 July 2007 (UTC)


 * There are plenty of great photo's on their Label Hellcat Records/Epitaph Records for download. There are also updated photos on the bands myspace page. --KimNekroman 16:05, 26 July 2007 (UTC)

That is true, however those photos are copyrighted and Wikipedia does not allow the use of copyrighted images if they can reasonably be replaced by a free one. Since it would be fairly easy to take an uncopyrighted live photograph of a band, copyrighted photos in band articles are generally not allowed. --IllaZilla 19:09, 10 August 2007 (UTC)


 * There is a reason for the label to have a "press picture" section....there are there for the same purpose. As for using pictures in general you just remember to credit photographer. --KimNekroman 16:17, 26 July 2007 (UTC)

I realize that the press photos are there for others to use. However, Wikipedia is not press, it's an encyclopedia, and has strict guidelines on the use of non-free content in articles. Basically although I'd like to put in a picture from the band's press releases, it would just get deleted by an administrator. Believe me, I've had it happen to me in other articles. Since press photos are copyrighted, Wikipedia policies place restrictions on their use. One of those restrictions is that the image can't be used if it could be resonably replaced by a free (not subject to coypright) image that shows the same thing. So since it would be pretty easy to take an uncopyrighted photo of the Nekromantix in concert and upload it to Wikimedia Commons so it could be used in various Wikiprojects, Wikipedia admins won't allow us to use a copyrighted press photo. Believe me, if I had the opportunity to take my own picture of the band and put it on here, I would. But since I don't, I'm asking if anybody else has a free picture that they took that they would be willing to contribute to this project. --IllaZilla 20:29, 10 August 2007 (UTC)

Band members' names
A couple of editors have repeatedly taken out the real names of the band members in favor of their stage names, particularly Nekroman's. Now, when I wrote the article I got all of their real names from the song credits on the actual albums. All of them are credited "Gaarde/other member." This makes it clear that Nekroman's real last name is Gaarde. I'm not sure if Kim is his real first name, but if you are using the Windows Media Player service to look up album information the credit comes up "Dan Gaarder." Not sure what to make of that. The fact that Nekroman uses his real last name Gaarde in the credits of every album makes it clear that "Nekroman" is a stage name, not his legal name. It is therefore completely appropriate to give his actual name in the article and explain how he adopted the stage name (which the article presently does). So, I have to ask you to please stop changing it unless you can provide some source that either gives his real name or proves that Nekroman is his legal name. In the meantime I'm going to use the albums themselves as references for the names, and you should not remove referenced information. --IllaZilla 16:37, 10 August 2007 (UTC)


 * You are using unreliable sources, "Gaarde" is not Kim Nekromans real name, it is a synonym he uses when registering songs as songwriter. There there is no "Kim Gaarde". You should check the album sleeves and you will see no indication of a "Kim Gaarde". You are assuming its a real name and therefor not using facts. Second you seem to accepted some of my edits such as labels since that was completely wrong too. You also credit the wrong songwriters all over the place. Please leave my edits there since they are correct and your are not. --KimNekroman 16:57, 10 August 2007 (UTC)

I left some of your edits like those to the record labels because I don't have those those albums myself (ie. the original release of Brought Back to Life), so in the absence of my own ability to provide a reference I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt. However, I have now provided a reference for the fact that Nekroman's real name is Dan Gaarde. You can see it here. I admit I was making an assumption earlier when I put his name as Kim Gaarde, but this source indicates his name is Dan. I will be making the necessary changes to the album articles to reflect this, and citing this source. As for the songwriting credits, in looking back I admit there were a couple of errors but it is completely appropriate to list the songwriters' names in full in the album articles if they are known. This is particularly pertinent on some of the Nekromantix's releases as there have been 2 Sandorffs in the band so it is important to distinguish between the two. As it stands now, unless you can provide a reliable source for your information then please do not change it. --IllaZilla 19:07, 10 August 2007 (UTC)


 * His name is NOT Dan Gaarde, please take that away since it took a long time to remove that from various sites when somebody originally posted that on here. The source you are refering to is NOT reliable. You should use only official sites like label and band sites. Please dont let wikipedia lose its credibillity using random sources that probably got their wrong info from wikipedia in the first place. --KimNekroman 19:07, 10 August 2007 (UTC)

Firstly, there are plenty of reliable sources outside of label and band websites. In fact, Wikipedia requires that articles rely more heavily on reliable third-party sources than first-party ones. Second, what makes that source unreliable? It is a northeast Florida newspaper published by N2U Publishing, Inc. and as such should fact-check its articles. I don't know what you mean by "somebody originally posted that on here." As far as I can tell this is the first time it's been put in a the article (based on the page history). The bottom line here is that I have provided a reference and you have not. If you can provide a better one, fine, but if you remove referenced information from articles it may be considered vandalism. --IllaZilla 19:27, 10 August 2007 (UTC)


 * I find it weird that you ask for pictures and dont use the obvious sources but use weird unreliable sources when it comes to facts? Dear IllaZilla, I am the person in question so I would be considered a very reliable source. Thanks --KimNekroman 19:27, 10 August 2007 (UTC)


 * The whole "Dan Gaarde" actually originated from this very page when somebody randomly wrote it. I find it terrifying that people can write wrong info here, then its corrected and years later it comes right back..now regarded as a reliable source --KimNekroman 19:35, 10 August 2007 (UTC)

Since we've both already violated the three revert rule, I propose we let this cool off for a while. I'd like to leave the name in for the moment as it does have a reference, and we can both spend some time looking for other references to support our claims. If you've got any references that talk about Nekroman's or the others' stage names and what their actual names are, please post them here. I'll do the same as I find more. Then we can come to a consensus and maybe get some other people to weigh in on the matter as well. --IllaZilla 19:37, 10 August 2007 (UTC)


 * I dont think its fair to leave WRONG info up, just because a person so strongly wants there to be a real name AND a stage name.--KimNekroman 19:40, 10 August 2007 (UTC)

Oh hey, I guess we just posted at the same time. The reason I felt it important to supply real names is that in these articles we are listing the performers under their stage names, then under the songwriting credits we're listing them as they appear on the albums, with names that don't match those of the performers. So it's pertinent to note somewhere in the article which stage names belong to which songwriters, so readers can make the connections and so that credit is given where it is due. This is often done in Wikpedia articles on bands and albums in order to give more accurate information. With the Nekromantix it can get a bit tricky as both the stage names and the songwriting credit names appear on the same album sleeves, and some members have used stage names while others have not. That's why I've been trying to make things more accurate. Anyway, if you really are Kim Nekroman and the whole thing really is a mix-up, then I apologize. I'm just trying to write better articles and follow Wikipedia's policies on verifiability. So if you've got some links to sources/articles/etc. that would help correct these errors, support what you've said here, or improve the articles then please provide them. I'd be happy to add them into the articles to make them more accurate. In the meantime I'm going to leave things as is until tomorrow. --IllaZilla 19:47, 10 August 2007 (UTC)


 * I appreciate your efforts to update this BUT you have to understand that people out there believe this is correct and this very site is the reason for sources with wrong info because jokers has put random info up here. In the case of "Dan Gaarde" that somebody put as real name years ago and now it has come back because people wanna believe wikipedia is correct. Again I'm saying be very carefull with assuming things especially when it comes to registering songs it is not unusual for artists to use alias'. Also be carefull when you refer to a different language'd source that translation can be a source of confusion. Wikipedia source policy is great in theory only problem is that everything on the internet is not trustworthy and just because some kid writes something in a personal journal it doesnt make it right. I say always go by the bands and labels websites anything else needs very very strong proof of reliabillity or you and wikipedia will be the source of faulty information used many places.

Please check Nekromantix' myspace site and website for "FAQ's and other usefull info" made especially for situations like this. I hope to see a corrected version of anything that has to do with Nekromantix, Kim Nekroman and HorrorPops. Thanks --KimNekroman 16:11, 10 August 2007 (UTC)

Edit dispute
The following is copied from my talk page; I feel it pertinent to have this conversation on the article talk page which is a more public forum so that other interested editors can be aware of it. Please continue discussion below. --IllaZilla (talk) 08:50, 20 May 2009 (UTC)

Can you PLEASE stop undo'ing my changes?? We had this discussion 2 years ago. Name mispellings all over the place, wrong terms (made up by you) all over the place. If anything it would be close to an "Upright Bass" NOT "Double Bass" due to the way you pick it up. "Coffin Bass" is not just a brand but a constructual design which puts this instrument in its own category: "Coffin Bass". Your previous ignorance regarding real facts has resulted in faulty information about this bands history and names has spread on the internet. Please refrain from undoing if you arent even interested in this band. KimNekroman (talk) 00:18, 20 May 2009 (UTC)


 * Of course I'm interested in the band, or I wouldn't bother contributing to the article, would I? I have all of the albums and have recommended them to friends. That's what led me to try to improve the wikipedia article in the first place. Before I came along it looked like this. Pretty basic from Wikipedia's standards. I've been contributing to Wikipedia for several years and I know a lot about how it works and what its standards are, so I know what I'm doing. Let me try to address the specific problems we seem to disagree on:
 * The website: Are you no longer using http://www.nekromantix.com/? I realize it hasn't been updated in a long time, and most of your updates come from Myspace, but if nekromantix.com still exists then technically it's still your "official" website. http://www.myspace.com/nekromantix is your MySpace profile, not an official website (the website is MySpace, your portion is a profile on myspace...in the same way that each article on Wikipedia is not a site unto itself; Wikipedia is the site). I suppose we can keep the myspace in the infobox, since it's current whereas the old website seems to be defunct, but I should probably note in the "external links" section that the official site is out of date.
 * The coffin bass. First of all, "a built by himself upright bass" is bad grammar, as "built by himself" is not an adjective. "Custom" is an adjective, and is accurate, as it means "made or modified to personal taste". You made the coffin bass yourself, to your own specifications. Therefore it is a custom instrument. This is a perfectly accurate description and is simply good English. The very first paragraph of the history explains how you made it, so it's not like anybody is going to think that it was made by someone else.
 * The correct term is "double bass". Notice that there is no article for the term upright bass; it is a redirect to double bass. "Coffin bass" is a term that does not exist outside the context of Nekromantix. Just because it has a "unique constructual design" does not change the classification of instrument. The Fender Jag-Stang is a custom-built electric guitar with a unique structural design, but it's still an electric guitar. Gene Simmons' axe-shaped bass and Jerry Only's "devastator" are still bass guitars, even though they have unique structural designs. The lead paragraph and the history both describe the coffin bass and why it's called that; the personnel listing provides useful links to the instruments each member plays. It should therefore link to double bass, otherwise it's not helpful to readers at all.
 * "Mesa" vs. "Meza": Music from Regions Beyond lists his name as "James Meza". So does Tiger Army's myspace and their official website. I have to respecfully disagree that I'm spelling it wrong. Did he leave Nekromantix for Tiger Army, or did he leave Nekromantix and join Tiger Army later? I'll probably just reword that bit. It's perfectly accurate to say that he became Tiger Army's drummer because, well, that's a verifiable fact.
 * You also removed the mentions that Peter Sandorff left to pursue a degree in architecture, even though that's referenced to a reliable source (this one). I don't understand why you keep removing it. Same thing with the fact that Pete Belair went back to Australia...Your very own myspace post is the source for that. Why do you insist on removing it? The reader is going to wonder what happened to these people. They didn't vanish into thin air, and as long as we have verifiable sources to explain why they left and/or where they went afterwards, it's worth noting those details.
 * You keep removing the mention that you use the name "Gaarde" for songwriting credits. Why? This is an easily verfiable fact; the name is in all of your albums, and again your own myspace post (which obviously was written in part due to our discussions 2 years ago) is the source. Why do you insist on removing info that you yourself are making public on your own website?
 * Wrong terms made up by me? I don't see any.
 * With all due respect, I am doing my best in good faith to keep the article accurate. I am fan of your band and your music, and I hope to see you play the next time you are in my city. I'm also a Wikipedian, though, and therefore with respect to Wikipedia I have to do the best I can using the source material available. The best way for you to help make the Nekromantix article more accurate would be to provide links to secondary sources that have written about the band: music magazines, reliable websites, books, etc. You could even give us some links to interviews. I would gladly use such sources to help make the article more accurate and keep it within Wikipedia's standards. It's my hope that it can become a good article or even featured article someday, but I haven't been able to find enough secondary source material on my own. If you could contribute any sources you have to the article's talk page that would be extremely helpful, and help to avoide the appearance of a conflict of interest. --IllaZilla (talk) 02:20, 20 May 2009 (UTC)


 * The website www.nekromantix.com has been defunct for a while. Look at the last update and you will discover 2006 as last revised. The bands Myspace now functions as official website, just like many other bands use Myspace as their only site.
 * Peter Sandorff did not leave the band for the reason that you insist on stating. Pete Belair never left Australia it even explains that in the link to Nekromantix myspace that you yourself provide. This is a good example of how you twist the truth and facts. If you really had any interest it is easy to find information about Peter Sandorff left to form his own band originally. Second time he left was to join german Psychobilly band Mad Sin...but I guess writing the correct information means real research other than picking the first two Google options that comes up.
 * The "z" in Mesa is yet another example of you misunderstanding what is a "real" name and what is a "stage" name.
 * Sadly the interviews that are refered to, got their wrong information from this very site because you originally used unreliable sources.
 * Please do not try to teach me correct grammar as there is already several wrong use of english grammar on this site about Nekromantix.
 * What makes you say that "(this one)" is a reliable source? It is a random German site with absolutely no affiliation to the band, yet you choose to call it a reliable source..what do you base that on?
 * What more reliable source than the website of the band could you ask for?
 * The name "Gaarde" is being used by several persons as synonym in regard to songwriting credit and yet you wrongly informs that it is used by Kim Nekroman. You should do your research before publishing information that has more facets to it.
 * How come you dont undo ALL my changes?
 * You also failed to change guitar membershift yet you added drummermembershift?
 * I have a hard time taking your Wikipedia work serious when you add a band like "Chop Tops" as related to the Nekromantix...please explain that?
 * The term "double bass" is not a widely accepted term. The correct term is Upright bass or Contrabass. The Coffin Bass is not an acoustic instrument and the correct term would be "electric upright bass" if you really wanna go into detail the measurement of the Coffin Bass puts it in another bass instrumentment category that doesn't exist, therefore the correct term here would be Coffin Bass. Your guitar example doesn't really apply here since a stringed instrument (bass and guitar) is categorized by many other factors such as size, scale length etc.
 * I am not gonna waste much more time on explaining what is right and will cont. to correct this site. --KimNekroman (talk) 05:17, 20 May 2009 (UTC)


 * In order to better respond to your individual points, I have numbered them and will provide responses below:
 * That's fine, and you'll notice that I left the myspace as the site listed in the infobox, and I noted in the "external links" section that the old official website is out of date (however it still contains useful info up to 2006 so I felt the link worth keeping there).
 * The source cited states that Peter Sandorff left the band to study architecture. In the absence of any better reliable sources I have to go based on that. It is not my fault if there are not more accurate sources available; I did not merely pick the first 2 google hits. I searched through pages of search results and that was the most detailed source I could find that seemed both reliable and third-party.
 * I am aware of the difference between real names and pseudonyms, thanks. Everywhere I have looked up his name (album credits, band websites, etc.) it's spelled with a "z", so I went with that. Most of the members of Nekromantix over the years have used pseudonyms, so I don't see why you have a problem with James being listed by his. If I had a reliable source giving his real name, I would cite it. But again, I searched several of the most likely places and they all used a "z".
 * Actually, most of the sources cited predate the information in the wikipedia article. You assume that they are getting their erroneous information from wikipedia, whereas I think it's the other way around. This source, for example (the one that referred to you as "Dan Gaarde") is dated April 19, 2007. This is what the Wikipedia article on Nekromantix looked like at that time. Note there is no mention of "Gaarde" at all. I've gone through the article's history and this is the earliest mention I can find of the Dan Gaarde thing, and it's from 2004. User:Inanechild appears to be the one who put it there, so I suggest you take it up with him since that seems to have been the source of the problem (though he doesn't appear to have edited Wikipedia since September, so I doubt he's still around on the site). The Dan Gaarde bit was removed by someone else in August 2006, 8 months before the EU Jacksonville article wzs published. If they were getting the name from Wikipedia, they must have gotten it sometime between 2004 and 2006. In any case it's certainly not my fault, since my first edit to the article wasn't until July 2007. I came across the Dan Gaarde name in the EU Jacksonville article, after having searched for the name in connection with Nekromantix. It seemed like a reliable source at the time. Obviously it was erroneous.
 * Could you give some examples? I'd be happy to fix any incorrect grammar, or to request a copyeditor review the article. That particular example I gave was grammatically incorrect, however.
 * It seems like no matter what sources turn up, if you're not in control of them you call them inaccurate and unreliable. Wikipedia relies on reliable secondary sources, not primary sources alone. This seems pretty reliable: it's an extensive review, gives a lot of background on the band, and even has quotes from you in it. Are you suggesting that it's fabricated? I don't read or speak German, so I'd have to request someone who does to review the site and see if it meets Wikipedia's standards for reliable sources (editorial oversight, established history in the field, etc.). There aren't a hell of a lot of good online sources that give the full history of Nekromantix, so I had to go with what few reliable sources I could find. As for Pete Belair, I assume he left Australia in order to tour with Nekromantix. The article does not state anywhere that he moved away from Australia, it merely says that he went back to Australia after touring with Nekromantix, which is what your myspace post says: "Since Pete lives in Australia and intend to keep on doing so, we had to look for a permanent more local guitarist."
 * Secondary sources, ideally. Established music publications, journalists, interviews, etc. As I've said before, Wikipedia relies primarily on secondary sources. Plus the band's website does not have the level of detail that's needed to write an accurate history of the band. If it did, I wouldn't have to do all of this searching. Wikipedia is looking for higher-caliber sources than Myspaces and blog posts.
 * You never before mentioned that the name Gaarde is used by multiple persons for songwriting credit. In fact your very own myspace post says that it's your songwriting pseudonym. If I may quote: "It is correct that 'Gaarde' is Kim Nekroman's alias when registering songs but wrong that assume that it is his real/legal name." What more research do you expect me to do, when your own blog post says that it's your pseudonym? You're asking me "What more reliable source than the website of the band could you ask for?", and yet this information that you say is incorrect is coming from your very own website.
 * Because not all of your changes needed undoing. Just because I disagree with some of your edits doesn't mean I disagree with all of them.
 * I'm not sure what you mean by that. Here was my latest revision to the article, and it mentions all of the recent changes: James to Andy to Lux, and Troy to Pete to Franc. I even created a new portion of the lineups table reflecting the new lineup. Was there a change in there that I missed? Your myspace post says that Franc's been with the band since December. Is that accurate?
 * I'm not the one who put The Chop Tops as an "associated act", That was done last February by User:StompinPomp. I was not paying much attention to the article at the time and probably didn't notice. He probably put them there because their article says that they've toured with Nekromantix quite a bit. Note that in my latest revision I left them out. Not everything that goes into the article is my fault; Wikipedia can be edited by anyone, even random anonymous people who may add incorrect information. That's why we insist on reliable sources so much. Even so, we're all volunteers here and sometimes things slip through the cracks.
 * "Double bass" is evidently a widely enough accepted term that that's what the Wikipedia article is titled. If you have a problem with that I suggest you take it up over on that article. It looks like they're getting their info from a number of books on music theory & practice. This is really a semantic argument; it's true that people call it by various names (double bass, upright bass, contrabass, stand-up bass), it was simply made "double bass" in order to avoid redirects in the links. By "it's not an acoustic instrument" I assume you mean that it uses bass instrument amplification. Even so that wouldn't change the type of instrument that it is. I'm not very knowledgeable about instruments so I'll take your word for it about the measurements, etc. but I still think it's worth linking our readers to the article on double bass so that they can have some context and understanding of what family of instruments the coffin bass belongs to, even if its construction sets it apart from the typical instruments in that family.
 * Your contributions are appreciated, but keep in mind that you do not own this article. If it's apparent that you're editing it with a conflict of interest then I'll have to seek mediation through more formal channels. It must obviously comply with our policies on biographies of living persons but as long as it sticks to reliable source material then it is doing just that.
 * Again, I appreciate your point of view on things and I'm sorry for anything in the article that's grossly inaccurate, but please keep in mind that I'm just one of dozens (if not hundreds) of people who've contributed to this article since it was started in 2004. I'm doing my best to keep it in line with Wikipedia's core policies such as verifiability and neutral point of view, but I can't be held responsible for every bit of text that's in there. I ask you to assume good faith on my part and not jump down my throat about information that comes from sources that appear to be reasonably reliable. I cannot help it if there are not an abundance of high-quality secondary sources easily available that meet your satisfaction. At the end of the day, however, this is an encyclopedia and the standard for inclusion is verifiability, not truth. I can hardly be berated to going to the effort find sources and then using those sources to verify the article's contents. I ask that we continue this discussion at Talk:Nekromantix; having it here is not all that helpful because other editors who may watch the article are not seeing it. I'm going to transpose it there so we can continue in a more public forum. --IllaZilla (talk) 08:26, 20 May 2009 (UTC)

←Regarding the upright/double/coffin bass issue, I have to agree with IllaZilla: The term "upright bass" gives 661,000 google hits and the term "coffin bass" gives 2,450, whereas the term "double bass" gives 2,650,000. I think we should stick with what the majority of Wikipedia's readers will know. --JD554 (talk) 10:27, 20 May 2009 (UTC)


 * Just because more "Google" hits comes up doesn't make it more right. And because some random person decided to put it in Wikipedia as first choice it is now considered more correct?? I dont think so. The argument was about the "coffin bass" which is not a double bass but an upright if anything. —Preceding unsigned comment added by KimNekroman (talk • contribs) 19:52, 20 May 2009 (UTC)


 * "Upright bass" is simply another name for a double bass]; they are the same type of instrument. If you want to argue that you'll have to take it up on at [[Talk:Double bass. Going back and forth on this semantic is pointless. I don't care which wording the article uses, we can use a piped link to make sure that readers are led to the appropriate article for context. But it needs to be explained what family of instruments the "coffin bass" belongs to, and it's definitely in the broad category of double bass. --IllaZilla (talk) 21:36, 20 May 2009 (UTC)


 * Then why dont you just call it a "Bass" then?? The way other people see it is that "Double Bass" is simply another name for an "Upright Bass". If you really wanna explain the bass family the Coffin Bass belongs to it would be UPRIGHT BASS. Now be a good Wikipedian and listen to people with the knowledge instead of unreliable sources. KimNekroman (talk) 22:13, 20 May 2009 (UTC)


 * PS: I took your advice and paid a visit to "http://www.talkbass.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=44" and dang there was a category on the first page called: "Electric Upright Basses (Dedicated exclusively to the electric upright bass, including strings, setup, and amplification". Now is that good enough for you to understand the category the "Coffin Bass" is under? KimNekroman (talk) 22:41, 20 May 2009 (UTC)


 * So it took me less than 20 seconds to find 2, after Wikipedia's standard, reliable 3rd part sources "billboard.com and yahoo.com". I suggest you remove the unreliable sources you've been using as your main sources so far. And in the future for everybodies sake, think twice, question sources before writing info on here.
 * Use bands own sites, label sites for most accurate information. This is not the only article where I've obvserved you jumping to conclusions....just check "psychobilly" for another good (or should I say bad) example of ignorance. It certainly doesn't help your case when you add:"(rv unref'd. i realize this band changes members every 5 minutes lately, so it very well could be true, but i'm skeptical without a source)...KimNekroman (talk) 00:31, 21 May 2009 (UTC)


 * The tone of your first comment does not come off very civil. One of Wikipedia's core policies is Verifiability, which requires us to cite reliable sources for our info (and internet forums are not usually considered reliable sources). Another core policy is No original research, which means that we don't in fact just "listen to people with the knowledge". Anybody can come along and declare themselves an expert on this or that; that's why we insist on "reliable, published sources with a reputation for fact-checking and accuracy". I have no problem with explaining in the article exactly what the coffin bass consists of and how it's built (as long as there are citations to back that info up), but it seems pretty ridiculous to insist that it's not a double bass in any way, shape, or form. "Electric upright basses" are specialized double basses with electric amplification. The double bass article contains a number of examples of rockabilly and psychobilly bands who use such instruments, and they still fall under the broad category of double basses. Acoustic guitars with electric amplification are quite common, but they are still considered acoustic guitars. I note also that the name of the message board forum that you have linked to is "Double Bass Forums", bills itself as "the internet's largest bass guitar and double bass forum community", and the parent form that the upright electic bass forum is under says "This category contains our Double Bass Forums, such as Basses, Bows, Music Theory, and Classifieds". They clearly consider "electric upright basses" to still be double basses. Again, I have no problem describing the coffin bass as a custom-built upright/double bass with electric amplification, and I'm not sure why you're so opposed to this description as it seems quite accurate. Again, if your point of view is that "upright basses" are completely different from double basses and you think that Wikipedia's double bass article is inaccurate, then the place to bring that up is at Talk:Double bass. --IllaZilla (talk) 04:01, 21 May 2009 (UTC)


 * As for the rest, Yahoo and Billboard give only cursory information, not enough for a detailed history of the band which is what we are trying to write. This is an encyclopedia after all, not a promotional site. I had to revert your changes to the lead section because not only did it read like a puff piece, it was copied verbatim from Yahoo (which in turn was copied verbatim from Allmusic). This is copyright violation; you cannot simply copy someone else's text from another website. --IllaZilla (talk) 04:01, 21 May 2009 (UTC)


 * Your tone in the (rv unref'd. i realize this band changes members every 5 minutes lately, so it very well could be true, but i'm skeptical without a source) quote doesn't come off very civil either does it?

I am beginning to think that your involvement in this article is for the wrong reasons!!! I insist because it is NOT a double bass but an upright coffin bass. You solely make that up and that is not fitting for an encyclopedia. Wikipedia is constantly the source of wrong information being spread and used in articles online and offline and that has to be stopped.KimNekroman (talk) 04:21, 21 May 2009 (UTC)

Possible new sources
A thread at WP:COI has turned up a few more possible sources for this article, so I want to list them here so we can see about using them later. --IllaZilla (talk) 09:07, 22 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Houston Music review of Return of the Loving Dead (2002)
 * Popmatters review of Return of the Loving Dead (2002)
 * Aversion.com news post about Kim Nekroman being hospitalized while on tour (2004)
 * Aversion.com news post about the Sandorffs leaving the band (2005)
 * The Chronicle review of Life Is a Grave & I Dig It (2007)

Plurals
So IllaZilla are you defining Genesis and T-Rex as plural aswell? — Preceding unsigned comment added by KimNekroman (talk • contribs) 05:03, 23 June 2011 (UTC)


 * Of course not. Those are singular nouns. Plural versions of those would be "Geneses" and "T-Rexes". The names of this band is "Nekromantix" (latter half of the name clearly derived from "romantics", with "x" in place of "cs", like "pix" as an abbreviation for "pics" / "pictures"), which is plural noun, like the Ramones, Sex Pistols, X-Ray Spex, Kryptonix, Rezurex, etc. This is basic English. --IllaZilla (talk) 05:35, 23 June 2011 (UTC)


 * Don't you think "Rezurex" is a very bad example as their name too is a homemade name!--KimNekroman (talk) 05:51, 23 June 2011 (UTC)


 * Also, in response to this, not all plural English words end in "s", and plenty of words ending in "s" are not plurals. For example genius (plural: geniuses), fungus (plural: fungi), or octopus (plural: octopi or octopuses). And then there are words that can be singular or plural depending on context, like species or rhinoceros. --IllaZilla (talk) 05:55, 23 June 2011 (UTC)


 * As for Rezurex, see the other examples I added above (X-Ray Spex / pix as abbreviations of X-Ray Specs / pics). --IllaZilla (talk) 05:58, 23 June 2011 (UTC)


 * Oh, just FYI since you're back, I saw you changed the wrong city, name, year, etc...those were made incorrect by a vandal. If you look at the page history, you'll see this guy (IP addresses beginning 166.205) has been vandalizing the heck out of the article the last few days. I and a couple of other editors have been reverting him on sight, and the page has now been protected to prevent the ongoing vandalism. Didn't want you to think those blatantly wrong details were intentional. --IllaZilla (talk) 06:03, 23 June 2011 (UTC)


 * I really dont think normal english grammar applies to a noun in a different language, that seems rather ignorant to me.
 * Yes it was brought to my attention that this page has been out of control lately.--KimNekroman (talk) 06:14, 23 June 2011 (UTC)


 * "Romantics" is an English noun. The name Nekromantix is an obvious combination of necromancy and romantics, yes? As for the vandal, sorry you had to hear about it and hope it didn't cause you any nuisance. As I said the page is now protected and I and several others are keeping an eye on it should the vandal return. I also started an article on the new album (which I preordered by the way, loving "Bats in My Pants" & will see you on tour :) ) and will be keeping an eye out for media coverage of it so that the article can be expanded as more source material becomes available. --IllaZilla (talk) 06:26, 23 June 2011 (UTC)