Talk:Never Been Kissed (Glee)

Also has music
&mdash;Yves (talk) 23:51, 10 November 2010 (UTC)
 * This is so helpful, thank you! Added a few more. Frickative  16:51, 10 November 2010 (UTC)
 * You're very welcome! Ah, I was just about to add the NPR source, but Bovineboy2008 beat me to it! I haven't seen them before; do they normally do Glee reception? Yves (talk) 17:04, 10 November 2010 (UTC)
 * I haven't seen any, but I can dig through the archive. BOVINEBOY 2008 17:10, 10 November 2010 (UTC)
 * Oh, you don't have to; I was just curious. Yves (talk) 17:10, 10 November 2010 (UTC)
 * Too late ;) I just searched it on the website. It seems most of the articles are just "Glee is airing tonight" type stories, but it looks they also link to other articles from other websites and do some miscellaneous articles. Not too many actual reviews of episodes. BOVINEBOY 2008 17:15, 10 November 2010 (UTC)
 * Oh haha. You're right, Frickative, this is going to be lengthy. I guess because this is the first in a series that deals with suicide among LGBT youth; kinda like Glee's version of It Gets Better, right? Yves (talk) 22:23, 10 November 2010 (UTC)
 * Seems so! I've only skimmed the response so far, but it doesn't seem positive. I think this will be one where a thematic approach to reception will be easiest, but I'm about to tackle the music section first because the number of sources is a bit more manageable, haha. Frickative  22:35, 10 November 2010 (UTC)
 * Wow, that section was a lot easier to assemble than in previous weeks. I don't know if it was just because there were half as many songs as usual, but going through on a song-by-song basis rather than reviewer-by-reviewer seemed to work a lot better. I'm definitely going to try a similar approach with the main reception, it's much quicker not having to juggle comments around incessantly to make them fit. Frickative  02:18, 11 November 2010 (UTC)

First, thank you very much for the barnstar Frickative...it's people like you who will make my break very short...second, two gay sources: http://www.365gay.com/news/critics-bully-glee-for-last-nights-gay-focused-episode/ and http://www.afterelton.com/tv/recaps/glee/206?page=0%2C0 C T J F 8 3  chat 23:33, 12 November 2010 (UTC)

Can you figure out how to get the barnstar to Template:Gleek Barnstar and then on WP:GLEE? I'm no good at this kind of stuff. Thanks, C T J F 8 3  chat 00:09, 13 November 2010 (UTC)


 * I'm very glad to hear that! Thanks for the extra sources, I totally forgot to check After Elton. & I'll have ago at the barnstar template now :) Frickative  21:30, 13 November 2010 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the barnstar stuff. C T J F 8 3  chat 19:23, 14 November 2010 (UTC)

What's still needed to prep for GA?
Do we need more fleshing out in some sections, or any new sections, before this article can try for GA? BlueMoonset (talk) 04:36, 5 June 2011 (UTC)
 * The main thing is finishing "Production" from the sources above, and reining in "Critical response" a bit. Frickative  16:39, 5 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Thanks. Don't know whether I'll have time to try either; not sure how good I'd be at "reining in"... BlueMoonset (talk) 01:23, 7 June 2011 (UTC)

Actual cast vs. citable cast
When I noticed that Telly and Titus were listed as guest stars under Production, but not in the sidebar—they stood out because their names were red links—I decided to go to the source: the episode (on DVD). I discovered that Josh Sussman was in the front credits along with Telly, and Titus and Ashley (who was the only one of the four already in the sidebar) were in the ending credits. (Front credits are listed as "guest starring"; end credits as "co-starring". Lauren Potter has only ever been credited as co-starring; Ashley Fink didn't graduate from co-starring to guest starring until the second half of season two.)

Now, in Storylines/Plots, I gather it isn't truly necessary to cite the actual episode, because that's a given: attempting a summary by trying to find sources on the web for each plot point doesn't make sense. Can this principle apply to the credits listed in the actual episode as well? Sometimes people receive screen credit without having actual lines: Ashley and Josh in this episode (they're hit up for money by Puck in the busking scene, but not verbally), for example, or Max Adler in "Audition". Sometimes a character may have had lines or a scene that subsequently gets cut, though the credit remains: that might have been true for these, and was certainly true for Telly Leung, whose scene in "A Very Glee Christmas" didn't make it to the screen. And although Riker Lynch and Curt Mega only had one line each in "Special Education", their subsequent appearances as Warblers netted them ending credits despite not having any further individual lines.

There doesn't seem to be any firm rule about making sure that all people listed in the actual credits. The ten stilt people from the Madonna episode, all given co-starring credits, weren't listed, for example. Should there be a firm rule, and if so, what? Fox is notoriously bad about their own released lists; Wikipedia can do better. BlueMoonset (talk) 15:32, 5 July 2011 (UTC)


 * The fact the Fox press releases are so shoddy makes it awkward – I always used to mention everyone with an on-screen guest credit, but it wasn't always citeable with an online source, which I got pulled up for in some of the earliest GA episode reviews. Of course, this was before any DVD releases, so I'm sure we could now reference the DVD directly and that would be acceptable. The distinction between guest-starring and co-starring and whether one set or both should be listed is murky. Infobox television episode advises for the infobox, "Only guest actors in notable roles should be included in the list." But it could very much be argued that Becky and Lauren (and Jean, for another example) are much more notable "co-starring" roles than some of those that receive "guest starring" credits, eg. random nurses, shop assistants etc. I think this is worth a central discussion, is it okay with you if I copy this over to WP:GLEE? Frickative  15:56, 5 July 2011 (UTC)


 * Please, copy away. This seems like a good general discussion to have. Addressing recurring role credits for people who do very little in that particular episode should probably also be included. If the DVD can be referenced, then we're golden through the first ten episodes of season two, but will probably have to wait until mid-September...unless we can reference an on-line episode. Even if they cost money to view once they're no longer one of the five, would a Hulu reference work? Or even the Fox site, with a link that is good when posted but breaks later? (The latter probably wouldn't pass GA muster, would it?) BlueMoonset (talk) 21:24, 5 July 2011 (UTC)

(Continued at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Television/Glee task force. Frickative  12:55, 6 July 2011 (UTC))

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