Talk:New York City ethnic enclaves/Archive 1

Comments
I'm going to rewrite this as more of an article than a list. If anyone objects, please state so here or on my talk page. Thanks, mynameinc 00:59, 20 April 2009 (UTC).


 * It always seems weird to me when the people living in an area are excluded from a places history and the story begun with European arrival. ChildofMidnight (talk) 07:12, 24 April 2009 (UTC)


 * The city wasn't founded until the Europeans arrived. Thanks, mynameinc 11:23, 1 May 2009 (UTC)

Yorkville
Nice article, maybe a suggestion: The Upper East nieghborhood in the seventies and eighties was very Middle European (German, Jewish, Czech, Slovak, Hungarian, Polish) for most of the twentieeth century, and up until the nineties you could still get German language papers. Beleive it or not it still ratians some fo that character, thought dying fast.
 * I knew Yorkville was a large German neighborhood, as was Little Germany on the Lower East Side, but this was simply a rewrite of what was already there. I will do a German section. mynameinc 19:22, 2 May 2009 (UTC)
 * [[Image:Yes check.svg|18px]] Done I created a German section, and it includes Yorkville. mynameinc 19:49, 2 May 2009 (UTC)

More comments
(I will add more as I go along).  Spencer T♦ Nominate! 23:54, 3 May 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅Make sure all paragraphs have refs, like New_York_City_ethnic_enclaves. Articles like this can tend to seem like WP:OR if they do not have enough refs. The more, the better.
 * ✅I'm sure there's probably more European ethnic enclaves. For instance, Ukrainian. (Info here).
 * The section New_York_City_ethnic_enclaves is rather weak...is there more info about this ethnic enclave?
 * Chinese:
 * The most alive and largest Chinese community in New York is in Flushing, Queens - What does "most alive" mean; another word/phrase would probably be better.
 * ✅ The early settlers of Manhattan's Chinatown were from Taishan, Shanghai, and Guangdong.[37] They are most of the Chinese population of the area surrounded by Mott and Canal Streets. Instead of "They are most," maybe "They form most"?  Spencer T♦ Nominate! 20:19, 5 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Are there other ethnic communities that could be put in an "other" section at the bottom of each area, such as (in a possible "other" section, Cambodian, Thai, Indonesian, etc. at the bottom of the Asian American section?
 * I'm not sure how well the 2nd paragraph of Filipino relates to NYC itself, unless there was a navy base there. Also, has there been more recent immigration-it stops in the 2nd half of the 1900s.
 * More pictures can be used, like File:Astoria uncle georges.jpg in the Greek one. Also, do you have/can you make a map of these enclaves that could be a lead image for the article.  You could have someone make one if you gathered all the info together.  Spencer T♦ Nominate! 20:26, 5 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the help. mynameinc 23:56, 3 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Question: Do all sentences need inline citations, or will my list of sources at the end be fine for obvious information (e.g Spanish Harlem is home to a large Latino population)? mynameinc 23:58, 3 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Not all of them. For instance: Woodside, Queens, has a Filipino American community. In fact, 13,000 out of 85,000 (~15%) of Woodside's population is Filipino. The first sentence doesn't need a citation, but the second sentence would.  Spencer T♦ Nominate! 00:32, 4 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Can I have too many inline citations? And do you see other problems? mynameinc 00:35, 4 May 2009 (UTC)
 * I don't think you can have too many. As for other problems, I will list with bullets at the top.  Spencer T♦ Nominate! 20:04, 5 May 2009 (UTC)
 * What should I put in the "other" section? Any group with only one enclave, or with a couple of sentences under group's respective header?mynameinc 20:31, 5 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Groups where there is not enough information to really have a separate main header-Cambodian enclave in NYC for example, where one can only say ~3 sentences about it. Combine others, like Thai and other Asian groups here, too. Length? You could probably devote a paragraph to each group under the "other" header.  Spencer T♦ Nominate! 01:30, 6 May 2009 (UTC)
 * If there is a Cambodian or a Thai enclave in New York, I don't know about it. May be one in Queens, though.  I will combine one paragraph enclaves into main sections mynameinc 19:49, 6 May 2009 (UTC)

GA nomination
The article has been put on hold until the end of May to give people time to structure the article and put it into context. A section on the overall history and development of ethnic enclaves in New York would be appropriate. Then looking into the best way of presenting the more detailed information: should this be by area/enclave or by ethnicity?  SilkTork  *YES! 14:01, 16 May 2009 (UTC)
 * I would say by ethnicity, because I feel the history of each ethnic group should be given in detail rather than each enclave, and besides, many ethnic enclaves are only one block. mynameinc 16:22, 16 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Is structuring the only obstruction or is there something else? mynameinc 16:24, 16 May 2009 (UTC)
 * The structuring is significant enough at this point, as that involves substantial change to the article. When that has taken place I'll look at the article again.
 * Hell's_Kitchen,_Manhattan is worth looking at. That's a fairly notable New York City ethnic enclave - the history of that area includes Irish and Puerto Ricans. I'm not sure a simple ethnic group structure will work; and this paragraph is little more than a listing of Irish neighbourhoods, and I'm not sure what it is telling us: "Bay Ridge, Brooklyn, was originally developed as a resort for wealthy Manhattanites in 1879, but instead became a family-oriented Italian- and Irish-American community.[77] Another large Irish-American community is located in Woodlawn, Bronx, but Woodlawn also has a mix of different ethnic groups.[78] One large Irish community in Manhattan is Clinton.[79] Other sizable Irish-American communities include Belle Harbor and Breezy Point, both in Queens.[80][81]" I feel the material needs to be more selective, and assembled to give an understanding of the history and development of the enclaves.
 * Another possible approach for this article is to turn it into a List: List of ethnic enclaves in New York City.  SilkTork  *YES! 19:22, 17 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Originally it was a list, and may need to return to its first nature. It was hard to get what sources I did, because even self-evident truths have to be sourced, for instance, the history, development, and dominant ethnic group of Little Italy, or Chinatown. mynameinc 19:35, 17 May 2009 (UTC)
 * And are you asking I give more info of each enclave, as I did for the German section? mynameinc 19:39, 17 May 2009 (UTC)

The German section is a good starting point. It does lack detail though. Considering the notion of list and article, the information is closer to that of a list. It may be that this material is best suited as a list. The requirement for broader coverage as an article would be a major stumbling block to a GA pass.  SilkTork  *YES! 08:51, 22 May 2009 (UTC)


 * I have put some more suggestions on the review page.  SilkTork  *YES! 09:17, 22 May 2009 (UTC)

Sections done

 * Assuming you are asking for more info of each enclave, here are sections completed:
 * 2 African and Afro-Caribbean ✅
 * 2.1 African American
 * 2.2 Jamaican
 * 3 Asian American
 * 3.1 Chinese
 * 3.2 Filipino
 * 3.3 Indian
 * 3.4 Korean
 * 4 European
 * 4.1 German ✅
 * 4.2 Greek ✅
 * 4.3 Irish
 * 4.4 Italian
 * 4.5 Jewish
 * 5 Latin American
 * 5.1 Dominican
 * 5.2 Mexican
 * 5.3 Puerto Rican
 * 6 Middle Eastern
 *  my name  inc Ottoman project  19:55, 17 May 2009 (UTC)

Native New Yorkers/Americans
What about neighborhoods that have large popualations of NYC BORN or American born? Maybe it can be created into a seperate article? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.23.224.236 (talk) 16:21, 20 May 2009 (UTC)

Assessment comment
Substituted at 15:27, 1 May 2016 (UTC)