Talk:Nicholas van Hoogstraten

UK housing market
Tha article states

As the housing market boomed in the early 1990s ...

Is that true?. The UK housing market actually crashed in the early 1990s, losing around 50% of its value.

Bob BScar23625 13:49, 15 June 2006 (UTC)


 * House prices fell sharply, but nothing like 50%. Jim Michael (talk) 18:47, 28 May 2012 (UTC)

School

 * He went to a Jesuit school, not a Jewish one. I think you need to work out the difference before making anti-Semitic comments. Oh, and for good measure, he went to prison in 1968 for firebombing the home of a Jewish clergyman. --Mike 22:06, 25 July 2006 (UTC)


 * Observation: While the comment might be incorrect, it is, by no stretch of the imagination, 'anti-semitic'. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.145.23.64 (talk) 00:02, 1 February 2008 (UTC)

Children's ages
I have removed the ages from Hoogstraten's children because these would require continual maintenance to keep up to date. However, their dates of birth (even just the years of birth) would not require such maintenance. If anyone has such dates, could someone add them? For the record, as at today the ages were given as:
 * Rhett (aged 21), Alex (aged 18), Britannia (aged 16), Richmond (aged 15) and Orrie (aged 9).

--A bit iffy 14:31, 18 October 2006 (UTC)


 * Well, let's see if we can do the sums, which will give years of birth correct to within a year...
 * Rhett    = 2006 - 21 = 1985
 * Alex     = 2006 - 18 = 1988
 * Britannia = 2006 - 16 = 1990
 * Richmond = 2006 - 15 = 1991
 * Orrie    = 2006 -  9 = 1997

Do we know anything about wife / wives, mother(s)? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.183.24.162 (talk) 23:33, 21 November 2010 (UTC)

Possibly useful sources
I'm currently researching this lovely man and have found the following links which may be useful here:


 * http://www.guardian.co.uk/g2/story/0,,365743,00.html
 * The writer seems to be doing his damnedest to describe a psychopath (in the strict clinical sense) short of saying it outright.


 * http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,2092-1974673_1,00.html
 * "Possible psychopath" starts to sound like a ludicrous understatement. That he is proud to be called such, that he enjoys any kind of fame, good or bad, is typical of this kind of personality.


 * http://www.steveplatt.net/tribune/trib980410.htm
 * I'm not sure this would be a valid source as such, but it looks like it contains a lot of revealing info, particularly the bit about him beating up his mother. But the author is wrong to think that Van Hoogstraten's disease is one that belongs to the rich. A lot of psychopaths are very poor because they tend to have poor impulse control and can't hold down jobs.


 * http://www.nicholasvanhoogstraten.com/
 * Van Hoogstraten's own site. Classic psychopath, even to the point of vaingloriously sacking his own defense counsel and acting for himself.
 * Is it appropriate to include such an obviously POV link in wikipedia, even if it is external?1812ahill (talk) 01:56, 13 September 2011 (UTC)

Ireneshusband 07:10, 20 November 2006 (UTC)

Ireneshusband 07:59, 20 November 2006 (UTC)
 * http://archive.theargus.co.uk/2002/7/23/ - links to 12 or so local newspaper articles
 * http://www.camdennewjournal.co.uk/archive/r200203_3.htm - review of his biography

Children
does anyone know the second names of the children???

Is the Man "Van"?
Does anybody know if he was born "Van Hoogstraten"? I seem to recall hearing during coverage of his legal processes that he was born plain old "Nicholas Hoogstraten" and added the "van" later on in order to suggest some noble ancestry, just as some Germans add the word "von" to their surnames for the same effect...

Martan 12:23, 19 April 2007 (UTC)
 * I too recall hearing or reading somewhere he'd added in the "van" himself.--A bit iffy 13:14, 19 April 2007 (UTC)
 * Yep, me too, it was on a C4 documentary I think (ricjl 14:07, 5 August 2007 (UTC))

Van Hoogstraten is actually be a common Flemish name. But in Dutch 'Van' isn't a sign of nobility, it only means that your family is originally from the Hoogstraten region (from common origin, not nobility). The ones without 'Van' must have lost in the past somehow (3 people are listed in the Belgian phonebook with 'Van' and 7 without). He might just be restoring the original family name. But the fact remains that he's probably trying to impress people with a fancy name. What an idiot. --Bluezy 10:12, 8 September 2007 (UTC)

The English translation of his name is Nicholas Highstreet. It has been reported by various sources that the choice to add 'van' was, indeed, to impress. E.g.

Under English law, anyone can use any name he likes. The law is different on this point in some other countries. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.158.207.21 (talk) 12:30, 19 March 2009 (UTC)

Giovanni Di Stefano
Does Giovanni Di Stefano really represent Van Hoogstraten? In the BBC reports of the Raja family's case against Van Hoogstraten in 2005, it says he was not represented. Does anyone have a definitive source for this (i.e. not Di Stefano himself)? DavidFarmbrough 13:48, 13 November 2007 (UTC)

The Raja case
With the best will in the world, the section on the Raja case is confused, not helped by the innacurate reporting from the BBC website.

The section needs to deal with:

(1) The trial before Mr Justice Newman in April 2002 when van Hoogstraaten was convicted of manslaughter and acquitted of murder,

(2) The appeal to the Court of Appeal in July 2003, when the conviction was quashed and a retrial ordered.

(3) The retrial before Mr Justice Mitchell in November 2003, when he allowed a defence submission that there was insufficient evidence of manslaughter to go before a jury.

(4) The prosecution's unsuccessful appeal to the Court of Appeal in December 2003 against that decision. The Court of Appeal held that it did not in fact have jurisdiction to entertain an appeal. It directed that the matter go back before Mr Justice Mitchell

(5) The hearing before Mr Justice Keith (as Mr Justice Mitchell was not available) at which van Hoogstraaten was bailed to return to court (before Mr Justice Mitchell) to have the matter formally dropped.

Useful assistance is at: http://www.cps.gov.uk/news/pressreleases/archive/2003/137_03.html and http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/3301303.stm Informed Owl (talk) 23:25, 26 January 2008 (UTC)Informed Owl


 * I get a 404 Error message from the first site mentioned. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A02:C7D:BB3D:AD00:798A:DA02:3E4B:54C4 (talk) 11:57, 7 February 2018 (UTC)

Origins
If he is of mixed Dutch/German/ English/French origins, is he really also of Danish descent? It seems unlikely: does anyone have anything further on it? Simonross99 (talk) 20:49, 27 January 2008 (UTC)

Regarding his fathers job, I seem to recall that his father was a ships purser on cruise liners rather than a shipping agent. And that this was how NVH raised his stamp collection. It's a long time since I read the biography so I couldn't source it. It was in the one written by the two Brighton journalists. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 94.4.99.139 (talk) 16:56, 26 September 2015 (UTC)

Not to mention a working class shipping agentOptymystic (talk) 11:30, 28 March 2016 (UTC)

Arrested in Zimbabwe
... on charges of breaking foreign exchange laws and possessing pornography in contravention of the Censorship Act

Source: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7210688.stm —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.145.23.64 (talk) 00:15, 1 February 2008 (UTC)

Conflicts between walkers and landowners
In the Wikipedia article Walking in the United Kingdom is a reference to Nicholas van Hoogstraten regarding conflicts between walkers and landowners, but there is nothing fitting here. The referred event should be included here. -- Tomdo08 (talk) 17:39, 21 September 2010 (UTC)

Sources/BLP tag
Could you please elaborate, Neil S Walker, on why you have tagged this article for lack of sources? There are at least twenty cited with most, if not all, being reliable published works or broadsheet mainstream newspapers. Roger 8 Roger (talk) 20:09, 4 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Because, Roger 8 Roger, it is a BLP and has many claims and assertions that have no apparent references. Random examples: "He was educated at a local Jesuit school, but is also known to have attended Blessed Robert Southwell Catholic School in Goring-by-Sea..." "He built up his capital through a loan sharking business based in towns along the south coast of England, where he would take property deeds as the backing collateral..." "Many loanees were unable to maintain his unreasonable payment terms and defaulted their properties to him, enabling him to build up a substantial property portfolio along the south coast and in London..." "The enormous edifice is intended to house his collection of art—currently stored in Switzerland—including a mausoleum. Under English law, perpetual trusts are only allowed in the upkeep of monuments and graves..." etc. Er, that's why. Neil S. Walker (talk) 21:05, 4 March 2020 (UTC)

Name
Why has his name been changed in the intro and above his photograph? What is the source for that? Alrewas (talk) 08:23, 21 April 2020 (UTC)


 * Seems he officially changed his name in 2009, as per here. Although many national news outlets are using "von Hessen", I do notice that local, Brighton-area outlets are still using "van Hoogstraten" (or simply "Hoogstraten"). So, what do you reckon the page should be called now? (Am in two minds tbh.) --A bit iffy (talk) 22:30, 21 April 2020 (UTC)


 * Indeed, most national newspapers continue to use "Hoogstraten", too. It is clearly the name by which he is longest and best known. --A bit iffy (talk) 17:43, 15 January 2022 (UTC)


 * I too have just noticed the change. The name he is commonly known by should be the one used, which is Hoogstaten. At the start of the lead his official name can be used with "known as..." following. The name in the infobox though should be the common name. See Tom Jones as an example. Can someone change it back? Roger 8 Roger (talk) 09:31, 22 April 2020 (UTC)


 * Overnight I came to the same view, so I've now changed things accordingly. Also, I've added a dedicated "Name" section which I think is sorely needed.--A bit iffy (talk) 17:34, 22 April 2020 (UTC)


 * Appears to have changed his name on multiple occasions. The summary now opens with the most recent cited to 2020 sources. I don't believe a separate section about his name is necessary; the addition of "van" to his name in about 1968 around the first time he was jailed and his claimed use of pseudonyms for companies under his control are now mentioned in the article at what I considered appropriate points. Philip Cross (talk) 18:22, 22 April 2022 (UTC)