Talk:Nintendo 3DS/Archive 6

the generation numbers on the nintendo handheld consoles is wrong
they are listed as a generation ahead of what they actually are. game and watch is listed as the second generatior and counting from there to 3ds i come to 7, not 8. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.208.59.120 (talk) 15:11, 27 February 2013 (UTC)


 * Confusingly, that's not how we measure generations for handhelds - they are measured with relation to the main home console generations. This is something that is frequently discussed but as yet no consensus has been found for an alternative solution.  Alphathon  /'æɫ.fə.θɒn/ ( talk ) 16:10, 27 February 2013 (UTC)


 * 3D Gaming is 8th generation gaming because first you should know that the Nintendo 3DS was announced in 2010 and unveiled in 2010, doesn't mean it's a 7th generation gaming system. 8th generation started in 2011, that's the year of the OFFICIAL release of the Nintendo 3DS. 𝕁𝕠𝕣𝕕𝕒𝕟 𝕁𝕒𝕞𝕚𝕖𝕤𝕠𝕟 𝕂𝕪𝕤𝕖𝕣 21:47, 27 February 2013 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by JordanKyser22 (talk • contribs)

request protection
i request protection on this article after a major cleanup — Preceding unsigned comment added by 174.56.155.151 (talk) 18:50, 14 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Why? The page hasn't especially experienced much vandalism lately. Sergecross73   msg me   00:30, 15 August 2013 (UTC)

Proposed merge with Nintendo 2DS
I see there is some discussion on this already, so I'm opening a merge proposal so we can get clear consensus on whether this is notable enough for a standalone topic.  Taylor Trescott  - my talk + my edits 19:17, 28 August 2013 (UTC)


 * Speedy merge The same incident happened when the Nintendo 3DS XL was announced. It's just a remodeled version.   [  Soffredo  ]   19:20, 28 August 2013 (UTC)


 * Keep separate articles. Whereas the XL was simply a larger version of the same console, this is a separate console with a different feature set. The lack of 3D, the new slate form factor, the rationale behind appealing to a lower-budget crowd without lowering the price of the main 3DS, and the removal or movement of several buttons, are major points of distinction. This topic appears to fulfill the different aspects of the general notability guideline at WP:GNG (thanks Sergecross73 for the heads-up):
 * Significant coverage - this has already been covered by a large number of sources directly in detail. Lengthy articles about this console exclusively in a number of publications. The articles are not simple announcements as you often see on gaming blogs, but rather in-depth explanations, often with editorial commentary.
 * Reliable - Washington Post, NBC News, CNET, CNN Money, USA Today, Kotaku, and IGN are just a few of the sources that have covered this in articles that are about the 3DS exclusively
 * Sources - they are secondary sources, not Nintendo itself.
 * Independent of the subject - these are independent journalistic enterprises that, while given the exclusive chance to test the 2DS, are not forced to write favorable reviews and in fact write some negatives in their previews
 * Presumed - that's what we're discussing here.
 * Given fulfillment of the general notability guideline, I believe this console clearly deserves its own article. CaseyPenk (talk) 20:10, 28 August 2013 (UTC)


 * Keep Separate Articles - per CaseyPenk, which partially mirrors my arguments back at the 2DS talk page. They are significantly different products, and are getting separate coverage. The reason that the 3DS XL article was merged before was because it was exactly the same as the original 3DS except a little bigger. There was nothing to say. All it had was a paragraph compare/contrasting its dimensions. This has different functionality, shape, is based off of going after a different demographic, etc. Sergecross73   msg me   20:23, 28 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Merge - as per Soffredo, it's a new model, the only thing different is no 3D and no closing. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Pokebub22 (talk •contribs) 21:35, 28 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Thats like saying we should merge the iPhone with the iPad because they're the same thing except size and 4G. It's called the 3DS - it's whole point was to be 3D. It's a fundamental change.  Sergecross73   msg me   00:19, 29 August 2013 (UTC)
 * I agree with you Sergecross73. --G&#38;CP (talk) 23:44, 30 August 2013 (UTC)


 * Keep separate articles - This model is significantly different from other 3DS models. It lacks the 2D function, has no clamshell and only has mono speakers. Also, since the system has a much different name, it may cause confusion (people may try to find info on the Nintendo DS article instead of the 3DS article, making it more difficult to find info.) RyDawg96 (talk) 21:42, 28 August 2013 (UTC)
 * For reference, this edit is the only one performed by this user. CaseyPenk (talk) 22:33, 28 August 2013 (UTC)


 * Keep - We had other console that wasn't merged like such as Game Boy Micro, Visteon Dockable Entertainment, Nintendo Mini Classics, Game Boy Advance SP, and Nintendo DSi. DigiPen92 (talk) 22:18, 28 August 2013 (UTC)
 * I'd add to that the Nintendo DS Lite. CaseyPenk (talk) 22:31, 28 August 2013 (UTC)


 * Merge - I can see how this may be able to have its own article in the future, depending how its notability and difference from the 3DS changes, but at the moment, as a 3DS model, I think it should be listed as part of the 3DS article. (I know OTHERSTUFF and such, but Wii Mini originally had its own article and was merged with Wii on similar grounds.)  Dark Toon Link Heyaah! 23:07, 28 August 2013 (UTC)


 * Keep - Among other reasons listed above by fellow editors, just like the Nintendo DSi was part of the Nintendo DS family, the Nintendo 2DS, although still part of the Nintendo 3DS family, is considered a substantial different model on its own. We also see this trend in other articles such as the iPad 2 and iPad mini. Same internal hardware and compatible applications but different size, form factor, price pint and targeted demographics. Merging them in the same article would create more confusion and would overhaul be counter productive.-- Arkhandar ( Talk • Contribs ) 23:36, 28 August 2013 (UTC)


 * Keep - Yes, this is really a new gaming system that I just recently heard, but this is really part of the 3DS family. Just like the DSi which it was part of the DS family, this is more of a different model with some different features. The 2DS is the same is the 3DS but as there is different counterparts with it's the gaming system, yes, we don't want to confuse readers about the 3DS having a 2DS article/section as they have different components and other things with the 3DS. 20chances (talk) 12:36 AM, August 29, 2013 (UTC)
 * Keep We shouldn't be discussing over whether the features of the 2DS (not many, but that's against the point) but the media coverage and sources for the article. There's plenty of reliable sources for this article to keep it separate and the mass media in general think of the 2DS as an entire new console instead of simply a model of the 3DS. Wikipedia isn't for opinions, it's for real information. Comparing the features between the 2DS and the 3DS is just a plain waste of time because whatever you say on this talk page isn't going to change the fact the 2DS is widely regarded as a new console itself. Naire Wagnero (talk) 03:13, 29 August 2013 (UTC)
 * For reference, this editor has two edits on Wikipedia: this !vote, and a note on their talk page stating, in part: "I'm not new. I have no plans on staying after this edit either." CaseyPenk (talk) 14:59, 29 August 2013 (UTC)


 * Keep While it could be considered as part of the 3DS family, it is definitely its own console. If it looked closer to a 3DS, then a merge would be more reasonable. GSK ● ✉ ✓ 04:42, 29 August 2013 (UTC)
 * I agree. A prime example is the fact that 3DS XL does not have it's own article: it's basically the same as 3DS but just a different size. Therefore a seperate 3DS XL page would have more likely less contents. The 2DS is the same case as what the DS lite and DSi are to the (2004) DS - in Wikipedia terms at least. --G&#38;CP (talk) 23:48, 30 August 2013 (UTC)


 * Oppose merge: There's enough content/distinct differences between them to justify a separate article. It's a notable hardware variation. ViperSnake151   Talk  06:18, 29 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Strong Merge - It's not a completely new model, it's just a new variation of the 3DS, so it belongs to the 3DS family just as 3DS XL. This mirrors DS lite and DSi, which are part of the Nintendo DS family. --G&CP (talk) 14:19, 29 August 2013 (UTC)
 * That argument doesn't make any sense, considering DS Lite and DSi both have had their own separate articles for a long time. Precedent and your rationale goes against your stance. Sergecross73   msg me   14:30, 29 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Oops, my bad! I did not realise that DS lite and DSi had seperate pages! In that case, see below. --G&#38;CP (talk) 23:42, 30 August 2013 (UTC)


 * Keep New console, deserves its own page. Muur (talk) 17:06, 29 August 2013 (UTC)
 * It's not a new console, it's a console revision.   [  Soffredo  ]   20:04, 29 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Reliable sources beg to differ. CaseyPenk (talk) 20:58, 29 August 2013 (UTC)


 * Comment - If we're keeping a 2DS article, I don't see why we shouldn't make an XL article as well. Nintendo is marketing all three as concurrent models of a single platform. See this front page. ServiceGhost (talk) 00:17, 30 August 2013 (UTC)
 * I see your argument. There are probably more than enough reliable sources with articles that cover the XL exclusively. Regardless of whether there are many feature differences (which is a somewhat subjective determination and could get into WP:OR if us editors make the determination), reliable sources cover the two editions / versions / consoles separately. I have started a draft, mostly spun off from the main 3DS article, at User:CaseyPenk/Sandbox/Nintendo 3DS XL. Everyone is more than welcome to edit. CaseyPenk (talk) 00:34, 30 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Keeping things as they are will simplify things a lot, especially is Nintendo releases a Nintendo 2DS XL in the future.-- Arkhandar ( Talk • Contribs ) 00:43, 30 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Haha, well the 2DS is a budget console so I couldn't imagine them adding any features to it. I do think there's substantial coverage of the XL exclusively, and it has some more significant differences (for example, loss of bevels) than I had initially realized. CaseyPenk (talk) 00:52, 30 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Is there that much beyond dimensions? There original article seemed like it wasn't much more than paragraph, largely saying giving dimensions and reviewers saying "Yay, its bigger." I'm still against a separate XL article. Considering the tiny size of the regular 3DS's reception section it'd be best to just lump XL reception in there. This better mirrors the setup we have with similar video game families, like PlayStation Portable family. The minor size adjustment editions (PSP 2000, PSP 3000) don't have their own article, but the PSP GO, a major conceptual revision, has its own article. Same should apply here. Sergecross73   msg me   01:35, 30 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Just as with 3DS XL, I think we need to be careful about employing WP:OTHERSTUFF considerations as we compare 3DS XL to the PSP family. Just because no one has taken the time to research media coverage of 2000, 3000, etc. (and I don't blame them -- it's lower-profile work and more about making our coverage more comprehensive) doesn't mean those subjects aren't notable. I'm not particularly familiar with the family of PSP consoles so I wouldn't say definitively one way or another, but I would give it a fair shot that some or all of those revisions are notable per our criteria.
 * You're absolutely correct that revisions / offshoots generally don't have their own articles. But I think that's more a consequence of our limited time as editors. If you look at the edit histories of articles like The Legend of Zelda: The Wind Waker HD (which I started as its own article) (first edit) and The Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time 3D (first edit), you'll see that these pages started off as redirects but grew into their own articles. I'll reserve judgment about The Wind Waker HD article to others since I wrote much of it, but the Ocarina of Time 3D article certainly has expansive content that could not all be fit into the main Ocarina of Time article. I see the same potential here. CaseyPenk (talk) 14:45, 30 August 2013 (UTC)
 * This is Nintendo we're talking about. You never know what will come next. Don't get to surprised if 2DS customers start to feel the need for a device with bigger screens. I don't think loss of bevels is more significant difference.-- Arkhandar ( Talk • Contribs ) 01:37, 30 August 2013 (UTC)


 * Keep separate/oppose merger Why people are using 3DS XL as an argument for merging is beyond me; the 3DS XL's only differentiating features are its size and its battery. The 2DS is a very different kettle of fish; the 3D stuff has gone, and the 2DS is very different stylistically - particularly without the folding top. This, to me, are two differences that are major enough to keep it separate. The 2DS is independently notable, particularly due to the mixed reception of its new styling, whereas the 3DS is not. Let's not forget that the original DS and DS Lite have separate articles as well; hell, so do the GBA and GBA SP. I'd support an independent article for the 3DS XL as well, for what it's worth (and, probably, the DSi XL) Luke no 94  (tell Luke off here) 11:58, 30 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Keep separate People are comparing this to the 3DS XL when they should be comparing it to the DS Lite. Too different for a merge. The 2DS reception section is already twice as long as the 3DS reception section and it isnt even out yet.Smear-Gel (talk) 16:26, 30 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Oppose merge This console is a fundamental redesign of the 3DS. While software is exactly the same, the hardware is significantly different. The 3D is gone, the hinge is gone, the buttons have been moved around, etc. Much too different for a merge. As Lukeno94 said, this is much more similar to the GBA SP or the DS Lite than the 3DS XL. It's a redesign, not just superficially changed. NealCruco (talk) 21:01, 30 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Keep as it's a variation of the 3DS. However, it's part of the 3DS family, so therefore in e.g. generation articles, it should be noted as 3DS/3DS XL/2DS, similarly to how the DS family is, DS/DS lite/DSi/DSi XL. So keep the article BUT it's part of the 3DS family so it is NOT a new console model. --G&#38;CP (talk) 23:42, 30 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 'Side note I think the proposal discussions should be closed now as there are now enough and reliable answers. Looks like it's staying seperate.
 * Keep per CaseyPenk and others. From what I'm seeing on other pages, the 3DS XL should stay on the 3DS page, and the 2DS should be it's own page. (As other users were talking about this.) - Favre1fan93 (talk) 04:29, 31 August 2013 (UTC)

3DS XL hatnote
'K, I'm not sure when this hatnote appeared, but I think it's partly redundant. The 3DS XL already redirects here. People searching for it will already get here. Hatnotes are for disambiguating ambiguous situations, to other pages, not to sub-headers within the same article. I believe the 3DS XL part should be removed as a result. And I'm not sure people typing in "3DS" will be expecting the predecessor the DS either... hbdragon88 (talk) 17:05, 6 September 2013 (UTC)
 * The fact that people may be searching for the 3DS XL specifically tells me that it deserves its own page; I've brought that up previously and still hold that to be the case. So I think the most reasonable solution is to give the XL its own page - it's a topic of considerable interest in its own right and giving it its own article would, as a coincidence, make the note at the top more true to the way you want it to be used, hbdragon88. CaseyPenk (talk) 17:07, 6 September 2013 (UTC)
 * That's not really a valid reason for having its own article. If "people searching for it" was a valid reason, every redirect would have an article. If you want to start a discussion about it, and consensus supports it, that'd be a good reason. But right now, the standing consensus is that it can be covered just fine in the parent article. (Which I support. It's the same exact thing, just a little bigger in some areas. Cutting out redundant content and reviewers saying "Yay, its bigger", there's not much to be said.) Sergecross73   msg me   18:02, 6 September 2013 (UTC)
 * As I have made clear, I disagree. CaseyPenk (talk) 18:16, 6 September 2013 (UTC)
 * I know, and that's fine. I'm just saying, you need new consensus to start that article, not just your passing observation of people making hatnotes for it. You kinda sounded like you were ready to start that right away, so I was just reminding you of how to handle it.  Sergecross73   msg me   18:28, 6 September 2013 (UTC)
 * I wasn't planning to actually create the article without more input. If I decide to go ahead down that route I'll draft it out in my sandbox first. Thank you for clarifying what you meant. CaseyPenk (talk) 18:29, 6 September 2013 (UTC)
 * Thank you too. Sorry if that sounded too harsh at first. Sergecross73   msg me   18:31, 6 September 2013 (UTC)
 * If the 3DSXL is a separate system than the 3DS, and enough people have searched for it that it gets a hatnote, it deserves a separate article. The reason that every redirect doesn't get a separate article is because over 75% are different names for the same thing. Just my opinion.  Konveyor Belt  yell at me 18:33, 6 September 2013 (UTC)
 * Well, you're free to start up a discussion as well, but that's not the current consensus. The "redirect" example was just a comment in response to something Casey said in particular. In general, there's a belief on Wikipedia that if something is pretty similar to the other, they're just covered in the same article. Like the minimal revisions of the PSP1000, 2000, and 3000 all being in the same article, but the PSP Go, the only revision that was substantially different, was the only one that has it's own article. Common practice. Sergecross73   msg me   18:56, 6 September 2013 (UTC)
 * Some of us (including myself) believe that 3DS XL is a major revision, certainly more major than the tiny hop from PSP-2000 to -3000, and major enough in its own right to warrant its own article. In other words, I don't think every console revision is exactly the same. The 3DS XL is unusual in the sense that it's almost a graphical upgrade that allows games to be played differently, akin to the Nintendo 64 DD. While the resolution is the same, the screen is larger, meaning that the experience of playing the game is different (it feels different to the player). To me, making the screen bigger and redesigning the console around the edges with fewer bezels (as well as some other features) is a considerable change, similar to cutting out 3D and turning the console into a slate, even if not as momentous. We all agree that the 3DS XL and 2DS are both revisions to some degree; I see them as both being revisions of some serious merit. CaseyPenk (talk) 19:15, 6 September 2013 (UTC)
 * Don't get me wrong, I have an XL and greatly prefer the larger screen, but I hardly consider that a "change in experience" or anything akin to the prospect of 64DD, which was both additional physical hardware, used a different medium for playing games, and would have had games that only played on it and not the standards Nintendo 64. Way different stuff. Sergecross73   msg me   19:31, 6 September 2013 (UTC)

Arkhandar introduced a nice compromise here. CaseyPenk (talk) 22:37, 6 September 2013 (UTC)
 * Looks good to me. Thanks Arkhandar. Sergecross73   msg me   23:30, 6 September 2013 (UTC)
 * Always glad to help :) -- Arkhandar ( Talk • Contribs ) 00:14, 7 September 2013 (UTC)

Removal
Why not remove the hatnote altogether (which I did, but it got reverted)? We should assume our readers have the ability to spell, and it's almost impossible to get "DS", "2DS" and "3DS" mixed up, as they are a) spelt differently, and b) different products. satellizer  (talk  -  contributions)  01:45, 7 September 2013 (UTC)
 * I don't know that we're assuming the stupidity of our readers; we're providing a navigational aid. Yes, it is not strictly necessary, but nor is any of the information we provide. Personally, when I first heard the 2DS name I was taken aback and confused. It's a bit of a strange name, mostly because the original DS had 2D graphics as well. I would like an immediate explanation that they are different consoles, at the top of the page. I don't know that we're preventing stupidity as much as providing an easy-to-use way to sort out the differences between consoles. Besides, I don't think a single-line note is too much of a hassle, and pales in comparison to the ugly impact of the "badly organized and lacks necessary information" note. CaseyPenk (talk) 03:09, 7 September 2013 (UTC)

Should the 2DS section be expanded?
I could easily just copy-paste the infobox from the main article, but I am not sure if it deserves it. Given as the 2DS has its own separate article, is the expansion needed? In particular, since the 2DS is launching soon, the 2DS article, separate from the 3DS, will get a good amount of traffic. If the 2DS article can survive on its own without being merged, should the part on the 3DS be expanded anyway? (I will be adding the infobox anyways, I just want feedback)  Konveyor Belt  yell at me 21:40, 9 September 2013 (UTC)
 * Support expanding and updating the section on this page. I originally spun the 2DS article off that section of the 3DS article, but made many changes to the 2DS article in the interim. The section on the 3DS page is quite outdated and I don't think contains a well-rounded overview of the console. Last I checked the section on the 3DS page was mostly focused on the announcement and didn't provide comprehensive coverage of the 2DS. So I'd say a heavy copyediting is in order. Feel free to copy and paste content from the 2DS article as you see fit; you can just say it was copied and pasted in the edit summary. Maybe we could even copy and paste the 2DS lead; I haven't compared it but it might be more comprehensive since so many people have been editing the 2DS article, pouring a lot of time into it. More time = higher quality (hopefully). CaseyPenk (talk) 21:56, 9 September 2013 (UTC)
 * Support - I agree that the section should be expanded with summarized key points from the main article. However, I don't think the infobox is really necessary. Nevertheless, I think that the priority right now is to organize and update the article as soon as possible, and then expand the 2DS section.-- Arkhandar ( Talk • Contribs ) 21:58, 9 September 2013 (UTC)
 * Comment - The copy-editing can become a slippery slope: we might end up building a chimera article instead of expanding it. The entire article as a whole is cluttered already. I support expanding it, but we shouldn't copy edit. Perhaps since is this a 3DS article we might talk more about its relation with the 3DS as a concurrent model. This kind of copyediting is exactly what made this article get the cleanup tag in the first place.  Konveyor Belt  yell at me 22:42, 9 September 2013 (UTC)
 * Uh, I'm not sure you're using/understanding the term WP:COPYEDIT correctly. It basically just means cleanup/fix up. The only reason you wouldn't want to do a "copy edit" would be if you think its already perfect, which judging by the rest of what you said, is probably not the case... Sergecross73   msg me   00:58, 10 September 2013 (UTC)


 * Weak Support - Some better aspects could be covered, but overall, we don't really want to make it all that much bigger, considering the rather large size of this article, and the fact that the 2DS has its own article... Sergecross73   msg me   00:58, 10 September 2013 (UTC)

That Japanese I added
Since I was reverted here, I'd just like to explain why I made that edit.

I added it because this is the base article for a lot of those topics, for example, Nintendo 3DS Camera. For the first time that was said, I added the Japanese, since the name came from the Japanese.

However, I now realise I shouldn't have done it for ones that had their own articles, like Nintendo eShop and Nintendo Video.

Does anyone really object to me re-adding it for those that don't have their own articles?  Dark Toon Link Heyaah! 04:49, 26 September 2013 (UTC)
 * In his edit summary, Konveyor Belt referenced edit warring over a similar topic that happened at the Pokémon X & Y article, where there were disagreements on whether or not to use Japanese translations on a lot of the terms in the game. There, I had objected, because they kept on happening mid-sentence, and it interrupted the flow and readability of the sentences since they were so frequent. Your situation is different though, since its just translating the first word of the first sentence typically, which doesn't really hinder readability. Additionally, the 2 editors who were edit warring over it don't really actively edit this article, and it there's no policy or guideline prohibiting what you're doing, there's only that small discussion on something else that resulted in a weak WP:LOCALCONSENSUS, so I'd say you're fine unless other people start objecting or something. Sergecross73   msg me   12:58, 26 September 2013 (UTC)
 * You can add it back if you wish, but only for important things. As mentioned in the Pokémon X and Y talk, it shouldn't be added for trivial things like Pokemon Bank (or Nintendo 3DS eshop).  Konveyor Belt   express your horror  at my edits   20:48, 26 September 2013 (UTC)
 * As I said above, I'll add it for things that don't have their own article. It isn't really disruptive to just do it the first time a name is introduced. But yeah, I won't do it for Nintendo eShop because that has it at its own article, only for things like Camera and Activity Log. Some of the others were missing details in their own articles, so I filled those in as well.  Dark Toon Link Heyaah! 23:51, 26 September 2013 (UTC)
 * Wow, I didn't really know what had happened at Pokémon X & Y, since I don't tend to edit Pokémon articles, but I just checked out the talk page... Wow, I'm really glad this got sorted here this easily. This actually isn't like the Pokémon issue at all, since there are only a few additions that aren't mid-sentence or disruptive, in this case they actually help. Anyway, I'm not really the sort to edit war, I'd rather just discuss it, so thanks everyone for your time.  Dark Toon Link Heyaah! 03:53, 28 September 2013 (UTC)
 * Indeed, it was a different issue entirely. I'd say you're fine unless someone strongly objects here or something, and even then it'd probably be up for discussion... Sergecross73   msg me   21:35, 28 September 2013 (UTC)

Launch games
I think there may be a few discrepancies with the table. If you count the number of titles marked with 'EU,' it's actually more than the number presented in the paragraph! Also, I tried looking for a source of the exact number of titles for Australia, but a full list is hard to find, even on like Vooks, since the titles were all confirmed at different times. By memory, I think it was about 12 or maybe 11. I think it was a little less than Europe, since we didn't get Pilotwings until later when Japan did... I don't think we got that Samurai Warriors game either, but obviously my memory is not a reliable source!  Dark Toon Link Heyaah! 00:49, 30 September 2013 (UTC)


 * Yeah, as I recall I think it was just about a game or two less than in Europe. I see you added some "AUS" tags but you forgot to post the sources though. -- Arkhandar ( Talk • Contribs ) 14:01, 30 September 2013 (UTC)

Swapnote
Referenced content has been removed repeatedly by multiple times. In the reports, the phrase "わいせつ画像送受信" (transmission of obscene imagery) is used, which refers to pornographic imagery, and not simply any kind of "offensive material". Nintendo is a Japanese company, and any actions the company takes is more better documented in Japanese sources, and this includes news reports, legal statements, police reports, and official announcements. "offensive material" is vague, and can refer to insults, racism, and the like, all of which are not as serious, and do not carry as much of a heavier connotation than "pornographic imagery". Don't whitewash and blank content simply because you might not like it, or that it doesn't conform with the way you like things; this is becoming borderline disruptive editing behaviour. It is poor form to downplay and sugar-coat it with scare quotes and lightened euphemistic terms such as "offensive material" like a Nintendo marketing team in damage control mode. Wikipedia is not censored, even though some people might not like certain things that are being said. -- benlisquare T•C•E 15:09, 3 November 2013 (UTC)


 * There's absolutely no need to source an article from a Japanese publication on the English Wikipedia when there are numerous sources about the subject in English already. Additionally, you said that in Nintendo's official Japanese statement, the phrase "transmission of obscene imagery" is used. How about using that, instead of the poorly sourced, speculative, "pornographic imagery".-- Arkhandar ( Talk • Contribs ) 15:19, 3 November 2013 (UTC)


 * What does "obscene" mean? It's obviously a synonym for lewd, lascivious or pornographic. Japanese newspapers use terms such as "わいせつ" (obscene) because the press is forbidden from using terms such as pornography. That does not mean that we cannot take it for face value. You don't need to prove that the sky is blue if it's already obvious as day. How else can anything else, non-pornographic, be "obscene"? "Besides, there's absolutely no need to source an article from a Japanese publication on the English Wikipedia when there are numerous sources about the subject in English already." - I beg to differ. This being the English Wikipedia has nothing to do with this, and per WP:NONENG, non-English references are permitted. Given that the Japanese sources are more factual than the English ones available, there is reason for these Japanese newspaper sources to be used. These are reliable sources - Asahi Shimbun and Mainichi Shimbun are major Japanese newspapers, akin to the New York Times; it's not like they're tabloid sources. If the current English sources have factual limitations, there is no reason why the problem cannot be remedied with the use of Japanese ones. -- benlisquare T•C•E 15:19, 3 November 2013 (UTC)


 * Here on Wikipedia, that's called original research.-- Arkhandar ( Talk • Contribs ) 15:23, 3 November 2013 (UTC)


 * You misunderstand WP:OR. It is not OR to say that someone is female, if a source says "Jane Doe is a woman", instead of "Jane Doe is a female". You're essentially whitewashing WP:IDONTLIKEIT content because it doesn't conform with your POV, and you're using WP:OR as an excuse to do so. -- benlisquare T•C•E 15:25, 3 November 2013 (UTC)


 * "Pornographic" is only one of the many meanings of the word "obscene". Taken from thefreedictionary.com


 * ob·scene (b-sn, b-) adj.
 * Offensive to accepted standards of decency or modesty.
 * Inciting lustful feelings; lewd.
 * Repulsive; disgusting: "The way he writes about the disease that killed her is simply obscene" (Michael Korda).
 * So large in amount as to be objectionable or outrageous: "local merchants in nearby stores get hammered by stratospheric rents and obscene taxes" (Joe Queenan).
 * offensive or outrageous to accepted standards of decency or modesty
 * (Law) Law (of publications) having a tendency to deprave or corrupt
 * disgusting; repellent an obscene massacre
 * offensive to morality or decency; indecent: obscene language.
 * intended to stimulate sexual appetite or lust; lewd: obscene movies.
 * abominable; disgusting; repulsive.


 * As you can see, to limit "obscene messages" to simply "pornographic imagery" is clearly original research. And if I where you, I'd stop with the finger pointing accusations. This is Wikipedia, not a kindergarten.-- Arkhandar ( Talk • Contribs ) 15:33, 3 November 2013 (UTC)


 * Obscene images, not obscene messages. Your dictionary lookup doesn't really change anything. Furthermore, many of the definitions given (e.g. the ones relating to taxes and laws) are Anglicisms that aren't used in Japanese. English conventions aren't universal for all languages. -- benlisquare T•C•E 15:36, 3 November 2013 (UTC)


 * Sorry about the typo. My point is that, "obscene" is broader than simply "pornographic", and if sources specifically say "obscene", then that's enough justification to include that specific word rather than the un-sourced "pornographic" in the article.-- Arkhandar ( Talk • Contribs ) 15:49, 3 November 2013 (UTC)


 * Yes, "obscene" is broad, but given the context, there are limited potential options available. Unless these children were sharing Syrian jihadist beheading videos from LiveLeak, there isn't really anything else it could be (and even then, Japanese press wouldn't use わいせつ, they would use 極端な). The term in the Japanese context can only refer to specific cases. That said, if the wording was changed to "obscene imagery" I wouldn't be fully opposed to it; it's just I believe that clearly it would be common sense as to what "obscene" is being implied here. Obscene is a rough "dictionary" translation into an existing English word, and is the closest English word to the original Japanese term used; "わいせつ" derives from 猥褻, which is made up of the characters 猥 (molestation, indecency) and 褻 (licentious). Even though Japanese-English dictionaries translate わいせつ as "obscene", it doesn't mean that the word has identical usage as it would be used in English (e.g. the law cases mentioned above). Translation isn't a perfect concept, as one language's definitions may be slightly different to the closest word (not the exact word) in another. Per Japanese obscenity laws, things that are considered obscene specifically relate to sexual desire. However, per United States obscenity laws, this video of a bishop being beheaded in Syria is considered obscene. That same video would not be considered "obscene" in Japan, but rather "extreme", "graphic" or "violent", due to different societal attitudes regarding obscenity. -- benlisquare T•C•E 16:05, 3 November 2013 (UTC)
 * I don't read Japanese, but the English Nintendo announcement said "offensive material". Yes, one would believe that means porn but there is no conclusive evidence to support that theory.  Konveyor   Belt  16:40, 3 November 2013 (UTC)
 * "Yes, one would believe that means porn but there is no conclusive evidence to support that theory." - refer to the Asahi Shimbun newspaper report. Hell, there's also the Yomiuri Online and Tokyo Shimbun. Nintendo is a Japanese company that adheres to Japanese laws, and makes statements to Japanese police departments. There is no reason why Japanese sources should not be used. -- benlisquare T•C•E 16:57, 3 November 2013 (UTC)
 * If "obscene" isn't appropriate enough for this situation, then I suggest we return to "offensive material", since it already covers "pornography" and other subjects that users might find offensive, such as racism, swearing and others. In Japan, the biggest problem with Swapnote could be pornography and in North America the problem could be more broaden, justifying the use of "offensive material" in the PR announcement. Rewriting "offensive material" really is the best way to solve the problem.-- Arkhandar ( Talk • Contribs ) 18:01, 3 November 2013 (UTC)
 * My current first preference is "pornographic imagery", however I am also fine with "obscene imagery" as a second preference if editors are significantly opposed to it. I do not think that going back to "offensive material" is a valid idea though, as it is too euphemistic, and severely downgrades the severity of the situation in an inappropriate manner. The mainstream press in Japan is taking a more serious stance at the matter, and we should not be giving readers a false sense of triviality here on Wikipedia. We're not talking about generic gaming websites here, we're talking about top-selling, major newspapers with the highest of distribution and readership levels all over the nation. Just as how the Washington Post would be a more authoritative source than, say, Gizmodo, these sources are the top-grade line when it comes to WP:RS; downplaying the importance of these major newspapers simply because they are Japanese constitutes systemic bias. -- benlisquare T•C•E 11:38, 4 November 2013 (UTC)

Pedophilia case confirmed
Here we go. Now it looks like it's definitely a pedophilia case: Mainichi reports that charges for child pornography have also been filed against another man, aged 44, who had allegedly two girls—then aged 11 to 12—send nude photos through SwapNote, or "Itsu no Ma ni Koukan Nikki" (いつの間に交換日記) as it's called in Japan. This man, a resident of Aichi Prefecture, has confessed to the acts. This Mainichi Shimbun newspaper article confirms the above. -- benlisquare T•C•E 10:42, 6 November 2013 (UTC)
 * 2013-11-06, Accused Child Predator Used Nintendo's SwapNote Service, Kotaku


 * See? It wouldn't hurt anyone if you had waited until we got a concrete source stating what really happened. It would have saved us both quite some time. I hope we can learn from this though. I'll add both sources to the article. Thank you.-- Arkhandar ( Talk • Contribs ) 14:25, 8 November 2013 (UTC)

Reader feedback: goes off topic
165.248.247.140 posted this comment on November 13, 2013 (view all feedback).

"goes off topic"

Any thoughts?

Arkhandar ( Talk • Contribs ) 17:13, 18 November 2013 (UTC)


 * There is a lot of detail in the background and hardware sections (and others) that can be resonably shortened. The article might be a bit too long for its own good.  Konveyor   Belt  17:39, 18 November 2013 (UTC)
 * I don't think it gets "off-topic", but as KB says above, it seems like some of these subsections have been bloated to go into a little more detail than they need to be. Perhaps that's what the feedback comment meant? I don't usually pay much attention to feedback that vague though; In my experience, if they don't take the time to say what's actually wrong, chances are it wasn't a very well thought out idea to begin with. On topic,  Sergecross73   msg me   17:43, 18 November 2013 (UTC)


 * Thanks for your input. I'm doing some cleanup to some non-essential sections of the article, but there's only so much you can trim. It's a problem because the article is already bigger than it should and there are still two anemic sections, Reception and Sales, and there is so much to cover. The Swapnote section is also problematic in my opinion, since it's a little bigger than it should be yet I don't think it can stand an article on its own. The Media capabilities section is another dilema; so much to cover makes it way too cramped.-- Arkhandar ( Talk • Contribs ) 20:49, 23 November 2013 (UTC)


 * Does it not make more sense to leave the bulk of the Nintendo Letter Box information at what I think should be its main article, List of messaging applications for Nintendo game consoles?  Dark Toon  Link  10:22, 24 November 2013 (UTC)


 * It could be a good option, but the whole article just doesn't make any sense. Firstly, is way to detailed to be a proper list, and all of its sections are straight copies from other articles, except for Pictochat, which was the original article. I don't really see any point for that article to be maintained and it should be split asap. On thing we can do of course, is create an article for Swapnote.-- Arkhandar ( Talk • Contribs ) 11:49, 24 November 2013 (UTC)

Nintendo Zone
Currently, Nintendo Zone redirects to Nintendo World Store, and it shouldn't. Nintendo Zone refers not to the Nintendo World Store, but to a service on the Nintendo 3DS which allows downloads of demos and videos at select locations, not limited to Nintendo's own store, but rather encompassing a great number of retail locations, including McDonald's and Starbucks, among others. I'd like to ask an administrator to correct the redirect to Nintendo 3DS as the page is protected and I can't edit it myself.-- Arkhandar ( Talk • Contribs ) 02:08, 24 December 2013 (UTC)
 * I made the change. Let me know if anyone objects...though Arkhandar, your rationale makes sense, and the protection seems to be in place to keep copyrighted material off, so we should be fine. Sergecross73   msg me   15:24, 24 December 2013 (UTC)
 * Thanks :) -- Arkhandar ( Talk • Contribs ) 15:33, 24 December 2013 (UTC)
 * Close, but... you may want to consider pointing it to DS Download Station. This says it is an extension of that. « Ryūkotsusei »  04:50, 28 December 2013 (UTC)
 * Eh, that article is looking pretty rough. (Short and unrecerenced.) It in itself looks like a likely redirect candidate honestly... Sergecross73   msg me   18:36, 28 December 2013 (UTC)
 * Nintendo Zone is far more than just an enhanced Download Station though. 3DS systems (and I think even DS/DSi systems) have full Internet access when connected to a Nintendo Zone, something which the Download Station doesn't offer. Redirecting it to DS Download Station wouldn't really make much sense. --Thunderbird8 (talk) 19:50, 31 December 2013 (UTC)
 * I forgot to consider making that redirect an article. So move DS Download Station to Nintendo Zone. The Nintendo Zone service is an extension of what those stations already provide, so not surprisingly I've recently found this. Stations in Japan were planned to be converted into Nintendo Zones. « Ryūkotsusei »  20:37, 1 January 2014 (UTC)

Reader feedback: Give more info.
198.98.221.249 posted this comment on December 13, 2013 (view all feedback).

"Give more info."

Any thoughts?

Sipslice11 (talk) 22:06, 6 January 2014 (UTC)

Excuse me 198.98.221.249. You say that you found what you wanted to see yet you said "Give more info". Sipslice11 (talk) 22:06, 6 January 2014 (UTC)

CPU Speed.
CPU speed is a fundamental characteristic of any computer-based device. In fact, it's generally regarded as the defining characteristic.

It makes no difference at all if Nintendo one day announces "CPU speed is not important", and removes all references to if from their official documentation.

InternetMeme (talk) 13:50, 9 March 2014 (UTC)
 * Without a good source stating the speed it shouldn't be listed, I have my doubts about the Geek.com source, and even if they are reliable, where do they get it from? I've seen the number passed around forums etc but nothing reliable or from Nintendo.  Я ehevkor ✉ 13:58, 9 March 2014 (UTC)
 * As Rehevkor said, if Nintendo have not provided us a clock speed, and the CPU manufacturer hasn't, we cannot provide a clock speed, pure and simple. To do so would be WP:OR. Luke no 94  (tell Luke off here) 14:05, 9 March 2014 (UTC)
 * Agreed. "A bad source is better than nothing" type mentality is not how Wikipedia works. Sergecross73   msg me   15:05, 9 March 2014 (UTC)
 * Okay, so your objections are due to the source being unreliable. Is there a general agreement that Geek.com is unreliable? I've always though of them as fairly legitimate, at any rate. Anyway, fair enough, I'll try to find a reliable source.
 * Just for the record, however, a good digital electronics engineer can find out the speed of a CPU through analysis. Nintendo and ARM are not the only possible reliable sources.
 * InternetMeme (talk) 04:14, 10 March 2014 (UTC)
 * You can always ask at WP:VG/S's talk page to see if there's a consensus that its reliable...but I'm thinking its not going to fit Wikipedia's standards for a reliable source. Sergecross73   msg me   15:26, 10 March 2014 (UTC)

Source for SDXC support?
What is the source for the article's assertion that the 3DS supports 128 GB SDXC?

According to Nintendo's support site (http://en-americas-support.nintendo.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/517/kw/sd%20card), the 3DS, 3DS XL, and 2DS support SD up to 2 GB and SDHC up to 32 GB.

No mention is made of SDXC at all.

NiveusLuna 15:17, 22 August 2014 (UTC)

Edit: in fact, a search for sdxc yields no results at all.http://en-americas-support.nintendo.com/app/answers/list/p/430/kw/sdxc/search/1

NiveusLuna 15:24, 22 August 2014 (UTC)


 * Actually this support page does not describe an upper limit, although it does not mention SDXC compatibility at all. Just that SDHC cards larger than 4GB are supported. -- McDoob  AU93  15:26, 22 August 2014 (UTC)


 * Article's information does not conflict with the article I linked. No need to post it. :/ NiveusLuna 15:29, 22 August 2014 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by NiveusLuna (talk • contribs)

New 3DS / New 3DS LL Image
I'm just suggesting that there should be an image added to the section for the New Nintendo 3DS, since there is an image of every other type of 3DS. I know this is very new, but I'm sure some legitimate image can be dug up somewhere. I will look for one and add one if I can. Game ditor Talk 18:12, 29 August 2014 (UTC)

Region lock
Should this article mention something about region locking? As previous Nintendo DS has no region locking, making it unique for the 3DS --1.252.83.115 (talk) 11:45, 28 November 2014 (UTC)
 * It's already present in the chart. What else needs to be said about it? Sergecross73   msg me  12:03, 28 November 2014 (UTC)
 * I was thinking maybe adding specific region locks. What I mean by that is, for example that UK/Australian consoles/games are cpmptable with each other, making it not fully region locked, specifically. If this is already listed, where in the article is it mentioned? I must of have missed it. --1.252.83.158 (talk) 01:14, 30 November 2014 (UTC)
 * Is this region locking specific to the 3DS?
 * Do third party sources discuss this as a noteworthy aspect of the 3DS? Sergecross73   msg me  02:46, 30 November 2014 (UTC)

filming only seems to be possible on the xl version
i tested it myself to be certain. i updated my small 3ds but it still cant film. it works on my 3ds xl though. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.208.59.120 (talk) 10:07, 18 May 2013 (UTC)
 * Better find a source to confirm this before putting it in the article. I didn't believe there was really any difference between the 2 besides size-related things. (bigger screen, SD card, etc) Sergecross73   msg me   14:52, 18 May 2013 (UTC)
 * Completely untrue. I can shoot video with both my Nintendo 3DS and 3DS XL. System software is exactly the same for both systems.--Arkhandar (talk) 16:56, 18 May 2013 (UTC)
 * Yeah it's untrue, unless you mean something else... ~ Pokebub22 (talk) 21:52, 18 May 2013 (UTC)

I do agree as you can film and take photographs as long as you have free blocks of space. Sipslice11 (talk) 22:09, 6 January 2014 (UTC) You need an SD card to take videos 32.215.146.1 (talk) 01:45, 2 December 2014 (UTC)

Battery life
In the article it says the battery life is between 3 and 5 hours while playing 3DS games, but that seems really short to me. I've played for longer than that without charging.2602:252:D79:2010:5DBF:45CA:78DC:3B9 (talk) 01:49, 2 December 2014 (UTC)
 * I agree that it seems short, however it is based on Nintendo's official claims, and I'm afraid your experiences are not a reliable source. Luke no 94  (tell Luke off here) 01:56, 2 December 2014 (UTC)

External links modified
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Nintendo 1DS is a fake
Someone who edited the page thought the 1DS was a real product -- I'm sure in good faith; it looks pretty believable. For reference, it's a fake. Only the 2DS and 3DS are real. (: CaseyPenk (talk) 00:14, 5 September 2013 (UTC)

And if anyone needs proof this is not real, this is straight from the website itself: "*Not actually a real device or price. See dreams for details." Erick (talk) 00:55, 5 September 2013 (UTC)

The Nintendo 1Ds sounds like a scam Dead-J (talk) 17:50, 14 July 2016 (UTC)

Nothing on Switch?
Switch is a hybrid, meaning both handheld and console, why is there nothing about it on the 3DS page if there's one on Wii U's page? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2602:304:CFD3:2EE0:CD2D:AD6:F59C:3A7C (talk) 22:48, 20 October 2016 (UTC)
 * Well, it seems to be unconfirmed how exactly to classify the Switch. It's a console/handheld hybrid. Its kind of a successor to both, and kind of a successor to neither. There's no consensus that it belongs on the Wii U article yet either - people just keep on adding and removing it, and you happened to catch it at a time where it was still on there. Sergecross73   msg me  14:23, 21 October 2016 (UTC)

Game Boy Advanced
Yes, there WERE ten Game Boy Advanced games released on the EShop exclusively for the Ambassador edition. The list is here. No, they are not generally available, but they were released for free as part of the promotion, as the source and article state. -- ferret (talk) 14:16, 12 June 2017 (UTC)
 * Yes, - please check the source (http://www.ign.com/articles/2011/07/28/what-do-you-think-about-nintendos-big-3ds-announcement) - Your edits keep on getting undone because they are factually incorrect. It is correct that GBA games aren't generally compatible, but Nintendo did make a certain selection of GBA games available to early adopters, which is what is being covered in the sentences you keep altering. Please stop changing this.  Sergecross73   msg me  14:25, 12 June 2017 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 22 December 2017
Please add this under "Continued Support".

On a December 8, 2017 interview with Bloomberg (https://www.bloomberg.com/news/videos/2017-12-08/nintendo-s-fils-aime-sees-robust-holiday-sales-video), Reggie Fils-Aime said "We are very committed to our Nintendo 3DS business, and what that business has shown us is that in addition to having a machine like the Nintendo Switch at a $299 price point, that there's a market place for dedicated handheld products that are targeted to a different demographic, typically a younger demographic, a demographic that's just getting engaged with Nintendo properties. And so we believe that making sure we continue to appeal to that younger demographic is going to be very important for us going into the future. So from that standpoint, does that support a two device strategy? It absolutely does." Techmaster12 (talk) 02:12, 22 December 2017 (UTC)
 * Is this an accurate transcript? Because I don't think any 3DS variant has ever cost $299... Sergecross73   msg me  03:51, 22 December 2017 (UTC)
 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: The requested edit is far too long to just to convey that Nintendo intends to continue support the 3DS, a fact already documented in that section and cited to a more-accessible source. Eggishorn (talk) (contrib) 21:42, 28 December 2017 (UTC)

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Proposal: Separate list of Circle-Pad Pro compatible games
Hello, i have come across the question which games are supported by the Circle-Pad Pro, and/or the C-stick of the New Nintendo 3DS. Actually, a list of these games, at least the CPP-compatible ones, is contained in this article.

I would like to propose to move the list to a separate page, because


 * Allows for mixing of CPP-compatible games and n3DS C-stick compatible games on one page (otherwise we would have to have two lists, or redundant information).


 * Makes the information easier to be goggle'd, and easier to be referred to.


 * Helps focusing the article (list of CPP-compatible games is not so important for the average reader of the 3DS article).


 * Is done the same way for other compatibility lists, such as List of games that support Wii MotionPlus.


 * It is easier to justify why the list is incomplete, e.g. Luigi's Mansion missing at the moment. The dynamic list template can be used.

The downside is that such a list may (now or in the future) be considered not compliant with the standards of Wikipedia, e.g. WP:NOTCATALOGUE. OTOH, if this is/will be considered so, then why would we include the information here?!? Wolfbjoe (talk) 11:14, 27 November 2018 (UTC)
 * These kinds of lists are considered a violation of WP:NOTCATALOG. WP:VG has been steadily merging all the various lists of this nature over the past year, new ones should not be created. It definitely should not be split out, and if it doesn't bring any real value here (it doesn't), then remove it. -- ferret (talk) 12:13, 27 November 2018 (UTC)
 * Seconded. For the reasons Ferret gives, this isn’t really a project for Wikipedia. Sergecross73   msg me  13:38, 27 November 2018 (UTC)