Talk:No-chamber/Archive 1

Speculation
As pointed out by the anonymous editor the paragraphs below are speculation, though some of it might be suitable for a prescience (Dune) article. It has therefore been moved to the talk page.

FROM HERE The concept of the no-chamber is very simple; an oracle cannot predict the actions of another oracle. In Dune Messiah a Guild Navigator was used to hide conspirators from the visions of Paul Atreides. A no-chamber then emulates a human oracle. A no-chamber then has some of the abilities of Guild Navigators, and the same technologies were used to construct no-ships; a No-ship could also function as a no-chamber.

Why an oracle cannot predict or 'see' another oracle can be explained in the following way: It is argued that if all things have a cause and an effect, then at the very beginning of all things there is a stable element from which everything is derived. The nature of an oracle works in a similar fashion; an oracle could see to an extent the causes and effects at work in the current universe. It does this by taking existing grains of data of the universe, and construct a future-present-past from the bits of universe that are available to them. Since oracles can see\construct causes and effects, they can manipulate or avoid the ones that are viewable to them. In this sense oracles are free from the cause and effect universe (also see The Matrix), and because they are free they can act independently creating any extent of the future they like or are able to. They are very much like the stable base mentioned above. Naturally since an oracle uses the predictability of the cause and effect time system, they are not able to predict other oracles whom like themselves are free from cause and effect.

It should be noted that since an oracle can only see and manipulate an extent of the future-past-present, they are able to be predicted by a craftier, a higher caliber, or a creative oracle. This was demonstrated in the last parts of the God Emperor of Dune when Leto examined everything that he was not able to predict by prescient vision, pieced it together, and he was able to see what he was not able to by prescient vision. This being said, a no-chamber is not completely foolproof.

(TO HERE)

REGARDING THE SECTION "FROM HERE TO HERE" WHOEVER WROTE THIS IS NOT WELL VERSED IN DUNE, BECAUSE THE THE NO CHAMBER RELIES ON THE EFFECTS OF THE HOLTZMANN FIELD TO CREATE DISTORTION OF SPACE AND TIME AROUND A SPACE, WHICH PREVENTS IT TO BE DETECTED BY ANY MEANS EXCEPT THE NAKED EYE. THE ABOVE IS RIDICULOUS SPECULATION BY SOMEONE WHO NEEDS TO READ THE ENTIRE SERIES BEOFORE POSTING HIS CONJECTURE OF HOW A NO-FIELD WORKS.

No-Room
I thought that the first time the concept of "no-whatever" was introduced, (God Emperor of Dune) it was called a "No-Room", and yet that term is not searchable by Wikipedia. It should probably be added as some kind of disambiguation for this article.--Lazarus Plus 05:53, 21 November 2005 (UTC)

Also referred to as a "no-globe". They produce a "mimetic field" using a variation of the Holtzmann effect, as stated about the no-globe on Gammu that Teg hides in. I agree with Mr. Bold Letter, the first description is filled with intepretation that is not necessarily accurate. The "visible to the naked eye" theory, while still debated, is supported by the fact that Dar-es-balat was deeply buried as was the no-globe on gammu (required access through a cave you may recall)--thus, they probably are "visible"