Talk:Normal, Illinois

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twin town?
I'm going to bring the discussion over from Bloomington, Illinois, I've never heard BN called "twin town" has anyone else? Otherwise, I think it should be removed. --Donutey 04:42, 6 June 2006 (UTC)


 * I have lived here since 1975 and the first time I heard it was in here. Lets remove it.--

fun vandalism note
While it can probably be reinserted into the article (after rewording), I've removed the following note from the article's "trivia" section, pending citation:
 * One fact the article fails to mention is a period of time during the early 1970s after an adventurous vandal had climbed the water tower and spray-painted "AB" in front of the town's name.

Tom e rtalk 03:00, 26 March 2006 (UTC)
 * Well, I never took a picture of it, and I don't know if anyone else did either. What was amazing to we students at the time was how long it took for the city fathers to fix it. It sat that way for months. I don't know if "fun vandalism" is the right word. Whoever did it, the joke was over quickly and it was just an eyesore after that. Wahkeenah 06:00, 26 March 2006 (UTC)
 * The "fun" wasn't meant to modify "vandalism", it was meant to modify "vandalism note". Tom e rtalk  05:58, 21 January 2007 (UTC)

Downtown Normal
I just saw someone reverted the "uptown" crap, good work. Kudos, I have no idea why it said uptown.A mcmurray 00:56, 19 February 2007 (UTC)


 * I agree. Been here 32 years and its DOWNTOWN, not uptown.  Can't be an uptown without a downtown and a midtown.. and the whole thing is only about 2 blocks wide from north to south anyway, and if you did a lefttown / righttown / midtown thing, it still isnt big enough anyway.  Besides, uptown simply sounds stupid. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.113.205.130 (talk)


 * It may have been a bad faith edit. We shall make sure it doesn't change. I watch the page for vandals so it should be no problem.A mcmurray 15:53, 20 February 2007 (UTC)


 * A McMurray: Well- I don't know if you heard- but the town council decided it should be called "uptown". So, I guess it is officially now known as "uptown".... thats why it said that, but its still pretty corny..........


 * I have heard now. That's the dumbest thing I have ever heard.A mcmurray 16:58, 21 February 2007 (UTC)

Here's a town council reference to "uptown" and another. So, should the article reflect local preferences or the official version? Rklawton 16:49, 21 February 2007 (UTC)


 * As far as I know there is no "official" designation for Downtown Normal, although it is ubiquitously referred to as Downtown Normal in the Bloomington Normal area. While it really doesn't matter, both words mean basically the same thing, I think the nomenclature, in the article, should reflect usage considering that there is no official name. Basically what I am saying is that the place has historically been known as downtown, marketing campaigns aside.


 * I don't know how far this Uptown thing has gone but it appears to be nothing more than a PR campaign to bring attention to the redevelopment plan and differentiate itself from Downtown Bloomington. I don't know if we should be in the business of supporting PR nonsense. Just my two cents.A mcmurray 16:57, 21 February 2007 (UTC)


 * That's a good question. The challenge is - is this "official" PR nonsense (ie, from the city's leaders), or is this just local developers?  Rklawton 18:12, 21 February 2007 (UTC)


 * Either source is just as dubious in this instance, in my opinion. Neither source could be considered reliable because they both have vested interests in portraying the area the way they see fit.A mcmurray 18:28, 21 February 2007 (UTC)

Well, if there's been an official name change, we'll need to report it as such. Rklawton 18:52, 21 February 2007 (UTC)


 * This appears to have been decreed but would need a reference, such as the ordinance. Regardless I doubt this name change was or is without controversy, this should be noted as well. As well as the fact that anyone who has lived there for more than a year or so would still say Downtown Normal.A mcmurray 19:01, 21 February 2007 (UTC)

yeah, i changed it originally, and i'll change it back from uptown to downtown any time anyone changes it until they ban my account. or until there's a point made in the entry that it is, at least, up in the air. i kind of don't really care, but like all decisions that were made by and for money and not the people themselves, i feel i have a vested interest in paying attention, having lived here all my life and all. the truth of the matter is the town council spent a bunch of money to buy signs that said uptown normal... i'm uncertain if they even have the actual power to rename a neighborhood, although i'm sure they'd disagree. but it was very much done quietly and not with a great deal of good faith, with the purpose of trying to make rich people more comfortable here and poor people unwelcome. i suppose if someone could point me down the rabbit hole that absolutely proved that the TC had the ability to change anything about the name they wanted, i'd shut up. but i really doubt that's going to be the case. User:me/me 25:84 31 Feburary 2007 (FTW!)


 * "Downtown" is descriptive and meaningful. "Uptown" is hype. Wahkeenah 02:19, 7 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Has it been long enough now that the angry vandalism kiddies have graduated from ISU and we can cut out the "in 2007 the town council renamed downtown" part? I cannot imagine there being value in mentioning "oh by the way this used to be called downtown!" except as protest disguised as history.  This from a 25+-year resident, and decidedly non-rich-person, by the way. 96.227.32.29 (talk) 03:34, 14 April 2011 (UTC)


 * I think the answer is that yes, it had been long enough. Guess all the angsty ISU students vandalizing the page because they were afraid of change, however minor, finally graduated and lost interest? 2601:193:8300:1380:D1B9:CB7C:E517:4D30 (talk) 03:00, 28 April 2017 (UTC)

Vandals
This page has been hit pretty hard by vandals lately, please watch it.A mcmurray (talk • contribs) 15:01, 6 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I just reverted some stuff that may have been missed previously. WLU 15:08, 6 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Cool, I have requested some folks from WikiProject Illinois to keep an eye on it along with myself and another user who is a self described "anti-vandal patriot." Things should be okay now. There was a lot, so much that I couldn't really find a version to revert to so I just went through and started removing stuff that looked like vandalism or spam.A mcmurray (talk • contribs) 15:12, 6 March 2007 (UTC)
 * If you actually know anything about the town, you might want to check the people I just removed, I couldn't find a link to Normal so I took 'em out, but that doesn't mean the links aren't there. WLU 15:14, 6 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Until I get up to speed on this article, I will only be able to revert content only or obvious cases of vandalism. I can't remember the last time I was in Illinois. Ronbo76 15:20, 6 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Yeah I used to live nearby. I'll check em out.A mcmurray (talk • contribs) 15:23, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

I just reverted a line in the geography section that called the town 11.3 square miles of corn stubble. User:East-West

Change to geolinks
Geolinks is the preferred mapping engine these days for Wikipedia. It can be scaled at cityscale for a large town; hoodscale for an intermediate suburb or photo for a smaller community like Normal, IL. In addition, the photo scale is useful for showing a picture (if available of a distinct object/building/etc.) that when the scale is brought down on WikiMapia displays really nicely. Clicking on the WikiMapia link, you will now see the community. Plus, you can see a university to the west along with some domed stadium (if you zoom in using the plus sign near the top left). Cheers, Ronbo76 15:44, 6 March 2007 (UTC)


 * That would be Illinois State University and Redbird Arena. A mcmurray (talk • contribs) 16:13, 6 March 2007 (UTC)


 * It works real nice on arenas, local landmarks, bridges, etc. The coordinates can be found by opening a WikiMapia entry to the nearby item you would like mapped by dragging the map until the crosshairs are over the landmark. Then in the upper left corner, select Add Place and a box will be superimposed over the item. You can enlarge the box or even change the scale as appropriate. Once it is defined, the coordinates will be displayed when you save it. Unfortunately, you need to convert the minutes to decimal minutes, i.e., 40.3060N 89.9910W would required the .3060 and .9910 to be divided by 60 to get the correct decimal minutes. Ronbo76 19:59, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

This is nice
It is nice to see some constructive activity around this page. Thanks to everybody who is trying to improve this article. I am trying to get WikiProject Illinois to make it their next collaboration. The current one, Springfield, Illinois, has gone really well.IvoShandor 14:54, 8 March 2007 (UTC)


 * I would recommend some photos. One of the red wikilink Children's Museum (outside) would be high on my list. Maybe even a gallery. Ronbo76 14:56, 8 March 2007 (UTC)


 * I tend to lean toward using commons to link to pages there as opposed to adding bulky galleries here. They can have long load times on slow connections, and Wikipedia is a great source of knowledge for the developing world. : )IvoShandor 15:02, 8 March 2007 (UTC)

Unreferenced stuff
Following is the trivia section, it is unreferenced. The burden is on the editors who added it to provide references not on me who removed it, please don't readd it as a trivia section instead integrate it, once referenced, into the appropriate sections. See WP:V if this is problematic but it shouldn't be. IvoShandor 11:50, 27 May 2007 (UTC)

Trivia

 * The first Steak 'n Shake restaurant was located in Normal. The original building, on Main Street near the creek, burned in the late 1950s and was rebuilt on-site, where it continued as a Steak 'n Shake franchise for several more decades. It was finally sold and became a Monical's Pizza.
 * Mitsubishi's vehicle manufacturing facility in Normal is the company's only plant in North America.
 * The mayor of Normal will pay US$50 to anyone who can tell him a joke about his town he hasn't heard before.
 * Musician Marilyn Manson mentioned Normal is his autobiography The Long Hard Road Out of Hell. Manson wrote about his 1997 tour stop in Normal as part of the Dead To The World Tour. Manson's outrageous style evoked some controversy on his visit to the generally-conservative area.
 * In episode 12 ("Tornado Days") of the short-lived science fiction TV series Eerie, Indiana second prize for the 87th annual Tornado Day sweepstakes was an all expense paid trip to Eerie's "sister city" Normal, Illinois.
 * Mat Devine of the alternative rock band Kill Hannah attended Illinois State University in Normal, and actually met the girl named Hannah at a party in Normal who quickly broke his heart and motivated him to begin his band.
 * An episode of the science fiction TV series First Wave is named "Normal Illinois" and the setting is supposed to be Normal, Illinois. In real life, First Wave was filmed on location in Vancouver, BC.
 * Ten Minutes from Normal by Karen Hughes takes its name from the town.
 * Alternative rock band The Junior Varsity is from Normal.
 * Actor/Actresses: John Malkovich, Laurie Metcalf, Gary Cole, Sean Hayes, and Judith Ivey all attended Illinois State University.
 * The Normal Community West High School Wind Ensemble performed at Carnegie Hall in the Spring of 2004
 * The Normal Community West High School Marching Band Performed at the Fiesta Bowl in 2001 and will be performing there this year (2007)

Improving the article
I added a transportation section. Feel free to edit.

I'll get some photos pretty soon, perhaps this weekend. Any nominations? I think the Watterson Towers, The Normal Theater, and Constitution Trail are no-brainers. ISU Homecoming Parade is October 13th, so that might be a candidate. —Preceding unsigned comment added by East-West (talk • contribs) 17:16, 4 October 2007 (UTC)

Attractions
I am working with the Bloomington-Normal Area Convention & Visitor's Bureau to make the Wikipedia page more user-friendly for those wishing to plan a visit to the area. I have added the attractions section and I have made some additions to the transportation and education sections.

All of my citations are to the Bloomington-Normal Convention & Visitor's Bureau Area Visitor's Guide with direct approval from the author, himself. None of the material I am posting is in violation of copyrights.

If you are concerned about anything I have posted please feel free to let me know. Bloomington-Normal Area Visitors &amp; Convention Bureau (talk) 18:25, 8 February 2008 (UTC)


 * Wikipedia is an encyclopedia, not a tourist guide. The attractions section looks very touristy, and I do have a problem with that. Please try to keep neutrality. Sorchah (talk) 03:33, 9 April 2008 (UTC)

Origin of name
For a town with such an unusual and distinctive name shouldn't there be a mention of how that name came about? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.129.86.205 (talk) 22:17, 5 April 2012 (UTC)

The town got its name from the local university, then called Illinois State Normal University - a school where people went to learn to become teachers. As the town grew around it, it was named 'Normal' after the University, and the University came to be Illinois State University. (https://www.normal.org/index.aspx?NID=382 and https://www.normal.org/index.aspx?NID=378 ) Kelvari (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 09:53, 11 April 2016 (UTC)

Weather Boxes
Can we get Weather Boxes on the Normal and Bloomington pages? They're on about 75-80% of other town pages. I find them valuable when looking at municipality pages on Wikipedia to get a better idea of how climate differs from one town to another. I'm not that good at formatting, otherwise I'd do it myself. East-West

Population History
A while ago, I put a box on this page listing the census population over 70 years, in an attempt to show the dramatic population growth. It was taken down (I read) because someone said that it made the town look small. The town of Bloomington doesn't have one either, for the same reason, I suspect. Isn't that an important thing to know about a city or town, when it had its largest growth?

By the way, here's the data for Normal's historical population from US Census: 1890  3459	N/A 1900  3796	9.7% 1910   4024	6.0% 1920   5143	27.8% 1930   6768	31.6% 1940   6983	3.2% 1950   9772	39.9% 1960  13357	36.7% 1970  26396	97.6% 1980  35672	35.1% 1990  40023	12.2% 2000  45386	13.4% 2010  52497	15.7% East-West


 * Per WP:USCITY, I see no reason not to add the information back in. "making the town look small" is not a good reason for removal. Feel free to add it back in. Cheers Dkriegls (talk) 21:07, 23 April 2012 (UTC)


 * I added a census table, using the data from above, and verified the 2010 census. •  Sbmeirow  •  Talk  •  06:42, 19 May 2012 (UTC)

Questionable Naming Origin
I was surprised to see the following statement on the origin of the Normal town name:


 * The name "Normal" is an English corruption of the original name. Like many cities in the region, it was originally settled by the French. The earliest expedition to the location termed it "Noire Mal" in their journal, an appellation that denotes "dark and evil". As the journal was later discovered, and no survivors returned from the expedition, the reason for this daunting entry is unknown.

Because this statement has no citation, was added by an anonymous account with only a single contribution in their history, and provides a rationale for the 'Normal' naming that suspiciously arrives at the same result as the obvious Normal School history, I have removed it to this location for further discussion and research. --Mindfrieze (talk) 16:24, 17 November 2014 (UTC)

External links modified
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External links modified
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Normal and alcohol
When I was in Normal (1971-73) it was dry and we had to go to Bloomington to get a drink. This seems like something worth mentioning in the History section. Details should be in the Pantagraph but I can't access it from Europe. Also, there were apparently beer riots at ISU in 1984. Roundtheworld (talk) 12:45, 9 September 2021 (UTC)