Talk:Oedipus/Archive 1

Initial
This discussion page is very poorly constructed. It needs very serious editing. The main article is much better in facts and details. (Kacser (talk) 17:44, 25 December 2007 (UTC))

warning
Why no spoiler warning before detailing the story.....Hollywood epics are treated with more respect.


 * It's not a question of respect. Plenty of people don't like spoiler warnings. No has put one on this page because everyone already knows the ending. In fact, the ending is given in the beginning of the original story, in the form of a prophecy. Mak (talk)  15:05, 14 August 2006 (UTC)


 * I didn't know the ending.
 * And just because a play tells you how it'll end, doesn't mean it will end that way -- or that there won't be a Big Twist so the ending has a completely different meaning to what you expected. Just cos it's old don't mean it has to be treated like it wasn't fiction and given the respect any modern stuff would be.


 * Plus the fact that Greek audiences would have been very familiar with the story including how it ended. The joy of seeing the stories of the great families played out was not in seeing how it ends (like in modern drama/film) but in how it is played out.  Usually I'm all for spoiler warnings, but in this case the play relies on the audience knowing that Oedipus is the traitor for whom he searches.  It's not a detective story where the audience has to guess that Oedipus is the killer, it's a painful sort of irony where the audience has to knowingly watch Oedipus bring on his own destruction. --In Defense of the Artist 19:47, 15 January 2007 (UTC)


 * The "Oedipus Complex," and thus the end of the story, is common knowledge, I think. 152.23.50.59 18:31, 28 February 2007 (UTC)

Different Endings
When Antigone kills herself it is said on the Oedipus page that Creon's son attacks Creon and then kills himself. When Creon's wife hears about the deaths she kills herself. On the Antigone page it says that Creon's son tried but fails to kill him and when Creon's wife hears of her son's death she kills herself. Which one is it?


 * Haemon attempts to kill Creon but is unsuccessful. Creon is still alive at the end of Antigone. --Must WIN 01:18, 17 November 2006 (UTC)

HELP...
Is there a significance to the fact that the story starts and ends @ the same place...(in front of the palace steps)... —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Wiki1000000 (talk • contribs) 00:50, 11 December 2006 (UTC).

Oedipus at Colonus and Antigone section
Why is it that the plot of Antigone is described in full first, in which she dies through suicide, and then details of Oedipus at Colonus are described? Antigone is still much alive in this play and the Colonus part is an incredibly clear afterthought. You can't have someone describe the death of Antigone, and then have them describe the death of her father, when she was present.DaBears34 05:55, 27 January 2007 (UTC)


 * I came here to make the same comment. The way it is now the storyline is jerky. Maybe it is because Antigone was written before ...Colonus? I'll try to switch the sections around, if someone objects, please feel free to revert to the original. idiotoff 03:43, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

Pronunciation
How is Oedipus pronounced? Should that be put at the beginning of the article? - Im.a.lumberjack 23:34, 6 February 2007 (UTC)


 * When I was learning Greek in the mid-70s it was pronounced "Eedipus". --ukexpat 19:49, 27 April 2007 (UTC)

Last Name?
Did Oedipus have a last Name?

AJBUCLDIEAFN 11


 * No. In ancient Greece, nobody had a last name. Chl 15:46, 17 March 2007 (UTC)

Untrue... U see

Possible Publishing Misnomer
Is there any difference between Oedipus Tyrannus and Oedipus The King?

Or are they the same story?

216.139.13.17 21:14, 11 July 2007 (UTC)


 * They're the same. Oedipus Tyrannus is a Latin-ish rendering of the original Greek title, Oἰδίπoυς τύραννoς (Oidipous Tyrannos would be more accurate); "Oedipus the king" is an English translation, though tyrannos could also be rendered as "ruler" or "tyrant." Oedipus Rex is the Latin version of the title, and because it was traditional for many centuries to refer to works of Greek literature by Latin titles, is still a common way of referring to the play. --Akhilleus (talk) 22:34, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

Which is more suitable here, BC or BCE?
After several years of editing without mention of BC or BCE, the convention was introduced in the past few months. Which is the suitable convention for this Greek myth, before we get one or the other too deeply embedded: BC or BCE? My own preferences are too well known to intrude them. --Wetman 20:38, 10 August 2007 (UTC)

Corrected the summary of Septem's spurious ending.
A previous author suggested that Seven against Thebes tacked-on ending contained the whole of Antigones plot. This is incorrect. I changed it to give an accurate account of the play's second ending.Ifnkovhg 03:57, 1 October 2007 (UTC)

Added a bit about Oedipus vs. Oedipais.
I may add to it if I can find the sources. Ifnkovhg 07:55, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

Pink-haired Polyneices?
This article is too riddled with embedded juvenile scribbles to bother editing. Off my Watchlist. Are there any adults monitoring this?--Wetman 14:52, 1 November 2007 (UTC)

Oed (nickname)
In my own discussions about the play Oedipus the King, I have always referred to the character Oedipus as "Oed". It's a colloquial nickname that adds connection to the character. No, I don't really have a way to cite that, I suppose, however, I wanted to just make sure the Wikipedia person who messaged me knew that these were not "untruths". I have never posted any erroneous additions to any Wikipedia page.

Guillaume G. (talk) 01:26, 19 December 2007 (UTC)

Reinserted "Oedipais" section.
Someone deleted it, saying there was "no jusitification" for the interpretation. That's balderdash. There are two cited authors who advance the "Oedipais" theory, supported by ancient testimonia. I don't necessarily endorse it, but it's out there. We shouldn't delete sourced content just because we disagree with it. Ifnkovhg (talk) 05:23, 25 December 2007 (UTC)

WHO BECAME KING AFTER OEDIPUS ?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Creon : However, when the truth is revealed about Jocasta and Oedipus requests to be exiled, it is Creon who grants his wish and takes the throne in his stead.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oedipus: In Sophocles' Antigone, when Oedipus stepped down as King of Thebes he gave the kingdom to his two sons, —Preceding unsigned comment added by Niels Flyger (talk • contribs) 12:15, 7 December 2009 (UTC)

Lead tag
Hi

The articles lead is way too long and needs cutting down to a summary of the article. At present it contains almost as much as the body of text.

Chaosdruid (talk) 00:51, 11 July 2010 (UTC)

unsigned/undated comments
The following comments were unsigned and undated, and therefore not properly parsed by the archival bot. -TinGrin 15:44, 28 October 2010 (UTC)

Introduction
The intro reads: "Oedipus was the son of Laius and Jocasta and became king of Thebes after killing his father, solving the riddle of the Sphinx and unknowingly marrying his mother. After Oedipus is king, his sons fight over the throne and kill each other."

This wording is for good reason. All versions of Oedipus share just a few facts - he kills his father, marries his mother, becomes king, his sons kill each other. But the versions vary on the details. Even the Sphinx is not necessarily universal, but pretty common. Why does Oedipus become king? Some say because he marries the Queen, his mom. Some say as a reward for the Sphinx. Why "after Oedipus IS king"? Because, in some stories he dies and others he steps down.

Oedipus' death
- How does Oedipus die?

Oedipus dies of old age during the events of Oedipus at Colonus. I think that Antigone is sentenced to be locked in a cave with a guard, not to be buried alive. At least, that's what Sophocles writes Whoops, started new discussion by accident.

Yes, Antigone was sentenced to a cave, but when Creon and his son (who was to marry Antigone) were going to the cave to let her go, they found her dead (she killed herself).

Wait, I thought that Antigone went back home, and then after the 7 against Thebes, pitched a fit about who gets buried, buried everyone, and then went off and died. Right?


 * Different stories say different things. Originally, he dies is battle as king and this is changed to him stepping and dying later.

Literary references
Who wrote Oedipus the King? How is tragedy portrayed in Oedipus?

Two people, that I know of, Sophocles and either Euripides or Aeschylus. The latter, I think. Tragedy is very strange in this plays, since it isn't Oedipus' fault at all, instead Jocasta's and fate's. This breaks the rules of Greek tragedy. Then again, you could argue that Oedipus teasing Tiresias (who then revealed all) caused the problem, and thus it is his fault, giving him the tragic flaw.

Oedipus
Hi, I am reading Oedipus in high school, I just finished reading the whole book actually of the three plays combined together. Oedipus, Oedipus Rex and Antigone:

In my opinion I find that it is really funny how every king of Thebes ignores the prophecy of the oracle and then dies. Also I noticed that Creon the one who gets the throne after Oedipus' death allows his son Hamion to marry Oedipus' daughter. My question is this that did the Greeks marry their daughters in family?

How Laius was cursed - never heard of this part
I read the Oedipus trilogy back in high school and it did not mention the part about how Laius raped a young boy and was cursed by the father. Guess the publishers didn't want pedophilia in high school books, I guess (though gay sex seems to be a part of ancient Greek culture for some weird reason).

-Zombine.

Removed Laius curse, if someone puts it back in, give a citation.

Swollen ankles
I thought Oedipus translated to Swollen Ankles, and he was named thus because his Ankles were swollen as a result of being peirced when he was a baby. That's what it said in "Oedipus the King".

Break in the story
There seems to be a break in the narrative between the second and third paragraphs? How did he get to the party?

Re: break in the story
Never mind. I spoke too soon. I reread it and I see what the reference is now.