Talk:Olaf Tryggvason

Christianisation
There should be some careful delineation between the Christianization efforts of Olaf I and Olaf II of Norway. The latter, perhaps wrongly, is often considered the first Norwegian persecutor of those who would not convert to Christianity. There is a brief mention of it in this article. There is also a drawing which references a persecuting practice that is not alluded to in the article text. I worry that someone with some knowledge of Olaf II added these items ignorant of the fact that Olaf I is not Saint Olav. &mdash; BozoTheScary 01:18, 10 September 2006 (UTC)


 * BozoTheScary's notifcation is of importancy. I am correcting the misinformation about King Olaf Tryggvason asserting that he was the first christian king of Norway. King Hákon Aðalsteinsfóstri, son of King Harald Fairhair was sent to England, and fostered by the first king of all England, King Aðalsteinn. King Aðalsteinn is reckoned as the Charlemagne of England. It is thus interesting that the closest allies of King Aðalsteinn on the continent was the Liudolfings of the emerging Saxon East Francia, the Ottonian dynasty, soon to win the Iron Crown, when pope John XII annoints King Otto, son of Henry the Fowler as emperor of the Roman Reich. This Roman Empire, that will not be termed the Holy Roman Empire until the Hohenzoller dynasty will conquer the Iron Crown a few hundred years later, was merely approximately 72 years old when, putatively speaking, Harald son of King Halfdan the Black became king of all Norway. The form of christianity, that instituted the Rule of St. Benedict as the all-encompassing rule of an evangelic christian life, denoting all other forms of pious religious livelihood as heretic, was elaborated to a huge extent at christian centers of learning in the realm of the Anglo-Saxon dynasty of which King Aðalsteinn pertained. The Papacy in Rome had until now been merely one of five holy sees, since the the Pentarchy was instituted as the organisation of the christian world as the territorial Christendom of New Rome, the formal name of the Byzantine Empire. The Pentarchy that made christianity a territorial christendom were consisting of the holy sees of Jerusalem, Antioch, Alexandria, Miklagarð (Istanbul in Norse parlage) and Rome. It came into legal effect by Emperor Justinian I, and reflects to this day the fourth schism of the Catholic Church; the first reflecting the Arian controversy and the institutionalisation of the Church as the Religion of the New Roman Empire of Byzants. Already Emperor Theodosius I who summoned the second synod - AD381 - had divided the New Roman Empire into five dioceses: Diocese of Egypt suzerain to the Bishop of Alexandria, the East, suzerain to Antioch, Diocese of Asia, suzerain to the Bishop of Ephesus, Diocese of Pontus, suzerain to the Bishop of Ceasarea Cappadocia]], and finally Diocese of Thrace, suzerain to the Bishop of Heraclea, later Bishop of Constantinople. The legacy of the fourth ecumenical council is what is called Chalcedonian Christianity, named after where the fourth synod was held. This council dealed with the schism that still is regarded as the great schism by oriental christians, in which the Copts and Syriac christians became anathemized along with the Nestorians. The copts and syriacs were attempted appeased, with some success, by the fifth ecumenical council. The Chalcedonian christianity comprises the Roman Catholic, the Greek Orthodox, along with Orthodox Russian and Serbian and more), Anglican, and other Protestants, such as Lutheran-evangelical and Calvinist christian congregations. This imply that non-chalcedonian christians are seen as anathema, and has been supressed and persecuted within the realms of christendom, with the particular exceptions of Armenia and Ethiopia, which have been regarded as territorial christendom, but non-Chalcedonian. This was an enourmous digression, or as I hope, bacground information relating to the question of christianization of Norway. In AD 977 did high king Valdemar of Garðariki as he was regarded by his contemporary Norse relatives - Great Prince and Saint Vladimir of Kiev as seen by later European hisoriographers - enter the Trondheim Fjord in order to visit the ruler of Norway,  Hákon Earl, of Hlaðe. This is curious, as Hákon Jarl Sigurðarson is told of as holding on to the Ásatru religion of the northern lands, even after his baptism in AD 975. He exiled the roman catholic clergymen assigned to him following his formal conversion, due to his allegiance with the second king of a united historical Denmark, King Harald Bluetooth Gormson. All the speak of Danish control before this time, in areas which in our days are thought as Norway, Sweden, England, Frisia, Pommerania and so on, is simply obscuring the complexity of the power-relations at the time. This King Valdemar of Garðariki that sails into the Trondheimfjord is the same as Saint Valdemar who became seen as the founder of the christian tsardom of Russia, no less a saint than Saint Olaf. The frankish, soon saxon Roman Empire came with a new christian religion, in which the Holy See of Rome were the sole sovereign power on earth. This rather novel Roman Catholic religion, cutting itself off from the Pentarchy of the Orthodox Chalcedonian christendom, established itself with a force that made conversion mandatory, with the risk of death penalty if rejecting it, at least for the ruling class according to the legal code of emperor Charlemagne. Suchness had never been a style of christian mission before. It is obvious that King Harald Hairfair was an ally of the Roman Empire invested by the Holy See of Rome. The empire founded by Charlemagne was now in a state of some fragmentation, as the power shifted from the Carolingians to the Liudolfings. Aþalstan King of the English fostered Hákon, son of Harald King Hairfair of all of Norway; the son, called the Good, was ruling for 27 years until 34 years before Olaf King Tryggvason began his reign. It is worthwhile to recognize that Harald King Hairfair Hálfdanson united all of Norway before Aðalsteinn became the Great King of all the English. The ones who are often portrayed as the savage Vikings in the English story, the story from the point of view of the victorious feudalist Europe, is the Great Heathen Army, led by the sons of Ragnar King Lodbrok, son of Sigurd Hring, and husband of the legendary Aslaug the Crow, daughter of the famed Sigurd the Dragonslayer, known from the national epos of the Germans, the Niebelungenlied. It is possibly an incest element to this saga of Ragnar Lodbrok and Åslaug Kråka as well. It is possible that Sigurd the Dragonslayer is the same as Sigurd Hring. Sigurd Hring was the son High King Ivar the Widefathom (Vidfavne), which is interesting as the dragon that the hero Sigurd is slaying is called Fathom (Favnir). I believe the legendary arch-enemy of Charlemagne, the saxon Widekund, is rather referring to the High King to which the Saxons and many other pre-German peoples did pay tribute to, in an allegiance that eventually assembled the Great Heathen Army. But, Ragnar King Lodbrok, and his sons, the clan of the Sturlunga that despised the Hairfair-dynasty and the new feudalism, was partly exiled and partly fled from Norway and settled Iceland, and the Norðreyjar Earldom, more commonly known as the Earldom of Orkney from the descendants of Torf-Einarr Earl Ragnvaldson of Møre Eysteinnson. The latter was also the father of Gangerolf Herse of Normandy). Although it is believable that these guys did not renounce the ways of their anchestors, these alliances had a more amiable relationship with the Eastern orthodox Christendom. The purpose of Valdemar High King of Garðariki when arriving in Trondheim was to assemble forces to retake Novgorod from his brother Yaropolk who had seized the kingship of Garðariki. In AD 980 he returned with a huge army, among whom was by at least some probability the Vikings under the powerful ruler of Norway, Earl of Hlaðe. Eight years after this, Valdemar has married tsarina Anna Porphyrogenita, sister to Emperor Basil II. Christian influence came in waves, the earliest of which were rather assimilated in syncretic ways. The idea of a distinct shift from paganism to christianity doesn't hold water. --Xact (talk) 02:47, 29 October 2018 (UTC)

Requested move
Please discuss the requested move to Olaf Tryggvason at Talk:Harald I of Norway. Angus McLellan (Talk) 17:50, 12 September 2006 (UTC)
 * Closed as no consensus. —Wknight94 (talk) 19:22, 27 September 2006 (UTC)

WikiProject class rating
This article was automatically assessed because at least one WikiProject had rated the article as start, and the rating on other projects was brought up to start class. BetacommandBot 09:23, 10 November 2007 (UTC)

Nickname
I have read elsewhere that Olaf's nickname was "Crowbone" (apparently due to using birds for divination). I don't see any mention of that here. Is this a myth? NevarMaor (talk) 00:51, 27 January 2008 (UTC)

Relation to Ragnvald Olafsson
Was he first cousin to Ragnvald Olafsson, first chronicled prince of Polatsk (945 - 978)? If so its interesting fact to put in. Ref:  Jaanusele (talk) 21:39, 27 August 2008 (UTC)
 * I've never seen this in a reliable source. It can't go into an article on the basis of a genealogy website that gives no citation. Briangotts (Talk) (Contrib) 19:41, 28 August 2008 (UTC)

Cornwall
Thomas Hogg in The Fabulous History of the Ancient Kingdom of Cornwall, 1827, gives the final chapter to Olaf. His conversion on the Isles of Scilly and marriage to Gyda (sister and daughter of the kings of Dublin), but he gives Gyda as being the widow of the former King of Cornwall, Jarlus. When he marries Gyda he becomes king. Bodrugan (talk) 13:26, 24 October 2009 (UTC)


 * The source is unreliable and outdated. I've never read of this anywhere else either. BodvarBjarki (talk) 11:45, 3 October 2010 (UTC)

Why no mention of the Battle of Maldon?
He was the leader at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Maldon right? Simanos (talk) 00:32, 30 June 2010 (UTC)

Burislav/Burizleif, 'king of Wends'
While Boleslaw I the Valiant, king of Poland, might have been in part inspiration for Burislav mentioned in Scandinavian sources, it's fairly well established that he was raised christian, never ruled over Wends, neither of his wives was Scandinavian and he had no daughter named Geira. We need someone with access to critical editions of sagas and chronicles to review this article and attribute sources properly. 89.229.28.174 (talk) 01:27, 16 March 2013 (UTC)
 * And why not pick only one of the spelling variants for the article and its links? T 88.89.217.90 (talk) 06:47, 11 July 2018 (UTC)

"Fighting for Otto III" error needs to say "Otto II"
"Fighting for Otto III" article states that Otto III met Haraldr Bluetooth in Denmark with forces against the Danes. However, Bluetooth died in the year 986/987 while Otto III was born in 980, making Otto III 6 years old during the battle mentioned. Also, Otto III didn't become Holy Roman Empire until 996; but in 996, Olaf Tryggvason was in Norway Christianizing the populace there after having Haakon Jarl beheaded in 995. Otto II may have been the correct Holy Roman Empire to have led the forces against the Danes. Sources: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harald_Bluetooth, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Otto_III,_Holy_Roman_Emperor, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haakon_Sigurdsson, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Otto_II#War_with_Denmark (talk) 8:02, 13 May 2014 (EST) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.246.154.136 (talk)

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Olaf did not fight for Otto II?
The article currently says that Olaf fought for Otto II against Harald Bluetooth. However, I think the Heimskringla saga has been misunderstood. Yes, it mentions Otto's battle with Harald - but this was in 975, when Olaf was still only a teenager (probably about 12) living in Novgorod. Olaf did not travel to Wendland until 982, so he couldn't have been part of Otto's Wendish contingent.

The problem seems clear to me but I am no expert, can anyone clarify this? — Preceding unsigned comment added by NAC73 (talk • contribs) 14:09, 10 May 2021 (UTC)