Talk:Otome wa Boku ni Koishiteru/Archive 1

Drama CDs section
There were also sountrack and character CDs released. Maybe we should consolidate the Drama CD split into "Otome wa boku ni koishiteru audio CDs"?

Karn-b 16:07, 14 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Ah your probably right. I'll get right on that. (  十   八  ) 04:01, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Add an infobox?
Since you're splitting this article up into different sections, maybe we should create an infobox, like to ToHeart series, to help people navigate?

Also, there are up to three seiyus for each character...maybe we should add that in sometime.

Karn-b 17:22, 26 January 2007 (UTC)
 * I'm sure you mean a template, like the one you meant: ToHeart series. In any case, I think what I'll do is merge all the soundtrack articles into one called List of Otome wa Boku ni Koishiteru albums much like with List of Shuffle! albums and List of Haruhi Suzumiya albums. That way, there will only be the main article and that one. About the seiyū, I'll do as much as I can.-- (  十   八  ) 19:36, 26 January 2007 (UTC)

Since the article is growing, why don't we make major splits into articles such as these:


 * Otome wa boku ni koishiteru --> this page is the one we currently have and will contain general info
 * List of Otome wa boku ni koishiteru albums
 * Otome wa boku ni koishiteru (anime) --> in addition, we could have links from your episode summaries to more detailed summaries
 * Otome wa boku ni koishiteru (game) --> there is also a fan disc released by the company, which contains side stories, so we can expand this

I'll go and translate the album names and other things in need of translation when I have more time...

Anything else we can do?

Karn-b 11:34, 27 January 2007 (UTC)


 * If you do anything, just split all the anime info into it's own article while keeping this article for the game info, much like with the Shuffle! article. I don't want another Air (series) fiasco on my hands if I can help it.-- (  十   八  ) 11:43, 27 January 2007 (UTC)


 * I would personally like to split the characters into its own article as well - as we play the game, I'm sure more details will come up. Karn-b 12:28, 27 January 2007 (UTC)
 * I agree with you about the characters section since it's getting pretty obstructive. I'll split it off and leave some information on this page about them, like in the Shuffle!, Kanon and Air (series) articles.-- (  十   八  ) 01:46, 28 January 2007 (UTC)

Also, I would like to add that creating a separate article for the anime is now near pointless. The same thing tried to occur with the Shuffle! article but the anime article was soon abandoned and merged back into the main article. I don't think anything more should be split as of right now.-- (  十   八  ) 05:55, 28 January 2007 (UTC)

Why don't we just stop the splits for now, until the article itself becomes too long? Upon reflection, there might not be enough info to justify splits yet. Karn-b 12:11, 28 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Never mind that...splitting is better. Karn-b 12:37, 28 January 2007 (UTC)

History list
The history concept was taken from the Japanese wiki, where all anime articles have it. It's easier to read and reference than if it were in prose, especially since we're talking about different versions here. It would also allow us to focus the prose on the actual details, rather than just dates. Karn-b 12:28, 27 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Be that as it may, lists are usually looked down upon on Wikipedia articles, and if you want to really go for a Good Article some day, there can't be any lists on the page. Don't worry though, I've done prose for this type of information before in the Kanon article under the section "Reception and sales" which goes deeper into how much the units sold, how much they sold for, and (althogh you've already included this) if anything extra came with the games. A further example can be seen in the Shuffle! article also under "Reception and sales".-- (  十   八  ) 00:08, 28 January 2007 (UTC)
 * It's pretty good! I suppose that works too. Although I am worried about the US prices - since Wikipedia isn't US centric, some guy in the future might want to insist on adding Euros, or Chinese Yuan later in order to make it "complete".Karn-b 01:26, 28 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Mmm, about the prices. This is the English Wikipedia, so while American dollars are the most common, it is true that something like that may arise in the future. However, this was taken from the Shuffle! article which I also adapted for the Kanon and Air (series) articles, and so far nothing has come up.-- (  十   八  ) 01:44, 28 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Don't forget the British speak English as well ;) What happens if they demand pounds? But while it is a small point, I don't know how appropriate it is to include a specific currency in an encyclopedia, other than necessary - ie in the currency of the country it was sold. In addition, the "$" sign is used in over a dozen countries, so although it maybe obvious to people like us, it may be misleading for other users whom may not be as...knowing. The main point is accessibility - are we really increasing the ease of understanding by adding in dollars, when we look in a general context? Karn-b 12:09, 28 January 2007 (UTC)
 * I still doubt that this will become an issue some day in the future, but as of right now, it's good to give the average English speaker an idea of how much something is worth when presented in yen. If it becomes an issue, then we'll deal with it then, but for right now, I don't think it should change.-- (  十   八  ) 13:22, 28 January 2007 (UTC)

Repetitive?
I know you've put a lot of work into the article, but perhaps there's a bit of repetition within the article? The opening could be trimmed to include only the basic information and the plot instead of containing full dates and such, since that data is already included within its own sections. Right now, I feel that the opening is a bit long and maybe drowns out the more important info. Perhaps, if you don't mind, I will edit the opening to size it down while ensuring the info is within the article itself. Karn-b 12:33, 28 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Ah, I see your point. I just trimmed the lead down some, though most of it can still be kept. The lead is supposed to introduce the reader to the subject and include a brief overview of the important aspects in the article, while at the same time usually not going into unnecessary details, though sometimes this is unavoidable. Information such as the notes about the title which really have no where else to go but in the lead since a section to it's own would be too small besides. In any case, there are guidelines at WP:LEAD for this, and it says a good limit for a medium sized article (such as this one) is two or three paragraphs which is has now at three.-- (  十   八  ) 12:49, 28 January 2007 (UTC)

ja_name_trans
I think ja_name_trans=Otome wa Boku ni Koisiteru, because official お姉さま's reading is Boku (ボク). Is ja_name_trans written according to original pronunciation of the word? If so, ja_name_trans=Shojo wa Onee-sama ni Koisiteru(PC) Otome wa Onee-sama ni Koisiteru (PS2). Incidentally, 処女's reading is not shōjō (しょうじょう?, しょおじょお?), but shojo (しょじょ). --Mujaki 16:46, 23 February 2007 (UTC)

terms of student council
What is the fit term of Kimie's position at student council? Kimie assists Takako at student council, but I don't think Kimie is Takako's personal assistant.... --Mujaki 16:46, 23 February 2007 (UTC)

Second season
The second season anime series seems to be only a rumour now, because there is no official notice from |StarChild, Caramel Box and so on in Japan and UFO Newscatcher does not describe the source of the information. (ref. User talk) --Mujaki 05:24, 3 March 2007 (UTC)

Romanization
WP:MOS-JP says "Names should be romanized according to common usage" and "Honor the current spelling used officially by that party" and so on. I think official usages are the most common styles.--Mujaki 06:51, 11 March 2007 (UTC)
 * In the end, I suppose you are right. I'm still sure that revised Hepburn treats ou as ō, but if the common useage goes against it, then I suppose that takes precident. You can revert my earlier edits on Miyanokouji as well if you like.-- 十  八  09:03, 11 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Mmm...I answered your question about "ou" at my talk.
 * By the way, WP:MOS-JP says "Use the pattern: English (Japanese characters rōmaji)..(snip)..the last is the reading in modified Hepburn romanization described here.". The spelling of "Sion" is based on the Kunrei-shiki romaji(ISO 3602). I think the correct description of the novel "囚われの姫君" is the following:
 * Imprisoned Princess ~Sion Chapter~ (囚われの姫君～紫苑編～)
 * --Mujaki 12:20, 11 March 2007 (UTC)
 * The least I ask is for consistency; if Sion is more correct, then make sure all of the times her her name is brought up, it's spelled Sion.-- 十  八  12:29, 11 March 2007 (UTC)
 * "Sion" is collect in body and so on, but it is wrong when its reading is described. For exsample, "Junichiro" is official trade name and is collect in passport Hepburn romaji, but it is wrong in strict revised Hepburn romaji. In short, We have to use "Shion" and "Sion" properly depending on the situation.--Mujaki 12:33, 18 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Disagree with this reasoning. All the figure adverts for Shion use the Shion spelling. ANN uses the Shion spelling. Nearly all the anime blogs chose to use Shion. We should use what people will commonly encounter, not what is technically "correct". Kyaa the Catlord 14:45, 2 June 2007 (UTC)
 * I feel that Sion is not rare in the community for videogame version. Shion is used by StarChild, and Sion is used by Caramel Box and Alchemist; therefore I selected Shion for topics of anime version, and Sion for topics of videogame versions in body in accordance with WP:MOS-JP. And so, I chose Sion for common topics according to original version.--Mujaki 10:30, 3 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Since the game doesn't exist in even a fansubbed version, and the figures use the Shion spelling along with the fansubbed versions using Shion, doesn't it seem that users of the english language version would find Shion more commonly than a version of her name that does not have any sort of english localization? I understand you would like to use the "first" version to come out, but according to WP:COMMONNAME it sure seems like the more likely name choice would be Shion. (I'd provide links, but seriously would rather not since they'd just clutter this page up.) Kyaa the Catlord 10:35, 3 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Shion is common in English, while Shion (Sion) is a Japan-related name. So I believe neither opinion is wrong.--221.170.26.175

GA nomination
I have nominated this article for GA status.-- 十  八  06:47, 4 May 2007 (UTC)

Passed GA
This just scraped through on GA. I say scraped because I think the lead paragraph is a bit long, and there isn't a large amount of referencing. However, the references are accurate, and the lead itself (which isn't terribly bad) shouldn't kill it alone, so I've decided to pass it. Definitely work on these areas before considering an FA nomination. Congratulations. G1 gg  y  !  10:58, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

Japanese Unofficial site link
Sorry in japanese. 「処女はお姉さまに恋してる、まとめサイト」は、現在世界唯一のおとボクに関する情報が全て集まっているサイトで、非公式ではあるが、キャラメルＢＯＸ公認のサイトである. ゲームメーカーの公式サイト以外(アニメ関係は更新が完全に放棄されている状態）で原作公認グッズや同人誌情報が集積されている場所. 恣意的な選択できるほど情報があるなら着ればいいが、自分の理解の範疇だけで編集はしないで欲しい. ＞十八 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 220.146.206.50 (talk) 04:06, 2 September 2007 (UTC)
 * I can't understand Japanese. Please use English. But about the link, it was a non-notable foreign language unofficial website, which according to our WP:EL guideline, should not be included. It's not going to do any good on the English wikipedia to have an unofficial website in a foreign language.--  十  八  04:49, 2 September 2007 (UTC)
 * It says
 * Despite the fact that it is unofficial, the "Otome wa Boku ni Koishiteru Motome Site" is the only site in the world that has information concerning the sound. It is a site that is approved by "Caramel BOX". Excluding the game maker's official site(all information about the animation are being completely abandoned), only information on Doujinshi and Official Goods(such as figures) are available at other websites. It is good if you have enough information to select what you want, but I don't want to just edit using only my understandings.
 * It might be a bit messy, like grammar and stuff. Considering East Asian and Western languages are completely different. Whew.
 * -- 殺人事件  | talk  07:28, 2 September 2007 (UTC)

(Okay then, replying to original message) The information that a website carries does not make that website notable; its when many people use that information and refer to it as a reliable source that it becomes notable. The website must meet notability requirements on its own beforehand, and I do not see that this website satisfies that requirement. Furthermore, you say that it was "approved by 'Caramel BOX', but I see no indication of this; for all it's worth, it looks like a fansite, and the fact that it's posted on a a blog-like website (with Google ads no less), it's not going to help its notability at all. And besides, most of the additional merchandise like doujinshi and figures are typically not important enough for inclusion and could be seen as either trivial or giving undue weight to lesser notable material.--  十  八  16:29, 2 September 2007 (UTC)

Title move?
I'm thinking the article might should be moved to Otome wa Boku ni Koisiteru (dropping the "h") as it appears that the series officially uses Kunrei-shiki rōmaji (as shown in the case of Sion instead of Shion). However, I can't seem to find an official place where the full title is in romaji, so I can't fully justify the move. It does seem a bit off to use conflicting romaji styles within the article though. Thoughts?--SeizureDog 20:12, 11 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Just like we have Kashimashi, I believe we should stick to revised Hepburn romanization for the title.--  十  八  02:06, 12 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Kashimashi got licensed in that manner though, Otome wa Boku ni Koishiteru hasn't yet.--SeizureDog 02:08, 15 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Media Blasters licensed OtoBoku a long time ago. If I am unmistaken, they are not changing the romanization of the current title.--  十  八  02:57, 15 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Keep - Caramel Box and Alchemist use Hepburn in many cases. 紫苑 is spelt Sion in Kunrei-siki (or Nihon-siki), but they spell Itsukushima, Takashima, Shiori  and so on.--Mujaki 15:30, 15 November 2007 (UTC)
 * That's just damn weird. Sion and Shiori both have an お after their し, so there's no possible grammatical reason for them to be transliterated differently. Is Sion possibly Chinese? I think it would make sense if her name was romanized in pinyin (which has seperate shi and si sounds) instead of romaji. Her name (紫苑) means Aster root in Chinese btw.--SeizureDog 16:48, 15 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Many Japanese usually do not care mistakes or disarraies of a specific romaji style (Ref. ローマ字). Incidentally, 紫苑 is both Japanese and Chinese, and 紫苑 in Chinese is spelt Zi yuan in romaji pinyin.--Mujaki 18:27, 15 November 2007 (UTC) --(mod)Mujaki (talk) 04:56, 17 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Wasn't sure if there was an alternate romanization that might make it Sion. Chinese isn't my strong suit in any degree.--SeizureDog 20:51, 15 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Chinese characters are used in writing Chinese and Japanese, but Japanese proninciations are different from Chinese for sama words. For example, 漢字 is spelt Hànzì in pinyin for Chinese and Kanji in Hepburn romaji for Japanese.
 * (return to our subject) Japanese often use romaji mixed Hepburn (Hebon-shiki), Kunrei-siki, Nihon-siki and so on, and change romaji style for wording by fancy. Though i don't know why Sion is, I feel that it is cooler than Shion.--Mujaki (talk) 04:57, 17 November 2007 (UTC)

Anime reviews
Now that the anime series is being reviewed, I think the reception section needs updating. Putting these here for safekeeping.-Malkinann (talk) 00:41, 5 October 2008 (UTC) ANN vol 1 Mania.com vol 1 Okazu vol 1 Mania.com vol 2 ANN vol 2
 * http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/review/otoboku/dvd-1
 * http://www.mania.com/otoboku-vol-1_article_80242.html
 * http://okazu.blogspot.com/2008/09/otoboku-anime-volume-1-english.html
 * http://www.mania.com/otoboku-vol-2_article_80429.html
 * http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/review/otoboku/sub.dvd-2