Talk:Paddy Bradley/GA1

GA Review
The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.''

Start of review
Hi, I'll be reviewing this article. The rules for GA reviews are stated at Good Article criteria. I usually do reviews in the order: coverage; structure; detailed walk-through of sections (refs, prose, other details); images (after the text content is stable); lead (ditto). Feel free to respond to my comments under each one, and please sign each response, so that it's clear who said what.

When an issue is resolved, I'll mark it with ✅. If I think an issue remains unresolved after responses / changes by the editor(s), I'll mark it ❌. Occasionally I decide one of my comments is off-target, and strike it out

BTW I've occasionally had edit conflicts in review pages, and to reduce this risk I'd be grateful if you'd let me know when you're most active, so I can avoid these times. --Philcha (talk) 18:41, 13 May 2009 (UTC)

Coverage
I think there are some significant gaps: ✅ *School & college / university - apart from academic aspects incl qualifications gained, that may have been where he found he had an aptitude for Gaelic football, or some other sport at which he was good but gave up to pursue Gaelic football. --Philcha (talk) 19:09, 13 May 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ Non-football aspects of early life: location of birth; parents; hometown(s); siblings (apart from brother Eoin, who also played GF). --Philcha (talk) 19:09, 13 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Added what I know. Unfortunately there doesn't seem to be much info readily availble about this sort of stuff. Derry Boi (talk) 00:26, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Citation needed. --Philcha (talk) 09:09, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Would this be okay for the sentence "Bradley is from the small village of Glenullin."? It doesn't explicitly say he's from Glenullin, but does say "Glenullin man". Derry Boi (talk) 10:39, 27 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Sorry, in this context I think it means "plays for Glenullin". --Philcha (talk) 20:51, 29 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Added source. Derry Boi (talk) 11:03, 20 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Good find! --Philcha (talk) 04:55, 23 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Looks like there's little chance of finding more about Bradley's background. --Philcha (talk) 04:55, 23 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Added info school & college. Derry Boi (talk) 00:26, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Citation needed. --Philcha (talk) 09:09, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * What's wrong with the reference I used? Derry Boi (talk) 10:39, 27 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Sorry, I don't know what I was thinking of. --Philcha (talk) 20:51, 29 May 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ Current & recent personal life: marriage or significant other(s); children; day job(s); close friends, any strong enmities; etc. --Philcha (talk) 19:09, 13 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Added occupation. Derry Boi (talk) 00:26, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Citation needed. --Philcha (talk) 09:09, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Theres a citation for occupation in the infobox. Is it ok here or does it look better in the main text?Derry Boi (talk) 10:34, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ I'd do both, see, e.g. Rufous-crowned Sparrow. --Philcha (talk) 11:05, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Done. Derry Boi (talk) 22:26, 15 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Looks like there's little chance of finding more about Bradley's personal life. --Philcha (talk) 04:55, 23 July 2009 (UTC)
 * (comment) as far as I can see Gaelic football is a summmer game - correct me if I'm wrong! - so the lack of anything on the 2009 season doesn't bother me. --Philcha (talk) 19:09, 13 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Yeah main inter-county competition takes place in the summer. Added details of 09 season so far. Feel free to ask me any questions about the sport you're not sure of. Derry Boi (talk) 00:26, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * There'll be questions, you can be sure of that :-)

Re the bio stuff:
 * ✅The items you've added need citations. If they're covered by a ref already used in the same para, the usual convention is that the ref goes at the end of a block of text that it supports, within the same para, until you use another citation - e.g. sentence 1, sentence 2, [ref A], sentence 3, sentence 4, [ref B] sentence 5, [ref A].
 * (comment) If sources are in short supply, you have to squeeze dry the ones you have - e.g. Bradley played half-forward at school, acording to Irish Indep.
 * (comment) You may well need to try approaches other than Google (BTW there seem to be a heck of a lot of Bradleys in Ireland) E.g. contact Bradley's club and see if they can give you leads; and supporters' clubs, if they exist; libraries, don't just visit or search online catalogues, ask librarians, as finding stuff is what they do and they're usually delighted to get a break from all the "housework"; contact newspapers that cover the sport and / or the area where Bradley lives and plays (e.g. "births, marriages and deaths" columns); explain the types of source you need for WP (e.g. newspapers and books preferred; blogs & forums not accepted as refs but might be useful as leads). I realise this will take time. --Philcha (talk) 06:49, 14 May 2009 (UTC)

Structure
✅ Based on competitor bios I've edited (chess; 5 GAs) and a sportsperson article I reviewed for GA a while ago (it passed), I suggest: However if you know or discover anything that makes this structure look wrong for this article, let me know. --Philcha (talk) 19:09, 13 May 2009 (UTC)
 * "Early life" section first, covering birth, family, hometown(s), school(s), possibly his start in the game.
 * Football career.
 * Personal life, taking up where "Early life" left off.
 * Style, strengths & poss weaknesses as a player, and his personality as a player - e.g. easy or hard to manage, placid or fiery on the field, attitude to training, anything you find that's relevant while looking for the other things.

Since my comments so far imply quite significant changes, I'll hold off the section-by-section walkthrough until the existing issues are resolved. --Philcha (talk)


 * ✅ I don't think there's enough info for separate early life and personal life sections. Is one okay? I also changed the title of the section. Derry Boi (talk) 21:02, 25 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Given the shortage of info,m that was a good move. --Philcha (talk) 14:08, 12 June 2009 (UTC)

Early and personal life

 * ✅ "Paddy's uncle Gabriel Bradley won the Ulster Championship twice with Derry in 1975 and 1976" suggests he did most of it himself. You shoudl rephrase. --Philcha (talk) 09:09, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * FixedDerry Boi (talk) 10:34, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Thanks. --Philcha (talk) 11:55, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Now you need to make the prose flow better - at present there's a separate short sentence for each item. --Philcha (talk) 04:57, 23 July 2009 (UTC)

Playing career

 * ✅ Overall the structure looks odd to me. In other team games of which I know a little, players are included in regional & national teams after proving their worth at club level, so it's logical to cover club record first, see, e.g. articles about soccer or rugby or American football players. If Gaelic football works differently, that would have to be explained - I notice Bradley played his 1st Derry game at the age of 18. --Philcha (talk) 09:09, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Moved club section to start. Also added fact he made Derry debut at 18.Derry Boi (talk) 10:34, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * ❌ (mainly to remind reviewer!) Gaelic football seems to have its own conventions for player's performance statistics. The first instance needs an explanation, includng why the leading zeroes, probably as a footnote. I'd use a separate "Notes" section for this rather than an ordinary ref, as I suspect most readers don't read refs. See [] for techniques. The right place for such a note depends on whether the section gets re-ordered. BTW IS see 2 separate formats, e.g. "2-38 (44)" and "2-07" - both need explanation. --Philcha (talk) 09:09, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Added note. Derry Boi (talk) 10:34, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * I hadn't spotted that the lead contains scores, as I leave the lead until last - well done!
 * The syntax wasn't quite right so it didn't work, I've changed it to, which works. You need to test these things before saying you've done them. --Philcha (talk) 11:55, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * I think the note's text needs to be more explicit, e.g usually in the form g-p where g is number of times the ball is shot into the opposing net, worth 3 points each, and p is the number of times it is shot above the net but between the uprights, worth one point each. Sometimes the total score is also given in parentheses, e.g. 2-9 (15). See ... --Philcha (talk) 11:55, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Sorry I'm not really sure what you mean. Derry Boi (talk) 21:02, 25 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Made the note's text more explicit. Derry Boi (talk) 23:13, 20 July 2009 (UTC)
 * I won't close this item until the end of the review as I want a reminder to check where else this note would be useful once the text is stable. --Philcha (talk) 11:55, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * ❌ It would be helpful somewhere to include how big Bradley is (Derry profile) - even the less tall players are pretty solid hunks, and that gives the impression that it's quite a physical game; for instance the Derry profile shows a lot of players in the 13-14st range, and in soccer teams usually only goalies and the occasional centre-back are in that range. BTW you should also give metric equivalents -convert is a tool you should learn to love (I do, I do, I do), as it formats per WP:MOSNUM as well as doing the arithmetic. --Philcha (talk) 09:09, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * You mean weight? I thought there was a consensus somewhere not to include weight in sports articles as it can constantly change (I may be wrong on this)? I can include it if you want though. I'll also have a go later at editing the infobox so that height can be converted to metric units. Derry Boi (talk) 10:34, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * I'm not a sports specialist, so I don't know whether there is a consensus somewhere not to include weight in sports articles. "as it can constantly change" applies to boxing and possibly to other low-frequency combat sports, but for adult male competitors in other sports significant weight change is usually a sign of trouble, see e.g. Jim Baxter - especially in games like soccer and Gaelic football, where play is once or more a week during the season. Note "male" - anorexia is common among female competitors because their higher natural subcutaneous fat % and the top-heaviness of even A-cup boobs are handicaps, see e.g Dying To Win and this Google search. Check with the sport Wikiproject if you like, but I think it's valid and makes a point here. --Philcha (talk) 11:05, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Not exactly sure what you want me to say. Do you want me to say something like "Bradley is 5' 11 and weights 14 st"? Derry Boi (talk) 16:11, 29 May 2009 (UTC)
 * I'd put "Weight: 14 st" in the info box, under "Height 5 ft 11 in (1.80 m)". BTW you'll have to wikilink "stone" / "st" for those who live on the wrong side of the Pond. --Philcha (talk) 20:56, 29 May 2009 (UTC)
 * I've requested help over here because I don't relly know much about editting infoboxes. Derry Boi (talk) 19:33, 17 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Adjusted infobox. Derry Boi (talk) 21:54, 16 August 2009 (UTC)

Club

 * ✅ I don't see what supports "After suffering disappointment at the semi-final stage on a few occasions" --Philcha (talk) 12:12, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Removed sentence. Derry Boi (talk) 22:26, 15 May 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ "Bradley finally won a Derry Senior Football Championship with Glenullin in 2007" - more heroics? --Philcha (talk) 12:12, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Rephrased. Derry Boi (talk) 22:26, 15 May 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ I don't see what supports "His ten points (six from play) against reigning champions Ballinderry in the semi-final was instrumental in Glenullin reaching the final. Despite two poor performances he managed to score the winning point in the final replay against Bellaghy." --Philcha (talk)
 * Referenced 10 points sentence. Derry Boi (talk) 22:26, 15 May 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ In fact I think you need to check that every clause in this section is supported, because I have doubts about support for half the content - in fact about half the 2nd para is not supported. --Philcha (talk) 07:29, 16 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Got references now for everything in club section, except for sentence about Glenullin jointly winning the 2008 Derry Senior Football League, which I can't seem to find. Derry Boi (talk) 20:36, 19 May 2009 (UTC)
 * emailed the Derry GAA website asking them to update the league roll of honour section. Derry Boi (talk) 09:27, 2 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Added ref. Derry Boi (talk) 21:46, 3 August 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ "ten points (six from play)" is Gaelic football jargon / convention and needs to be explained. I guess it means 4 from penalty shots and the rest from open play. In soccer, admittedly a lower-scoring game, goals from free-kicks and / or penalty kicks are sometimes mentioned explicitly, e.g. "he scored two goals, one from a penalty kick" means 1 from open play, etc. --Philcha (talk) 07:29, 16 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Can be mentioned either way in Gaelic football. Added in the word "open" in case that helps any? Derry Boi (talk) 15:05, 18 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Thanks. --Philcha (talk) 21:16, 29 May 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ Should give another link to the scoring here, as it's the first occurrence in main text. That means you'll have to change the text of the footnote. --Philcha (talk) 21:16, 29 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Linked to note again. Changed text of note. One small problem which I can't seem to fix.... the second link to Note A (i.e. the link in the Club paragraph directs you to the correct note alright, but when you click on the "^" symbol beside the note it doesn't redirect you back to the Club paragraph...only to the initial link to Note A. If you get what I mean? Derry Boi (talk) 23:13, 20 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Your description of the problem was pretty clear. Looks like WP's software does not handle Notes as intelligently as it does refs. I'd change it to a ref. --Philcha (talk) 05:11, 23 July 2009 (UTC)
 * I agree that it looks better as a note than a ref so I've asked for help over here. If no-one there can sort it out, I'll just change it to a ref.
 * Well done. I changed the wording very slightly, and made the note text a readable size. --Philcha (talk) 12:09, 27 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Sorted now. Derry Boi (talk) 11:49, 27 July 2009 (UTC)
 * First para has a lot of very short sentences. Please try to make it flow a little more. --Philcha (talk) 21:16, 29 May 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ In 2nd para the first 2 sentence have "also" near the beginning - a bit monotonous. Can you please rephrase. --Philcha (talk) 21:16, 29 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Rephrased. Derry Boi (talk) 22:01, 31 May 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ I've just realised "Sevens" needs explanation in "All-Ireland Sevens Championship" - I suggest another footnote. --Philcha (talk) 21:16, 29 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Added footnote. Derry Boi (talk) 11:03, 20 July 2009 (UTC)
 * And with a ref that not only verifies your statements but gives a vivid impression of sevens - nice work! --Philcha (talk) 05:11, 23 July 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ I suggest "... Bradley was marked impressively by ..." - avoid WP:PEACOCK -Philcha (talk) 12:09, 27 July 2009 (UTC)
 * I copyedited. --Philcha (talk) 19:17, 4 August 2009 (UTC)

Inter-county

 * ✅ The way "Bradley made his Derry debut in late 1999" is phrased assumes readers know the organisation of Gaelic football. You need to explain that "Derry" here is the county team rather than e.g. a league in Derry. A wikilink would be helpful, Gaelic_football looks reasonable for the job unless you know a better one. -Philcha (talk) 09:09, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Done. Wikilinked to senior.Derry Boi (talk) 10:34, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ Re "In his inaugural season he won the 2000 National League with the county, defeating Meath in the final":
 * ✅ "inaugural"? What's wrong with e.g. "first" (assuming the rephrased previous sentence does not incl "first"). --Philcha (talk) 09:09, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Rephrased. Derry Boi (talk) 10:34, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ As phrased it suggests Bradley did it single-handed, or perhaps with just a little help from his team-mates. --Philcha (talk) 09:09, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Rephrased. Derry Boi (talk) 10:34, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Yes, I think the very simple direct wording has more impact - he made a difference. --Philcha (talk) 12:12, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ In "He made his Ulster Championship debut later that year against Cavan" you should explain than this is the inter-county knock-out comp - and link to single-elimination tournament, dunno why WP likes such stuffed-shirt article titles when AFAIK "knock-out" is well known as a tournament format. --Philcha (talk) 09:09, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Added a note. I'm sure I have you totally confused now. :) Derry Boi (talk) 10:34, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Correct syntax is like, I'll leave this for to you to fix. --Philcha (talk) 11:55, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * I'm confused, but won't know what I'm confused about until you fix it so the links work :-) Philcha (talk) 11:55, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Fixed. Derry Boi (talk) 22:26, 15 May 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ In "In 2004 Bradley and Enda Muldoon formed a clinical scoring partnership", "clinical " strikes me as WP:PEACOCK. The source says Bradley & Muldoon contributed 2/3 of their team's scoring (or whatever the appropriate term is, I don't understand the numbers), and that's more impressive. --Philcha (talk) 09:09, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Reworded. Derry Boi (talk) 20:36, 19 May 2009 (UTC)
 * As far as I can see you've simply removed "clinical", and what's left - "In 2004 Bradley and Enda Muldoon formed a scoring partnership" - looks limp. If you reshuffle the first 2 sentences you'll get some impact. --Philcha (talk) 22:24, 29 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Not exactly sure what you mean. Derry Boi (talk) 23:13, 20 July 2009 (UTC)
 * What point are you trying to make in the sentence? Would it be better to omit the "scoring partnership" bit? Were the team making higher scores than other leading teams? Or do you mean Bradly and Muldoon get a lot of the credit for the team's good run? --Philcha (talk) 05:28, 23 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Yeah Bradley and Muldoon got a lot of credit for the team's run and a lot of the media made the suggestion Derry were a two-man team, so I think its noteworthy to mention their scoring partnership that year. Derry Boi (talk) 11:41, 26 July 2009 (UTC)
 * In that case I like my first suggestion, that Bradley & Muldoon contributed 2/3 of their team's scoring. --Philcha (talk) 12:22, 26 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Rephrased. Derry Boi (talk) 11:50, 27 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Thanks. --Philcha (talk) 12:15, 27 July 2009 (UTC)
 * ❌ Re "on route to the All-Ireland semi-final":
 * ✅ "en route" is more correct as the phrase is French, but I'd avoid the the issue by keeping it simple - "on the way to". --Philcha (talk) 09:09, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Rephrased. 10:34, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * ❌ Is the All-Ireland a separate comp? Needs explanation. --Philcha (talk) 09:09, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * See Note B C I added. Derry Boi (talk) 10:34, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * The note is not clear. You mean the All-Ireland is contested by the winners of the other comps? --Philcha (talk) 05:28, 23 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Its kinda complicated to explain unless your familiar with Gaelic football. Traditionally the All-Ireland Championship consisted of four provincial championships (based on geographical location) with the 4 winners advancing to the All-Ireland semi-finals (a bit like divisional championships and then play-offs in American sports). However in 2001 adjustments were made that meant teams beaten in their provicial championship weren't knocked out altogether, but got a "second chance" and went through a Qualifier system. 4 teams come through this Qualifier system and meet the four provincial champions in the All-Ireland quarter-finals now. (see here.) I realise the note isn't that clear to those not familiar with Gaelic football, but I'm not really sure how to make it any clearer. Derry Boi (talk) 11:49, 26 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Looks like another footnote :-( Of course it will have to include citations to support the relevant format. --Philcha (talk) 12:22, 26 July 2009 (UTC)
 * I've made note C clearer. However I'm having bother finding citations for the note. I'll keep looking though. Derry Boi (talk) 12:26, 27 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Emailed the GAA asking them to put the format on their website. Derry Boi (talk) 09:28, 2 August 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ What's an "All-Star"? --Philcha (talk) 09:09, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * At the end of the season the best player in each position is chosen, to make up an All Star team. Derry Boi (talk) 22:26, 15 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Adding that in the middle of a para would be a bit much. I suggest you wikilink to All_star. --Philcha (talk) 07:56, 16 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Is it not ok just wikilinked to GAA All Stars Awards? Derry Boi (talk) 21:02, 25 May 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ the source does not support "had another impressive season" in "and had another impressive season, for example scoring 1-10 in a man of the match performance against Monaghan". Without "had another impressive season", the sentence would just say "had an execellent game at ..." and I don't think it would be worth including - the fact that he's worth an article in WP suggests most of his games were very good. --Philcha (talk) 09:09, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Removed sentence. Derry Boi (talk) 22:26, 15 May 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ Re "He received his third All Star nomination that year and it was of great surprise that he was not chosen on the final All Star team":
 * I see nothing that supports that. --Philcha (talk) 09:09, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * "of great surprise" - is this an Irish idiom? --Philcha (talk) 09:09, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Referenced All Star nomination, removed sentence about not being on final team. Derry Boi (talk) 20:36, 19 May 2009 (UTC)
 * The 2nd para ends in 2 short and very similar sentences. Please rephrase. --Philcha (talk) 22:24, 29 May 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ In "Longford produced a shock victory ..." the source does not support shock, but would support e.g. "suspense-filled" as the lead repeatedly changed hands. --Philcha (talk) 09:09, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Reworded. Derry Boi (talk) 22:26, 15 May 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ "but lost out to Kieran Donaghy of Kerry" seems to be unsupported. --Philcha (talk) 09:09, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Added ref. Derry Boi (talk) 21:02, 25 May 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ "Bradley claimed the MVP award" - "was named as the MVP"? --Philcha (talk)
 * Reworded. Derry Boi (talk) 22:26, 15 May 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ Re "alleged altercation with a referee":
 * The source reports the lifting of the suspension but not the date or nature of the incident. --Philcha (talk) 09:09, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Added date and nature. Derry Boi (talk) 15:05, 18 May 2009 (UTC)
 * "altercation" is one of those coy words that can have a wide range of meanings, from shouting match to threats to relatively mild use of force (e.g. "clasped warmly by the throat" as in File:Billy Bremner Dave Mackay.jpg). Can you be more specific? --Philcha (talk) 09:09, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Added nature. Derry Boi (talk) 15:05, 18 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Who alleged? If the "altercation" was physical and there was clear video evidence or multiple independent press reports, you could omit "alleged". --Philcha (talk) 09:09, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * "Alleged" seems to be used in reports, so thought it best to use it. There wasn't any cameras present. Derry Boi (talk) 15:05, 18 May 2009 (UTC)
 * ❌ Re "He appealed the decision to both the Derry County Board and the Ulster Council, but both were rejected":
 * "Derry County Board" and the "Ulster Council" both need explantion. Wikilinks woudl do if avaialble. --Philcha (talk) 22:24, 29 May 2009 (UTC)
 * but both what were rejected? the bodies? I think there's a neater way to phrase the sentence. --Philcha (talk) 22:24, 29 May 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ Re "The suspension was eventually lifted ...", "eventually " is vague and it would be better to give the date, or "after X weeks" if we get the date of the suspension. --Philcha (talk)
 * Added date. Derry Boi (talk) 15:05, 18 May 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ Re "Bradley finally received an All Star award ...", "award" looks odd as this looks like a place in a team - or I'm totally confused and you need to explain more clearly (earlier in the article). --Philcha (talk)
 * At the end of the season the best player in each position is chosen, to make up an All Star team. "Award" is commonly used as the 15 players receive an actual award (e.g.). Should I explain what an All Star is to the readers, or just let them click on the wikilink if they're interested? Derry Boi (talk) 22:26, 15 May 2009 (UTC)
 * I suggest you wikilink "All Star Award" (full name) at first mention in main text, i.e. 1st para of this section. --Philcha (talk) 22:24, 29 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Thanks. --Philcha (talk) 05:28, 23 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Wiklinked first mention in para. Derry Boi (talk) 19:33, 17 July 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ "He also collected a GPA All Star in 2007,[1] and his fifth Irish News Ulster All Star award - his fourth in a row" makes me think I am totally confused:
 * Irish News Ulster All Star does look like an award in the Oscar sense. Perhaps we need another footnote. -Philcha (talk) 09:09, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * his fourth what in a row? --Philcha (talk) 09:09, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Removed writing about Irish News Ulster All Star, its not that important in the grand scheme of things (I'll just keep it in the honours section of the article.) Derry Boi (talk) 22:26, 15 May 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ Re "winning the 2008 National League, defeating Kerry in the final", how is there a final in a league comp? --Philcha (talk) 09:09, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * The two teams which finish top of the league standings qualify for the final. Derry Boi (talk) 22:26, 15 May 2009 (UTC)
 * You need to explain that to readers. --Philcha (talk) 22:24, 29 May 2009 (UTC) --Philcha (talk) 14:29, 12 June 2009 (UTC)
 * Explained. will look for refs tomorrow. Derry Boi (talk) 19:33, 17 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Good refs. Unfortunately I've just noticed the explanation should be applied to the 2000 success, as this is the first mention of this comp in the article - sorry for not spotting this earlier. --Philcha (talk) 05:28, 23 July 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ Put the ref at the end of the sentence (currently "and his fifth Irish News Ulster All Star award - his fourth in a row"). --Philcha (talk) 09:09, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Removed sentence. Derry Boi (talk) 22:26, 15 May 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ In "The league success saw Derry become favourites to win the Ulster Championship[22] and one of the top few for the All-Ireland", I don't see which source suports "one of the top few for the All-Ireland". You may need to slip additional refs in, e.g. clause 1, clause 2, [ref A], clause 3, sentence 4, [ref B] clause 5, [ref A]. --Philcha (talk) 09:09, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Removed "one of the top few for the All-Ireland" until I can find a source for it. Derry Boi (talk) 21:02, 25 May 2009 (UTC)
 * ✅ You've added "aged 18" after "Derry debut in late 1999[ref]". That makes it look as if aged 18 is unsupported - stricly it is, but given his DOB it's an obvious deduction. MOS says refs should be at ends of esyntacticla units. Pl re-arrange. --Philcha (talk) 07:56, 16 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Moved ref to end of sentence. Derry Boi (talk) 15:05, 18 May 2009 (UTC)

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 * Comment: As little progress is being made on this, I would suggest failing now. The nominator, who has not edited since 31 May, can always bring back to WP:GAN when the article is fixed. Jezhotwells (talk) 13:09, 11 July 2009 (UTC)


 * How close is this article to a GA? Doesn't look like there's much left main text wise, I'll try to help with what is left though. Wizardman  15:30, 11 August 2009 (UTC)


 * I think this should be passed/failed soon as it doesn't look like much is being done. Spiderone  15:25, 29 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Philcha has been more than patient with the reviewer. Nearly four months after the GA review began, there are still outstanding textual issues, that he has been reminded about on the talk page. I'm failing this myself, even though I'm not the reviewer. This will give you an indefinite amount of time to finish all the issue and re-nom. Wizardman  18:12, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

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