Talk:Palaiologan Dynasty (novel series)

Notability
It is a shame, if not a curse, to place this sign above this article. Please someone to remove it. It is an hubris both to the author and to the Wikipedia — Preceding unsigned comment added by Shipskeeper (talk • contribs) 11:20, 25 January 2015 (UTC)

This article is an objective and informative text for anyone interested on the field. It is the same style and character as other similar and related articles on Wikipedia, for example, of Mr. Ken Follett’s “Century”, of Mr. Turtleltaub, “Justinian” and others not to mention all of them referred if Wikipedia. Moreover, that this tetralogy has been awarded the Literal State Prize, the highest acknowledgement for an author in Greece. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Steven1965 (talk • contribs) 11:01, 25 January 2015 (UTC)
 * This article needs to indicate how the book is notable. Right now it's just a description of the work (and some peacock writing) but no mention of third-party reviews.  In order to avoid deletion, the article must be re-written in a more encyclopedic tone.  ...  disco spinster   talk  19:58, 25 June 2009 (UTC)

Better to remove the above tags because they are irrelevant and unrelated. Thanks for your attention. Natassa from Serbia. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.19.75.194 (talk) 08:45, 6 July 2009 (UTC)
 * The saga historical dynasty about the palaeologian dynasty, including 'Sophia Palaeologina', is very well known in Serbia, Bulgaria, Turkey and Greece. If someone does not know the story and the book, that's his fault and it does not mean that noone else does not know.

Konstantinos Georgoulopoulos —Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.129.22.227 (talk) 09:22, 6 July 2009 (UTC)
 * The historical novels about Palaelogian dynasty is a best selling trilogy in my country (Greece) as well as in some others that are interested in history. So you must be more carefull in your criticism. As a often user of wikipedia I would not like to see comments like the above ones.


 * Personal assertions of facts carry very little weight, regardless of their possible truth, due to the simple fact that they are not verifiable. Please review the Notability guideline. You're probably correct that this is a well known work, but there's no verifiable evidence of that in the article. — V = I * R  (talk) 16:10, 8 August 2009 (UTC)

Requested move

 * The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section. 

The result of the move request was no consensus. &mdash;harej (talk) 17:22, 16 August 2009 (UTC)

The Palaeologian Dynasty. The Rise and Fall of Byzantium → The dynasty of Palaeologues &mdash; User:Shipskeeper 15:39, 7 August 2009 (UTC)
 * OK, First of all, a properly shortened form would be "Dynasty of Palaeologues".
 * Regardless, this article appears to be properly titled. The current title matches the name of a book, which is as it should be (IAW WP:TITLE). I don't see an obvious need for renaming and moving this article. — V = I * R  (talk) 10:20, 8 August 2009 (UTC::I agree with the shortened title "Dynasty of Palaeologues". It matches the text.--Shipskeeper (talk) 15:38, 8 August 2009 (UTC)
 * That's not what the article (currently) states. The lead clearly indicates that the title of the book is "The Palaeologian Dynasty. The Rise and Fall of Byzantium", which is the current page title. According to Naming conventions (books), the page should remain where it currently is. (ps.: Is there an ISBN for this book? That should straighten all of this out fairly quickly.) — V = I * R  (talk) 16:13, 8 August 2009 (UTC)

It is a trilogy, and so there are three books and three ISBNs. The first "Michael Palaeologus. The Liberator" has: ISBN 960-14-0998-x The second "The Palaeologues" has: 960-14-1206-9 The third "The Last Palaeologue" has 978-960-14-1644-1, and the additional one "Sophie Palaeologina - From Byzantium to Russia" has 978-960-14-1836-0 --Gleonardos (talk) 17:17, 9 August 2009 (UTC)
 * I oppose the move per Ω's rationale, but have a question: where does it say that the name of this series is "The Palaeologian Dynasty. The Rise and Fall of Byzantium"? I have not encountered it either in English or in Greek in any of the links provided. AFAIK, the books are part of a series concerning the Palaiologoi, but to my knowledge, this has not been given a definite name by the author. If no source is provided, then the current name cannot stand. Also, if the book on Sophia Palaiologina considered part of the series, then it is a tetralogy, not a trilogy. Constantine  ✍  16:57, 14 August 2009 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

Some thinking for Constantine:

“A trilogy is a set of three works of art - usually literature, film, or video games, less commonly visual art like paintings or musical works - that are connected, and that can be seen either as a single work or as three individual works.” (Wikipedia).

“A trilogy is a set of three works of art that develop a single theme. Trilogies are commonly found in literature and occasionally in film. Some authors of popular trilogies may later extend the series by adding more works to it…” (Webster).

And according to the Penguin Dictionary of Literary Terms and Literary Theory, “the term (trilogy) may also be applied to a group of three novels linked by a common theme and characters.”

A trilogy usually has no common title, in order not to be confused with a single book in three volumes.

“Sophia Palaeologina” was added as a continuation of Palaeologean family, after the collapse of the dynasty and fall of Constantinople. It is an explanatory "annex" for the then course of the Palaeologean family. Not of the dynasty.

Regarding the references to each one of these historical novels, which form the trilogy, you may have a look to Google to find many reports, reviews and critics by scholars and article writers, as well as… ads from bookstores.

This explanatory version has no hint against anyone. It was added to your discussion just for explanatory reasons. Steven--Steven1965 (talk) 07:40, 18 August 2009 (UTC)


 * Yes, thank you for stating the obvious, but this page makes no distinctions really: the book on Sophia is presented as a proper and concluding part of the series, making it four books long, ergo a tetralogy. Either way, I actually wanted to know whether the author himself has actually referred to these works as a set or series under this or any name. Because, guess what, a Google search for the title of the current page produces either WP clones or totally unrelated results, while searches for similar titles in Greek came up with nothing at all. So this title appears to have no recognition from the author and therefore to be WP:OR. Unless some more concrete evidence is provided, then this page should be renamed (along with getting a thorough copyedit for style) to a descriptive title along he lines of "Palaiologos dynasty (series)". Constantine  ✍  08:28, 18 August 2009 (UTC)