Talk:Palatinate-Zweibrücken-Birkenfeld

This article badly needs correction. Palatinate-Zweibrücken-Birkenfeld has never been a state, but is the name of a dynasty of counts palatine ruling the County of Sponheim (together with the margraves of Baden). In fact the Birkenfeld region was part of the (rear) County of Sponheim. Cf. the German article Pfalz-Birkenfeld -- Blueduck4711 (talk) 00:00, 27 May 2009 (UTC)

This is a misunderstanding: As the German article correctly points out, the counts of Palatinate-Zweibrücken-Birkenfeld had since 1595 the sole government in one part of the county, and increased their territory substatially in later years. More importantly, there is no independent notion of statehood in the tradition of the Holy Roman Empire. Until the diet of Augsburg of 1582, any son of a prince of the Empire became automatically a prince himself, and whatever lands he governed became a principality. This is the reason why the number of principalities kept increasing. See the German article on the princes of the Empire Reichsfürst. Falkebln (talk) 13:20, 10 August 2009 (UTC)

Who were the "counts of Palatinate-Zweibrücken-Birkenfeld"? No one has ever used such a style. Please check your history. They used the title "Pfalzgraf bei Rhein, Herzog in Baiern, Graf zu Veldenz und Sponheim". Of all these titles they were only actually regents over the County of Sponheim, later also Rappoltstein, Zweibrücken and so on with the appropriate titles. Just because the same person was ruling over the territories that doesn't mean it was a single territory. The rights had different proveniences and could follow different routes would a ruling house become extinct. --Fhmann (talk) 01:11, 20 August 2009 (UTC)


 * Sorry for the late answer (was on holidays ...). @Falkbln: Actually, there were never "counts of Palatinate-Zweibrücken-Birkenfeld", as Fhmann states correctly. This special branch of the family reigned the (Rear) County of Sponheim together with the Margraves of Baden. The treaty of 1595 (Kastellauner Vertrag) that gave them special rights in some parts of the county was later (1671) terminated and a common government (Gemeinsherrschaft) for the whole of the county reestablished. The county was in 1776 divided between Baden and Palatinate with regards to the government, but this division did not even have a legal affect on the "statehood" (or however you would like to call it) of the county: Legally it remained one county (Reichsgrafschaft!) until the French period. And please: Do always think twice before you tell me again that I misunderstand the history of Sponheim. -- Blueduck4711 (talk) 20:10, 25 September 2009 (UTC)