Talk:Panagiotis Kavvadias

Change of birth date
I saw you changed the birthdate in several places in the article. I have undone your alterations because you didn't provide a published source for them. Or is there a published source you have not yet shared that proves the alternative birth date? Modussiccandi (talk) 18:23, 1 May 2024 (UTC)


 * Hello . As his great grandson I think i know his birthdate better than anyone. If you need verification the date of his passing is the one mentioned at the obituary published in the sources. NikosKavv (talk) 18:27, 1 May 2024 (UTC)
 * To add to this: I had an email correspondence with Nikos while writing the article about this issue (see the talk page of Nikos' old account). He emailed me an unpublished document issued in 2010, which seems to be a certificate of citizenship, giving Kavvadias' birth date as 1848, and mentioned that the mayor of Kothreas had confirmed the same date to him. Unfortunately, we can't use this as a source in the article, as it isn't published and vetted by academic authorities: we have to go with what has appeared in print, even if we have other information that may cast doubt on it. I did however wonder whether the Archaeological Society of Athens might be able to shed some light on the matter, or be interested in publishing some research into it? UndercoverClassicist T·C 18:46, 1 May 2024 (UTC)
 * I recently visited the municipality of Kefalonia to try and verify the date 1848 and unfortunately it cannot be verified. The date 1 May 1851 mentioned at his obituary was first published by the Society of Antiquaries of London in January 1929 vol.9 issue 1 and later from Cambridge press in 2012. We've come to the conclusion that he as an honorary Dr. at Cambridge Univ., was the one who gave them this date and also to his colleagues before he died so we as a family we conclude that that is the real date. 2A02:214A:8435:CB00:9419:D26:2AF1:6A3B (talk) 19:09, 1 May 2024 (UTC)
 * I've had a look back at the sources here: as the article previously noted, Bosanquet in the Antiquaries Journal does give 1851, but he's an outlier; he's also the only one that gives 1 May rather than 2 May. Reinach went for 1850, as do practically all modern published works. However, I had missed that the BMJ gave his age at death as 80, which puts his year of birth at either 1848 or 1847, almost certainly the former (they don't give his birthday), so I've expanded the footnote a bit so that interested readers can see the disagreements in the primary sources. UndercoverClassicist T·C 20:00, 1 May 2024 (UTC)
 * Bosanquet mentions in the first lines "at the age of 77" and that's the correct age, 1851-1928. 2A02:214A:8435:CB00:9419:D26:2AF1:6A3B (talk) 20:14, 1 May 2024 (UTC)
 * He does, but he's out of line with every other source, and we have to take the consensus of published sources, such as it exists. If there's some reason to go against that consensus, we need something published in a very strong, vetted source before we can do so. UndercoverClassicist T·C 20:21, 1 May 2024 (UTC)
 * Thank you both for your input. I don't have anything to add to what has said: with the policies and guidelines of Wikipedia being what they are, we should only change the birth date in the presence of a high-quality published source. Modussiccandi (talk) 12:19, 3 May 2024 (UTC)