Talk:Papal regalia and insignia

Coat of arms
The coat of arms of the Holy See and of the Vatican City are absolutely identical. Contrary to some urban legend the position of the golden and silver key are not swapped. See Holy See Press Office - Coat of Arms of the Holy See and of the State of Vatican City. Gugganij (talk) 21:09, 25 March 2008 (UTC)
 * So, in other words, you removed text because it agreed with you? The text you removed said they were identical. Gimmetrow 21:29, 25 March 2008 (UTC)
 * Well, I removed a wrong depiction of the coat of arms and the following bit: "The arms of Vatican City are identical, except that by custom since 1929, the silver key is placed in the position of honour." The second part of the sentence is not correct. I retained the first (correct) part, I just moved it up a bit. Gugganij (talk) 22:53, 25 March 2008 (UTC)
 * On what grounds do you say the depiction is "wrong". Keep in mind that heraldry allows substantial variation, and the image you removed is from a noted heraldry expert. Either cite sources justifying your assertions that the arms of the Vatican are never represented that way, or I will revert them. Gimmetrow 00:52, 26 March 2008 (UTC)
 * You are right, heraldry allows for variations and historically the positions of the golden and the silver key where swapped occasionally. But still the description of the coat of arms provided by the Holy See Press Office clearly states "Coat of Arms of the Holy See AND of the State of the Vatican City" and doesn't mention any difference between the two concerning the position of the golden and silver key. But let's suppose that there are variations in the representation of the coat of arm, a reliable sources has still to be found which connects those variations to the supposed differences of the coat of arms of the Vatican and of the Holy See respectively. Where exactly does the source support the except that by custom since 1929... claim? I simply couldn't find it. Gugganij (talk) 01:35, 26 March 2008 (UTC)
 * The distinction can be cited to Heim, of course. The FOTW page gives some indication the custom goes back to 1929 (at least). Gimmetrow 01:43, 26 March 2008 (UTC)
 * Hi, neither Heim nor the Press Office of the Holy See give any hint that possible variations concerning the position of the keys are based on a distinction between the CoA of the SCV and of the HS. If otherwise, I would be glad if you could give me a link. The content of the linked FOTW page is a collection of opinions sent to the editors of the website by people who might have a knowledge concerning this topic or not. Anyway, click at "Vatican Flag Myths" (Myth 5) at this website. regards Gugganij (talk) 02:07, 26 March 2008 (UTC)
 * Read Heim. As for the FOTW page, I know what it is, it's the source you keep removing. It explains the 1929 thing, which is what you asked about. Gimmetrow 20:34, 26 March 2008 (UTC)

TYPOS
That last edit of mine on the article was just a small typo... fixed it! (Rosewater Alchemist (talk) 04:04, 16 April 2008 (UTC))

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