Talk:Patrick Edward Connor

Mining question
Isn't Connor considered the father of Utah mining? I don't have the source material to say more about his activities after the Civil War but from what I remember, he was as influential in Utah Territory as Brigham Young? I think it would be a good idea if anyone has any information on this to include it. Sgthone12 12 June 2006

WikiProject Military history/Assessment/Tag & Assess 2008
Article reassessed and graded as start class. --dashiellx (talk) 20:14, 17 June 2008 (UTC)

Bear River Massacre/Battle of Bear River
Indian massacre is the appropriate title and this is not an Indian POV. Connor led the massacre of as many as 350 sleeping peaceful Shoshone men women and children in the most brutal and inhumane fashion fathomable. The proper telling of the history of this monster would put him right along side other murderers of his ilk such as Adolf Hitler208.117.120.18 (talk) 02:12, 3 June 2015 (UTC)

Given the context of this article (it is about P. Edward Connor), most of the scholarly articles and biographies regarding Connor and his actions in the winter of 1862/1863 call it the "Battle of Bear River", which is also how it was referred to by official government reports of the action at the time. The hyperlinks do point to the correct article (where the "Battle of Bear River" is explicitly mentioned as one of the names of that event), so this isn't even an issue other than trying to inject some "political correctness" into this article.

The rationale for changing the name of this battle, the "Usual name", is not really even consistent although it is true that most modern histories often refer to this as the "Bear River Massacre".

As to capitalizing the word "Massacre"... I'll leave that to grammar Nazis. I think it should remain in upper case if it is used, but that is a battle I'm not willing to kill myself over. --Robert Horning (talk) 21:22, 10 August 2009 (UTC)


 * agree, this should be in main body, also comparison to Col Chivington and sand creek massacre, why was this connor not courtmartialed? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 174.63.103.0 (talk) 04:19, 14 February 2023 (UTC)


 * As General Connor's modus operandi is established through reliable references the appropriateness of the link will become evident. Fred Talk 22:30, 21 August 2009 (UTC)


 * I never said the link was inappropriate. I just suggested that forcing a Native American POV onto this article that is explicitly about a Civil War era officer is inappropriate, and contradictory to the context of sources that are about this individual.  From Connor's perspective, it was "The Battle of Bear River", and one of the defining moments of his military career.  As I said, the full context of this name is spelled out in the Bear River Massacre article anyway.  I will admit that most modern scholarship does refer to the Massacre rather than the Battle, and there has even been some explicit scholarship that argues about what name is most appropriate for the event.


 * On the other hand, there is much more to the history of Utah that ties in with P. Edward Connor, including his role in being the "father of Utah mining" that is significantly missing from this article. Perhaps I need to dig into this topic some more.  --Robert Horning (talk) 01:51, 24 August 2009 (UTC)

Another attempt to change the name of this section has happened. I'm willing to listen to a contrary opinion on this issue, but at least make a good argument rather than simply change the name without another comment on the matter. Most of the sources that include Conner as the primary area of interest list the name of the event as "The Battle of Bear River". Please don't be politically correct and simply change this title because it offends you.... try to understand what it is about and learn a bit from history. --Robert Horning (talk) 23:58, 16 November 2011 (UTC)

Reported/Depositions
This edit on this article was a somewhat legitimate effort to clean up this article and perhaps to do what this editor perceived was an archaic term. The truth is that the term "deposition" is a specific legal term (which I just added a hyperlink) that has a meaning which would be lost with this edit. I can appreciate efforts to simplify this paragraph and make it easier to read.

In this case, the deposition was given to the Chief Justice of the Utah Territorial Supreme Court and a warrant was issued for the arrest of the chiefs of the Shoshone band in Cache Valley (and rationale for the attack). All of this is covered in the Bear River Massacre article in better detail, but I'm explaining why I reverted the edit even though it was made in good faith. If there is a better explanation for why the earlier edit by User:76.126.73.138 needs to stand, I'm willing to attempt to come to consensus here. --Robert Horning (talk)

Newspaper

An accurate telling of the true life of Patrick Connor is seriously wanting. He was one of the most despicable characters of the Old West. Murderer of more Indians that any other person in U.S. history, a bigot who used his military force, not only to murder innocent Shoshone's but to mock, ridicule and terrorize a vulnerable population of Mormon settlers scratching out an existence hundreds of miles from the nearest population centers where they had fled after suffering persecution by other religious bigots like Connor. To call the rag he printed a "Newspaper" is a huge historical inaccuracy. It was a tool he used to ridicule, slander and mock the Mormons upon whom he was enforcing a form of martial law by disarming their militias and boasting that he had his artillery trained on the home of Mormon leader Brigham Young. Would the authors laud the rags that printed Hitler's anti-Jewish hate speech because Connor's "newspaper" because Connor's paper was of precisely the same character and used for the same purpose208.117.120.18 (talk) 02:29, 3 June 2015 (UTC)