Talk:Patrick O'Donnell (Invincible)

POV-pushing

 * Recently rv edits by st o'hara which were blatant propganda. Recommend vigilance by editors. Quis separabit?  18:30, 5 May 2013 (UTC)

Neutrality Respected/ should not use loaded words and phrases
As an historian I find some Wiki articles on Irish history  reflect a bias, evidenced by some  loaded words and phrases used to describe Irish nationalists, for example. One such example, Irish republican  Fenians are said to be committed to "plotting" "acts of terror." In fact, Fenians and other republican groups  were viewed as heroes by most Irish, as men fighting against English invaders who had brought suffering and death to Ireland over centuries. Fenians and other such groups planned  actions against English rulers and their agents;  they were at war with England. In what way does that justify calling them "terrorists" in an article in an encyclopedia? According to such logic the founders of America could also be called "terrorists." Calling acclaimed and honored national heroes of Ireland, who ultimately won freedom for their oppressed country, terrorists is not suitable  for an encyclopedic entry-- despite what the American government, loyal to England, may or may not have thought of them at the time. I will not revise your edit. There are comprehensive works on Irish history that accurately describe the reasons the Irish were driven to war with England. I believe careful students of history will make accurate assessments despite the bias of history's "winners." Your definition  of terrorism below does not clarify since it could also be a description  of warfare. — Preceding unsigned comment added by St o'hara (talk • contribs) 19:38, 5 May 2013 (UTC)

The allegations made in this article that O'Donnell "retaliated against some of those involved in the attacks on his family" in Pennsylvania are referenced  only by a book  title (Kevin Kenny's book on the Molly Maguires) with no page number or specific source for this information cited. The other citation is a "timeline" of unattributed origin, uncertain authorship, and  therefore very problematic as a trustworthy historical reference. — Preceding unsigned comment added by St o'hara (talk • contribs) 16:37, 8 May 2013 (UTC)


 * I am familiar with the adage "one man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter", but that is not how to build articles on an encyclopaedia. As an American citizen, I can say that terrorist tactics were employed in the American Revolutionary War on both sides, and during the American Civil War, for that matter.
 * The Fenians were regarded in their time, including by the United States government which refused to abet them in their Canadian exploits, as a terrorist organization, as were its successor movements (do I need to spell them out?), and categorized that way on Wikipedia. The Stern Gang, the Irgun, the African National Congress, Hamas, Hezbollah, and many others too numerous to name regard(ed) themselves as patriots and/or claim(ed) to be fighting for freedom. That doesn't necessarily make it so, nor does it pass the NPOV test. Their supporters have their plenty of access to forms of media and propaganda by which to pass on their messages and/or construct hagiographies, but not here. And the term "acts of terrorism" is not loaded or disrespectful, it is an accurate description of bombings, dynamiting, assassinations, etc. Quis separabit?  23:34, 5 May 2013 (UTC)
 * the bias of history's "winners" —— does that include Michael Collins? Quis separabit?  17:41, 6 May 2013 (UTC)
 * Not all terrorism is warfare and not all warfare is terrorism, but sometimes they intersect. Quis separabit?  17:41, 6 May 2013 (UTC)

Updates
Updates should be made in line with Wikipedia policies. Wikipedia is not a blog or a fansite. Text must be validly sourced. Text which is unsourced and/or which violates NPOV will be removed. Quis separabit? 17:52, 9 May 2013 (UTC)

External links modified
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 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20110927184452/http://student.ccbcmd.edu/~wbarry/Mollytimeline.doc to http://student.ccbcmd.edu/~wbarry/Mollytimeline.doc
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20121129151347/http://www.red-duster.co.uk/UNION12.htm to http://www.red-duster.co.uk/UNION12.htm

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Relatives
Theo Hannon, Long Island from December 23rd, 2006 to now. Great Great Great Grandfather’s Brother is Patrick O’Donnell. 47.16.185.185 (talk) 23:10, 23 May 2024 (UTC)