Talk:Patty Duke

Cortisone shot
"cortizone shot"? Do you mean "cortisone shot"? - Karada 12:12, 25 Apr 2004 (UTC)

Confusingly worded statement, and Uncited
I suspect someone mistakenly changed or omitted an important detail while summarizing a quote or article about the show moving to california, however no article is cited so its impossible to be 100% sure how to correct the snippet.

Current text:

>> In reality, United Artists Television (UATV) refused ABC's demand for a switch to color, when Duke suspected that the studio executives said no as a negotiating ploy in the hope that the alphabet network would respond with an offer to pay more money for the series on the condition that it continued to film it in black-and-white. <<

Logically this doesn't make a whole lot of sense (and switching to calling ABC "The Alphabet Network" doesn't help)

If i parse this correctly the supposition is:

0) That this somehow related to the sections above and below about the show's move to California and how it was being resisted. 1) ABC demanded Color 2) UATV Refused 3) Patty Duke believed UATV refused as a barganing tactic 4) The supposed premise is that ABC would then be insentivised to pay them more money for the show in black and white.

4.a) Wouldn't it be more likely they were withholding color in order to get more money for filming in color, since ABC wanted color?

4.b) Alternately wouldn't it be as likely that they were refusing color to get the same money for the show ABC offered on the condition it be in color without having to pay the additional costs of filming in color?

Which is it? Motivations are unclear.

4.c) How did this affect the show to cause it to be moved/not moved as soon to California? The snippet appears juxtiposed between two paragraphs pertaining to that subject..

Controversy?
Does anyone find it 'unseemly' that 'Richard', Patty's 'high-school boyfriend', was eleven years older than she was ( in real life ) in 1964? Had this been widely known to the general public, i suspect the show would have been canceled rather quickly. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 4.243.111.228 (talk) 22:14, 4 September 2009 (UTC)

Gay Icon Project
In my effort to merge the now-deleted list from the article Gay icon to the Gay icons category, I have added this page to the category. I engaged in this effort as a "human script", adding everyone from the list to the category, bypassing the fact-checking stage. That is what I am relying on you to do. Please check the article Gay icon and make a judgment as to whether this person or group fits the category. By distributing this task from the regular editors of one article to the regular editors of several articles, I believe that the task of fact-checking this information can be expedited. Thank you very much. Philwelch 20:29, 24 Mar 2005 (UTC)

depressive vs maniac?
The sentence "In what was likely to have been a depressive episode Duke quickly married rock promoter Michael Tell, who she had literally just met." I'm pretty sure that that would be maniac episode. However, 1) I'm not positive and 2) of course its hard to sort these things out and label things with clarity. So I left it. But anyone who knows more about this sort of thing might want to change it. Herostratus 18:01, 25 December 2005 (UTC)


 * That's manic, not "maniac." :-P BobCubTAC (talk) 07:56, 16 June 2011 (UTC)

Sean's Father
"After her marriage to Michael Tell, Duke discovered she was pregnant with her first child...Sean was actually Michael Tell's biological son."

Is there a cite for this? Just yesterday I was reading Patty Duke's book "A Brilliant Madness" in which she says that she was pregnant *before* she married Michael. That's why they got married - because she was freaked out about being unmarried and pregnant. She later goes on to say that the 13-day marriage was never consummated. Unless someone has a cite where Ms. Duke herself says that Michael was Sean's father, I think this line should be eliminated. 66.251.84.28 16:56, 3 November 2006 (UTC)
 * You're right. A quick perusal of Google search results turns up just one mention of this claim (aside from this Wikipedia article), The Lucille Ball Quiz Book by Michael Karol, who cites Star magazine, a gossip rag with little credibility. I suspect that implying she lied in her autobiography is libelous, so I will edit this section the best I can. --anon.70.23.193.106 (talk) 21:06, 10 February 2008 (UTC)
 * What a mess! After reading this article I assumed (seeing as it is not said at all) that Sean's father was Desi Jr., then I go over to Sean's article (for which there is no link, even though there is one for Mackenzie) and it clearly says his father is Michael Tell.

Whoever edits these articles should keep a straight line really, this is a total mess, and Patty's page is the worst. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.55.217.37 (talk) 01:26, 22 September 2008 (UTC)

Many years ago Sean had a paternity test done and it was determined that Michael Tell is Sean’s biological father. That said, with great dedication, John Astin raised Sean from the time Sean was six months old until he was a young adult and is still an important part of Sean's life. The confusion comes only because in the past many people for many reasons told untruths about Sean’s father. Today, no one disputes the above facts. If you look carefully at past publications one can determine who is a reliable source of information and who is not. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Allisbeautiful (talk • contribs) 23:15, 1 July 2009 (UTC)

It looks as though she was pregnant by Tell before she married him, so their 13-day marriage could technically have been unconsummated. 86.183.121.248 (talk) 13:32, 4 January 2013 (UTC)

I'm the one who referred above to the paternity claims she made in "A Brilliant Madness." I just want to clarify that this is NOT her "1987 autobiography" which the wiki article refers to under "Personal Life." Her autobiography, published in 1987 was "Call Me Anna." The book where she claimed that her marriage to Tell was never consummated and that he was not Sean's father was a different book. That was "A Brilliant Madness," published in 1992, which was an account of her mental health struggles. 72.231.189.146 (talk) 17:09, 28 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Just my two cents. First, she almost certainly engaged in sexual acts with Tell. Whether intercourse was involved is likely, but not absolutely necessary to become pregnant. (I suppose his semen could have been inserted by a third party, but there's zero evidence for that.) So, her claim that their marriage was never "consummated" is grossly misleading at best, and a lie at worst. (Given her mental health history, it's also quite possible that she believed her own false narrative - no way for us to know.) What IS certain is that the ONLY reasons her claim (of non-consummation) is *notable* is that it contrasts sharply with the reality and she misled - or lied to - her son. The claim has *nothing* to say about their 13 day marriage. While she deserves sympathy for her mental struggles, and there is good reason to mention this falsehood (with regard to her relationship with her son), there is no reason to include it in discussing the marriage, as far as I can see. I note it is nearly certain that she and Tell consummated their sexual relationship, whether married or not.174.130.71.156 (talk) 06:08, 13 January 2023 (UTC)
 * She was pregnant before getting married. It's very possible that she didn't sleep with Tell after getting married. Thus the statement would be true. Having bipolar disorder or depression doesn't turn a person into a notorious liar. She was dating three men at the same time, she might have simply not known herself who the father was as all three were possible candidates. Nakonana (talk) 16:55, 8 June 2024 (UTC)

Commercial announcement?
I'm new to wiki editing, so don't have confidence on policy interpretation. Does the "Revision as of 21:31, 6 January 2009" meet the prohibition against being "an advertising platform"? (from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Five_pillars) LamoniDave (talk) 03:22, 11 January 2009 (UTC)

Adding Pictures
I have attempted several times in the past few weeks to incorporate pictures into the Patty Duke bio, but apparently some fan keeps deleting them -- I guess they don't suit the fan. Therefore, I deleted any existing pictures I had on there, and you wonderful fans can have your Patty Duke page. Maybe you should get it password protected! Have fun. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Markysl (talk • contribs) 04:58, 11 July 2009 (UTC)
 * The pictures are being deleted because their copyright is held by a third-party who has not given Wikipedia permission to use them in a manner compatible with Wikipedia's license. You can read more about copyright policies at FAQ/Copyright. Additionally, you may be able to request permission from some of the third-party copyright holders. Some notes about this can be found at Requesting copyright permission.&mdash;C45207 | Talk 21:10, 11 July 2009 (UTC)

Wicked?
I just saw Patty Duke in the musical Wicked as Madame Morrible. Shouldn't that be added to the page? I would add it myself but I'm new and confused. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Fluffalo (talk • contribs) 02:05, 14 November 2009 (UTC)
 * It's already in the article. It's under the "2000s" section.  Pinkadelica ♣  02:10, 14 November 2009 (UTC)

bipolar or manic depression? well which is it?
Patty Duke has what mental illiness? --Huik01 (talk) 06:14, 28 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Bipolar and Manic Depression are the same illness. Safiel (talk) 01:18, 1 March 2010 (UTC)

Patty Duke Show reunion movie
I remember seeing Duke in her dual adult Patty/Cathy role in a recent TV reunion movie, but I can't remember what it was called (I think even William Schallert was in it, but I'm not sure.) Probably deserves a mention. Does anyone know how to look it up? JustinTime55 (talk) 15:54, 15 April 2011 (UTC)
 * It would be on IMBD, I guess - pretty much everything is. www.imbd.com Herostratus (talk) 05:03, 16 April 2011 (UTC)

It was "The Patty Duke Show Reunion Movie - Still Rockin' in Brooklyh Heights" and is included on the DVD set The Patty Duke Show Season 3 released by Shout Factory. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 50.136.0.224 (talk) 02:58, 18 March 2012 (UTC)

Inappropriate project tag
I just removed tagging of this article under Women's History Project. User talk:Dimadick links to a project discussion of the appropriateness of widespread tagging of this subject. Here's what I contributed there:


 * "If we're having a problem deciding what women's history means, here's an idea: why don't we try using the definition that we've created in Women's history?
 * ...the study of the role that women have played in history
 * ...includes the study of the history of:
 * the growth (and decline) of woman's[sic] rights throughout recorded history [should be women's rights]
 * ...individual women of historical significance
 * "*...the effect that historical events have had on women."
 * Duke clearly doesn't qualify on any account, so I'm going to apply WP:BOLD and simply delete it. JustinTime55 (talk) 20:03, 18 May 2011 (UTC)

The tag "Women's History" is also used for a biography of any woman born before 1950. This article was correctly tagged. MurielMary (talk) 08:59, 30 March 2016 (UTC)

External links modified
Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just added archive links to 1 one external link on Patty Duke. Please take a moment to review my edit. If necessary, add after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/20090808153839/http://www.socialsecurity.gov:80/pressoffice/psa-video-all.htm to http://www.socialsecurity.gov/pressoffice/psa-video-all.htm

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Cheers.—cyberbot II  Talk to my owner :Online 03:00, 7 January 2016 (UTC)

Death
While it may be too soon, the section on her death claims she had been fighting mental "illnesses" for "several years"; this is extremely misleading: she had suffered from mental illness for over 50 years. Fifty is not "several". Death caused by a ruptured intestine suggests she was suffering from some other, possibly chronic or terminal, disease - but this is speculation. My recollection is that she was institutionalized either a couple of years before her debut on the Patty Duke show, or within a couple of years after, which isn't mentioned as far as I can see. I don't know if she acknowledged it in her autobiography? I'm sorry to hear she died.Abitslow (talk) 18:32, 29 March 2016 (UTC)
 * What a shock. So she didn't make it to 70. How did she develop a fatal case of sepsis? She was really attractive in the day, also funny, and always, of course, incredibly talented. Quis separabit?  00:53, 30 March 2016 (UTC)

Uncited statements on singing career
I removed the following statements from the section on singing career as they were uncited and I couldn't find any reliable source for them. Can be replaced if they can be cited.
 * Also during 1968, she had appeared on The Tonight Show Starring Johnny Carson, and after George Jessel's comic appearance, she was introduced and sang the Irish classic, "Danny Boy". She also sang songs on such shows as Shindig!, Kraft Music Hall, The Mike Douglas Show, and The Merv Griffin Show. She sang in the 1965 feature film Billie and sang on the soundtrack of the 1966 feature film, The Daydreamer, in which she voiced the character of Thumbelina. She has recorded a string of six LP's in her musical career.

Uncited statements on agents' behaviour
Removed as uncited:
 * Despite her successful career, Duke was deeply miserable during her teenage years. The Rosses made efforts to portray her as a normal teenager, but she later indicated in her memoir Call Me Anna that she was virtually the Rosses' prisoner, and had little control over her earnings or her life. The Rosses controlled her and her mother by allowing them only a small amount of money to survive on. They also started supplying Duke with alcohol and prescription drugs when she was 13; this, along with her undiagnosed bipolar disorder, contributed to her young-adult substance-abuse problems. As an adult, Duke accused both Rosses of sexual abuse. Upon turning 18, Duke became legally free of the Rosses, only to discover that they had squandered most of her earnings, in violation of the Coogan Act.
 * There is a citation of Call Me Anna, although it should have been a formal citation with page numbers, publication date, etc. If no one has provided this by the next time I'm at the local library I'll try to borrow the book and update the artice. Strawberry4Ever (talk) 12:14, 30 March 2016 (UTC)
 * Thanks! However I just found some similar information in the Washington Post obituary so I've put that in, in the section on her early life. MurielMary (talk) 12:17, 30 March 2016 (UTC)

Colon vs comma
It might not be worth arguing about, but I believe that the following sentence at the end of the "Personal life" section is incorrect: Duke had three granddaughters by her eldest son Sean, actress Alexandra "Ali" Astin, Elizabeth and Isabella. Taken literally, this sentence is saying that Duke had three granddaughters by her eldest son Sean, three granddaughters by actress Alexandra "Ali" Astin, three granddaughters by Elizabeth, and three granddaughters by Isabella, or it could be taken as saying that all four of them cooperated somehow in producing three granddaughters.

As I see it, this should be changed to: Duke had three granddaughters by her eldest son Sean: actress Alexandra "Ali" Astin and her sisters Elizabeth and Isabella. This is consistent with the colon usage called for at MOS:COLON: "A colon informs the reader that what comes after it demonstrates, explains, or modifies what has come before, or is a list of items that has just been introduced."

The words "and her sisters" were in an earlier version of the article but were edited out at some point.

My edit to change the comma after Sean to a colon was reverted twice by. What do others think? Strawberry4Ever (talk) 12:50, 30 March 2016 (UTC)
 * Agree with you and have changed it to the colon. I think I took out "and her sisters" because I thought it was unnecessary. MurielMary (talk) 12:55, 30 March 2016 (UTC)
 * Thanks, . |I don't have a strong opinion about whether "and her sisters" should be in the sentence. It would definitely not be necessary if the sentence were "Duke had three granddaughters by her eldest son Sean: Alexandra, Elizabeth and Isabella", but since additional information is given about Alexandra I thought there should be more separation between her and the other two than just a comma. Not a big deal. Strawberry4Ever (talk) 13:12, 30 March 2016 (UTC)

Match Game and other game shows
Additional TV credits for Duke include a number of appearances on the 70s Match Game as a panelist, as well as a few other game shows, with I believe at least one show where she appeared with John Astin. Filling in these credits would be appreciated. 73.174.36.17 (talk) 21:08, 26 April 2016 (UTC)

New Photo
I’ve added a new photo of Patty; one free and clear from any copyright snaffoos. It’s an image still I created myself from a Social Security online film. Which means it’s owned by the United States government.

Please tell me what you think. I’ve wanted to see a quality main photo of her as an accomplished adult for quite some time. She wasn’t only a child actor. She had a long, rich career. Thanks.Clarawolfe (talk) 00:28, 13 June 2018 (UTC) Clarawolfe (talk) 00:28, 13 June 2018 (UTC)
 * I prefer the Patty Duke (1962) - 1.JPG photo for the infobox, because it's from the period of her life for which she is best remembered. The Pattymedicare.jpg photo can be used later in the article. Strawberry4Ever (talk) 01:20, 13 June 2018 (UTC)


 * Agreed, it is normal practise after a famous person death for the infobox image to be changed to one of their "hayday". -  FlightTime Phone  ( open channel ) 01:26, 13 June 2018 (UTC)

Sometimes, but not always. Many child actors are featured on Wikipedia with adult photos. Who’s to say when one’s “hay day” is? After all, I’m sure her private “hay day” was long after childhood. Thanks for the feedback anyhow.Clarawolfe (talk) 02:06, 13 June 2018 (UTC)

Place of Birth?
An editor changed the place of birth from Queens to Manhattan. I did a quick search, determined the change was incorrect and changed it back, messaging the editor a courtesy heads up. The user restated that Patty Duke's biography states she was born in Manhattan (Bellevue Hospital). Trying to get a definitive answer I dug a bit deeper only to discover that multiple sources give conflicting information, and they all seem to be drawing from the same Associated Press article.

Bellevue Hospital, Manhattan, NY
 * her autobiography
 * Orange County Register - https://www.ocregister.com/2016/03/29/oscar-winning-actress-patty-duke-dies-at-69/
 * Irish Times - https://www.irishtimes.com/culture/film/child-actor-and-oscar-winner-patty-duke-dies-at-69-1.2591371

Elmhurst, NY
 * Los Angeles Times - https://www.latimes.com/local/obituaries/la-me-patty-duke-20160330-story.html
 * prior Wikipedia entry

Queens, NY
 * The Associated Press - https://www.apnews.com/a0b794cd623e47f98815ceb1d4b17db1
 * Chicago Tribune - https://www.chicagotribune.com/entertainment/tv/ct-patty-duke-dead-20160329-story.html

Can anyone find sources from earlier in her life that haven't been muddied by the AP death announcement to help us resolve this? Thank you! Orville1974 (talk) 00:48, 19 May 2019 (UTC)


 * Resolved based on editor discussion on the request for assistance page. I've reverted my edit and returned the content posted by 100.2.234.214 referencing Manhattan as Patty Duke's birthplace. Orville1974 (talk) 16:32, 20 May 2019 (UTC)

Footnote: Elmhurst is part of Queens. Carlm0404 (talk) 01:33, 11 September 2020 (UTC)

Incorrect age listed
Duke was actually 15 in The Miracle Worker. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.166.83.180 (talk) 02:19, 15 March 2020 (UTC)

explaining how many children
I found "Children.     3, including Sean and Mackenzie Astin". I find 4 adoptees in the text, with 3 of them (John Astin's sons) reversing their adoption in 1998. So that leaves 3 children, including 1 adoptee, right? Carlm0404 (talk) 01:40, 11 September 2020 (UTC)

Timeline around The $64,000 Question
It's stated in the 1950s - 1990s Acting section that Duke was a contestant on The $64,000 Question in 1959, however the show was canceled in 1958. I would assume this actually meant 1958, but cannot confirm when the episode she was in actually aired/was shot. 2600:1700:5881:4B70:C925:8262:B091:A4CF (talk) 04:13, 19 November 2023 (UTC)