Talk:Perfect Dark/Archive 2

Proposal to merge Perfect Dark (soundtrack) here
I'd like to propose that Perfect Dark (soundtrack) be merged into this article as a separate "Soundtrack" section. This merge would basically be a straight copypaste here with nothing lost with the possible exception of the album cover, depending if the WP:NFCC is still satisfied with its inclusion. Basically, the Perfect Dark article is not terribly large, and I think it would benefit readers better if we kept all information about the game, including the soundtrack, in one place as opposed to all over. –MuZemike 18:14, 13 July 2010 (UTC)
 * Personally, I don't agree with the merge. I think there should be one article per entity, and Perfect Dark Original Soundtrack has its own distinct existence since it's a product that was separately released after the N64 game. Actually, I also don't like the fact that the XBLA remake is merged with this article and the fact that Zero's soundtrack is included in the Perfect Dark Zero article. If we are going to include the album here, why don't we include the GBC game? Niwi3 (talk) 01:27, 15 July 2010 (CET)
 * Disagree, but not vehemently. Despite not having much in the way of details by itself, I feel that the album article is still meaningful enough in terms of quantity (at least considering the amount of tracks) to warrant it being separate from the main Perfect Dark article—similar to Ocarina of Time. Mac Dreamstate (talk) 18:31, 15 July 2010 (UTC)

Several article issues
There are a lot of issues with this article, and I don't think that it would even pass Good article criteria with current standards. I'm bringing this to the talk page first (as this was my first FAR, I was unaware this was necessary and must have missed reading it in the instructions). Issues listed below


 * Issues with specific references
 * IMDB (unreliable source)
 * detStar (notability not established)
 * Can be replaced by simply citing the game using Cite video game
 * Replaced
 * CheatCodesGuides.com (per WP:GAMETRIVIA)
 * Can be replaced by simply citing the game using Cite video game
 * Replaced
 * Yamo's Lair (notability not established)
 * Removed as non-notable
 * "The Rare Witch Project Wiki" (per WP:RS wikis cannot be used)
 * Removed
 * moddb.com (unreliable source per WikiProject Video games/Sources)
 * Replaced
 * The refs/links in general could use some looking over


 * Issues with reference formatting in general. Format is not consistent, rarely lists authors of web articles, etc.
 * Several dead links can be replaced, although admittedly there may be some that can't.
 * Entire paragraphs under the Gameplay and Development sections are unsourced.
 * The Reception section is poorly organized and lacking in content overall.
 * File:Perfect Dark Japanese Ad.jpg, File:Goldeneye-in-perfect-dark.jpg too large per WP:NFCC.
 * There's a direct external link which should be a wikilink in the article
 * The article has an overuse of images per WP:NFCC. Not all images are needed to convey the game to the reader.
 * Fair use rationale needs beefing up on most of the images
 * Some image captions are simply "this is what you see in the image" rather than useful captions per WP:CAPTION
 * There are several small paragraphs which can be merged
 * There is no alt text on any of the images

I'll be following this for a week to see if there are any responses and repairs made. If none are, I will then reinstated the FAR. --Teancum (talk) 02:46, 29 November 2010 (UTC)


 * I will try and fix up the article when I can. I'll primary focus on sourcing improvements. This might be useful: IGN: Perfect Dark Articles. By the way, if anyone wants to jump in and do it, feel free. --Niwi3 (talk) 16:41, 29 November 2010 (CET)
 * I've marked completed issues. The Reception section still has small paragraphs, but I'm assuming those'll be taken care of when it is reorganized. --Teancum (talk) 19:09, 30 November 2010 (UTC)
 * Would it be a good idea to remove the screenshot of Elvis in the Plot section? In my opinion, it does not provide useful info and messes up the article. --Niwi3 (talk) 13:15, 01 December 2010 (CET)
 * Yep - it does nothing for the article. I'd move the new image up to its spot to comply with WP:MOSIMAGES. --Teancum (talk) 13:13, 1 December 2010 (UTC)
 * Scaled down File:Perfect Dark Japanese Ad.jpg and File:Goldeneye-in-perfect-dark.jpg --Niwi3 (talk) 15:46, 02 November 2010 (CET)


 * Note: If another review is necessary, the online print archive contains one. JimmyBlackwing (talk) 04:34, 5 December 2010 (UTC)


 * I've updated the issues listed above, there are still two major issues remaining that unless fixed will send this to FAR. The first is the sourcing: There are several unreliable, or dubioiusly reliable sources, and the reference format is all over the place for this article.  The second is that the fair use rationale needs beefing up on everything but the game cover.  See File:Halo3odst-campaign.png for an example.  I'll give another week before taking this to FAR.  I've done some work, but I just don't have time to clean up all the references. --Teancum (talk) 13:01, 6 December 2010 (UTC)
 * I'll try to fix the references tonight --Niwi3 (talk) 15:46, 06 December 2010 (CET)


 * I've looked over the article again. Not much left - the detStar and CheatCodesGuides.com references can simply be replaced by citing the video game (see above).  Just that and another runthrough to cleanup the reference formatting several refs is needed (publishers missing, authors missing, incorrect titles, and inconsistent date format).  Given that this is being worked on, I'll give it another three weeks before going to FAR.  I know we're all busy. --Teancum (talk) 06:26, 10 December 2010 (UTC)
 * I will fix the remaining references next week as I have time. I'm very busy this week. --Niwi3 (talk) 00:15, 13 December 2010 (CET)
 * Fixed references in Marketing and Sales section. --Niwi3 (talk) 01:09, 21 December 2010 (CET)
 * Fixed references in Gameplay section. --Niwi3 (talk) 23:52, 11 January 2011 (CET)
 * Fixed references in Game Engine section. --Niwi3 (talk) 23:16, 13 January 2011 (CET)
 * I think I've fixed all the issues listed. However, if there are still more, let me know.<--Niwi3 (talk) 00:53, 15 January 2011 (CET)

Article and RARE are listing an incorrect resolution
The article and RARE's latest video on the making of Perfect Dark says the game's Hi Res mode runs in 480i, but that's incorrect. First of all, several RARE staff interview articles in the past 10 years have mentioned the hi-resolution mode, but they have never stated how high it actually is. In RARE's latest 'Making of Perfect Dark' video, Ken Lobb says the game runs in 480i, but here's the deal: Ken Lobb did not work on the game as anything related to development (he's listed as "thanks to"). If he thinks the game's 480i, then he's basing it on hearsay. The final nail on this coffin is that when you run the game on an emulator, enable hi-res mode and take a screenshot directly from the framebuffer (using angrylion's pixel accurate plugin), the game's resolution is 640x218, which is NOT 480i (640x480). It was normal for games from the Playstation/Nintendo 64 era to have quasi-high horizontal or vertical resolutions, so instead of having full Hi-Res (640x480), they had quasi-hi res (640x224 or 320x480, and the such). So to avoid any edit wars, could someone else back me up on this? I already changed the info, though, but hopefully I get some support in case people decide to revert the changes. ReyVGM (talk) 20:41, 2 January 2016 (UTC)

Just to add a few more points. The copyright & title screen run at 574x474, but the actual gameplay only goes up as high as 640x218. In normal mode, the resolution is 320x218; in hi-res mode the resolution is 640x218. Here are some screenshots: normal res http://i.imgur.com/9HFMekB.png, hi-res http://i.imgur.com/zWCZzTi.png. And one last clarification: these resolution woes cannot be experienced by playing on an actual CRT because TVs of the era stretched all images to 640x480 regardless of the video-feed resolution. But since we are discussing the game's internal resolution, and not what TVs did, then 480i is not correct. ReyVGM (talk) 21:14, 2 January 2016 (UTC)
 * Maybe Lobb was actually meaning 640x218; 480i can mean different things depending on the context. In any case, let's just avoid numbers to avoid confusion. --Niwi3 (talk) 00:04, 3 January 2016 (UTC)
 * Yeah, avoiding numbers is best, that's why I didn't even replace it with the correct res. ReyVGM (talk) 02:23, 4 January 2016 (UTC)

External links modified
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External links modified
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I have just modified 5 external links on Perfect Dark. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:
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External links modified
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"Perfect Dark"" listed at Redirects for discussion
A discussion is taking place to address the redirect Perfect Dark&. The discussion will occur at Redirects for discussion/Log/2020 December 9 until a consensus is reached, and readers of this page are welcome to contribute to the discussion. Dominicmgm (talk) 17:35, 9 December 2020 (UTC)

"List of weapons in Perfect Dark" listed at Redirects for discussion
A discussion is taking place to address the redirect List of weapons in Perfect Dark. The discussion will occur at Redirects for discussion/Log/2020 December 9 until a consensus is reached, and readers of this page are welcome to contribute to the discussion. Dominicmgm (talk) 17:49, 9 December 2020 (UTC)

Proposal to create a separate article for Perfect Dark (Xbox Live Arcade)
Reasons why I think there needs to be a separate article for the remake: In my opinion, creating a separate article for the remake is the best way to fix these issues. Niwi3 (talk) 12:29, 10 November 2010 (CET)
 * The Perfect Dark article is structured in a rather funky way that is, in one word, unclear. Why is the "Xbox Live Arcade" subsection buried in the "Release and Sales" section, when it talks about development and gameplay features? This kind of information should be with development and gameplay respectively, and establishing context earlier.
 * Most sections only provide information about the N64 game and some are even exclusive to it, such as Game engine.
 * The reception section is decent but the XBLA version should have its own Template:VG Reviews template.
 * The XBLA version has its own box art and should be hosted to illustrate the product.
 * The remake is different: the gameplay is slightly different (control of stylus, online features, achievements...), it should also have its own development section as it was not developed by Rare, there's even a patch that fixes some things.
 * Perfect Dark XBLA is a remake, not a port.
 * Here are some examples of remakes with their own article: Conker: Live & Reloaded, Metal Gear Solid: The Twin Snakes, Final Fantasy IV (Nintendo DS), Metroid: Zero Mission.
 * By the way, see also: Jetpac Refuelled. Niwi3 (talk) 13:05, 10 November 2010 (CET)
 * Nobody seems to disagree, so I'll start with the split process. Niwi3 (talk) 12:00, 11 November 2010 (CET)

Proposal to remove the weapons screenshot
Reason why I think the screenshot that shows identical weapons in both GoldenEye 007 and Perfect Dark should be removed:
 * I can judge that the screenshot was taken from an emulated version of Perfect Dark, and as such it does not illustrate correctly how the game looks.
 * The images should be stacked instead of side by side.
 * It has questionable quality.
 * It needs a source.
 * The image is not really needed, as this feature is already mentioned in the campaign subsection.

Overall, I do think it needs to be removed due to these issues. <--Niwi3 (talk) 15:04, 11 February 2011 (CET)
 * Nobody seems to disagree, so I'll remove it. <--Niwi3 (talk) 15:00, 14 February 2011 (CET)