Talk:Phantasy Star Online/GA1

GA Review
The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.''

Reviewer: Red Phoenix (talk · contribs) 12:45, 14 July 2018 (UTC)

I've got dibs on this one. This is one of my absolute favorite Sega games of all time and an article I had my eyes on for quite a while. I'll be glad to review it in the next day or so. Red Phoenix talk  12:45, 14 July 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks for picking this up. Yea this article just needed to get done. There are lots of development interviews in Dreamcast Magazine from Japan that I did not have time to translate, perhaps one day. There are bound to be plenty of grammatical/spelling errors in this one. TarkusAB talk 13:34, 14 July 2018 (UTC)
 * One outstanding thing I was not able to determine was whether the free internet access provided by Okawa was provided with the system or the game. The source I had said both. Would appreciate any knowledge you may have to clear that up. TarkusAB talk 14:13, 14 July 2018 (UTC)

All right, let's get started.

Overall

 * As I read the prose, I have a very strong sense that this article needs a good copyedit from someone who is very experienced - I see all sorts of little things that I just don't get the sense of professional writing (no offense intended, I have the same problem in my own article writing a lot). I'll admit I'm not that person, and honestly I would tell you I feel strongly enough about it that I do consider it a barrier at this point.  You will want to find someone to copyedit the article.  I will personally recommend Popcornduff, as he's a great copyeditor, but I've invoked his name a lot in the last month and I'm not 100% sure he has time.  There are others out there as well who could help.

Lead

 * I would combine the second and third paragraphs, as they basically share the same main concept.
 * Done

Gameplay

 * Players can also exchange guild cards so they exchange private messages - I think you're missing a word here?
 * Done
 * Be careful about using "Players" to start two sentences in a row, as in the third paragraph. Sentence fluency helps to make prose engaging.
 * Done
 * I'd combine the last paragraph into the one before it; it's two sentences and goes right along with what's above it.
 * Done

Plot

 * The plot is pretty short, which I'm okay with; I always disliked long plot summaries of video games. That being said, is it worth mentioning Red Ring Rico and that there are offline quest storylines in the plot?  In the actual gameplay itself, those would seem to be important aspects.

Development

 * "Internet is actually a proper term and needs to be capitalized.
 * Discussed below
 * These network experiments mutated into a game of their own - Questionable verb choice. I'd change it, per WP:ELEVAR; it may be a bit too elegant for the purpose it's serving here.
 * Fixed
 * Third paragraph of "Concept" has "Naka was also" followed by "He was also". Repetitive use of "also" in two straight sentences is in need of attention for sentence fluency.
 * Fixed
 * Sonic Team would not be able to keep the game interesting for long enough - Long enough for what?
 * Fixed
 * Naka had always wanted to develop a multiplayer Phantasy Star game, but the Sega Saturn hardware did not allow for it. The Dreamcast, however, could. - I have a couple of issues here. Firstly, "always wanted" can't be the case if we're then talking about just Saturn hardware since he was with Sega a lot longer than that, even if those were Naka's words, so I would reword.  The last sentence also reads a little awkwardly, certainly impactful but maybe unnecessarily so.  Here's my suggested revision for you: "Naka had wanted to develop a multiplayer Phantasy Star game.  While the Sega Saturn would not allow for such a game, the Dreamcast hardware was capable."
 * Fixed
 * Link Sega Saturn when it appears in Concept, not later in Online functionality.
 * Fixed
 * They considered Italian and Portuguese, but it would take too much time to implement. - Awkwardly worded due to English passive voice, be more direct that they decided against it due to time constraints.
 * Comment - That isn't passive voice. Popcornduff (talk) 13:05, 18 July 2018 (UTC)
 * Call it what you will, but it's still not professional wording and should be more direct.  Red Phoenix  talk  15:32, 18 July 2018 (UTC)
 * "Wrapping production" is an awkward title for a subsection.
 * Maybe Ending production is better, not sure what else to call it
 * A beta version given to journalists had a player-versus-player mode, but this was omitted as it would affect game balance and distracted from the cooperative focus. Also, as the console-playing audience was younger than the PC audience, Naka did not want to include the violent player-versus-player aspects. - Quite awkward. I would try and combine these two sentences and remove the repetitive use of "player-versus-player".
 * Fixed

I'll start there for now and come back to this review later. I will acknowledge at this point that you've done a nice job with this article, turning it from crap to very good in a short amount of time. Red Phoenix talk  02:24, 18 July 2018 (UTC)
 * OK thanks. I will get started making changes. I agree on the need for copy edits, specifically the development through release sections. I never did a copy edit myself, so I'm going to do that as well as seek out experience from someone else. has done some CE for this article already, but perhaps he is willing to do more. If not I can seek out the GOCE for assistance.  TarkusAB talk 12:59, 18 July 2018 (UTC)


 * I'll do a pass at some point. (Note: I'll destroy my Wikipedia account before I consider internet a proper noun.) Popcornduff (talk) 13:03, 18 July 2018 (UTC)
 * I actually feel the same way myself personally, but alas, we even have an article on the capitalization of "Internet", believe it or not.  Red Phoenix  talk  15:32, 18 July 2018 (UTC)
 * I do indeed know about that article. It's not a good article.
 * Wikipedia is actually one of the last places that prefers to capitalise internet. This, imo, is a symptom of Wikipedia being run by a bunch of middle-aged hobbyists stuck in the past in more ways than one - it is the only place on the internet I have ever been lectured to by retired members of the territorial army - but that's by the by. Popcornduff (talk) 16:03, 18 July 2018 (UTC)
 * Ha ha, well you will be glad to know I'm not a middle-aged hobbyist, and personally have no preference but understand we should be consistent. It's quite possible this may be worth a discussion somewhere such as the village pump since even the aforementioned article indicates a shift in how we spell out the term.  It may be worth a discussion for the MOS.  Red Phoenix  talk  19:52, 18 July 2018 (UTC)


 * Comment: Still working through my copyedit, but I notice there's nothing about the music in the article. Is there anything out there about it we can use? I recall this game having a distinctive soundtrack. Popcornduff (talk) 07:21, 22 July 2018 (UTC)
 * I think so. I will look into it. TarkusAB talk 12:08, 22 July 2018 (UTC)
 * I went through all the DC Mag Japanese interviews, and nothing on the music. They were much more concerned about the "network RPG" gameplay, characters, and graphics. They interviewed quite a few people but no composers. TarkusAB talk 11:46, 28 July 2018 (UTC)


 * Another comment: I think the gameplay section is lacking a few details. What about the rhythmic, three-strike, pow-pow-pow combat? Popcornduff (talk) 07:58, 22 July 2018 (UTC)
 * Was that only for warrior classes? Did other classes have similar rhythmic attacking? I don't think forces did. TarkusAB talk 12:08, 22 July 2018 (UTC)
 * It was for all character types for all kinds of attacks. The exception you're thinking of is for casting spells, which didn't use the rhythm system. Forces using guns and hitting things with staffs or whatever still used the rhythm. Popcornduff (talk) 12:11, 22 July 2018 (UTC)


 * Follow-up July 22: I think everything has been followed up on except (1) the plot, which I need to research on cuz I'm not super familiar with the plot details and Red Ring Rico (If you have an idea of what to right, just add it in, will save me some time) and (2) the internet capitalization. Can we just say WP:IGNORE here because it sounds like we all think the capitalization rule is silly? TarkusAB talk 16:26, 22 July 2018 (UTC)
 * Oh and Popcornduff brought up some stuff too which might take me a bit of time to work on. TarkusAB talk 16:44, 22 July 2018 (UTC)

Since Popcornduff is working on the prose, I'll go ahead and leave prose concerns for the moment. A few boxes I'll note as checked:
 * ✅ Little risk of copyright violation per the Copyvio Detector
 * ✅ Checklinks shows all links are in good condition, no link rot.

Images

 * File:Phantasy Star Online JP cover.jpg -- This needs a better fair use rationale; specifically the fields for NFCC #1 and #2 need to be replaced with something other than N/A. Even in common use screenshots, we need to be able to demonstrate fully why each image meets the WP:NFCC
 * Added more details
 * File:Phantasy Star Online screenshot.png -- Same issue as above
 * Added more details
 * File:Yuji Naka - Magic - Monaco - 2015-03-21- P1030036 (cropped again).jpg -- Looks good, is used in a lot of places.
 * File:Dreamcast-Console-Set.jpg -- An Evan-Amos work, he's known for his quality free images. This one is good.
 * File:GameCube online setup.png -- The right boxes are checked here, so this is good.
 * File:KEN00140 (37230358692) (cropped).jpg -- Free use, also looks good.