Talk:Pinhead (Hellraiser)

Microcephaly
Needs link to Microcephaly. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 62.228.206.107 (talk) 00:42, 24 November 2020 (UTC)

Picture
Couldn't we get a picture of this friendly guy? abelson 11:59, May 17, 2005 (UTC)
 * There's no shortage of them on the web, and most of them would pass as fair use. There's always, this image already used in the Hellraiser article. It could be used here too easily enough. Motor 18:40, 2005 May 17 (UTC)

Tone
What's wrong with the tone of this article? --Myles Long 22:03, 6 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Sorry, just thought it needed a little re-writing. I made some changes; some sentences are still a little awkward though. Dariob 19:15, 7 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Request sourcing
Could someone please indicate which of the movies (or whatever) provides the various bits of information in this article--as well as the quotes? It would be a much more useful page if it cited sources. Nareek 19:00, 12 August 2006 (UTC)

Philosophy of Pain?
Is there such a topic as the Philosophy of Suffering and/or Pain?


 * Pain (philosophy)

Banners
Does anyone think it might be better to just have one "banner" at the top of the article saying it needs cleanup, and then list the problems here on the Talk page? It seems excessive to have four notices at the top of the article. Mus Musculus 12:18, 13 December 2006 (UTC)

Problems
Disguising the "biography" section with the word "fictional" doesn't change the fact that it's written in an "in-universe" tone. He isn't real, so you don't write it as if he actually did it. You write it as "film appearances" or "literature appearances" and then you break it down (not with subheadings, but with paragraphs) by each appearance.

"'Pinhead made his first appearance in Cliver Barker's Hellraiser, although he wasn't referred to by the name 'Pinhead' in the credits. In this film he was summoned by Kirsty Cotton, by accident....'" "'In his second appearance.....'"
 * Example

They should be a condensed version of the plot of the film. They should be in no way as long as something that would be in a film article, because you are just talking about the one character. As for the "original research", if you don't cite a source for all that other information, like "personality", then it's original research.  BIGNOLE     (Contact me)  11:10, 12 April 2007 (UTC)

Another appearance
I recall seeing a character on The Grim Adventures of Billy and Mandy who seemed to be a spoof of Pinhead, i.e. he had bowling pins sticking out of his head, but I don't know enough about the episode to add it to the "Other Appearances" category. If someone feels it qualifies as an appearance and knows more about it, please add it.

Fair use rationale for Image:Hr2-spenser.jpg
Image:Hr2-spenser.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot 01:44, 7 November 2007 (UTC)

Unsourced speculation
I plan to remove the entry under the Other Appearences section that connects Pinhead to Metal Gear Solid unless someone can provide a reliable source for it. Having just a physical resemblence and nothing else makes it a weak connection. --ArdClose (talk) 14:30, 27 December 2007 (UTC)

Saying Pinhead is 'Xipe Totec'
In the article it references pinhead as being an incarnation of the central american god Xipe Totec while this may have been the intention of the artists and writers of the comic book series, it doesn't bear scrutiny. In the 'Clive Barker's Pinhead' comics, he is depicted as a central american warrior named Xipe Topec (note the 'p'. I have a scan of the page here: http://i262.photobucket.com/albums/ii115/seburiel/xipetopec.jpg so I changed the entry to reflect this.  Seburiel (talk) 03:31, 30 March 2008 (UTC)

Again, I changed the name 'Xipe Totec' to 'Xipe Topec' which is correct and 'canonical' according to the comic book as listed above. Seburiel (talk) 00:35, 24 October 2009 (UTC)

=Name and Face= Didn't this article used to have a picture of him before he became a cenobite? And what's his original name? I think it might be Elliot, but I can't remember the source. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.202.0.118 (talk) 21:51, 25 May 2008 (UTC)

The name Captain Elliot Spenser, including the spelling of the surname as in the poet is cited from Doug Bradley's own biography. The Stealth Ranger (talk) 21:30, 4 August 2009 (UTC)

I see 190.135.146.126 thought to change Spenser to Spencer. I am aware that the IMDB displays the spelling with a C, but Doug Bradley's own writings indicate the spelling with an S, Since the gentleman IS Pinhead, I'd been inclined to go with him......

The Stealth Ranger (talk) 14:52, 13 August 2009 (UTC)

Which Battle of Flanders?
As far as I know, the date of the battle Spenser took part in is not specified in the films. Wikipedia shows there were three Battles of Flanders.86.180.87.147 (talk) 19:28, 13 December 2009 (UTC)

Spenser's medals
This is a snippet of an email I got from a friend who is both a Pinhead affictionado and something of an expert on WWI military decorations, which I thought would be relevant to the article. It includes details on the ribbons and medals present on the uniform worn by Spenser in HR3 and HR2. The speculations on his actual actions and early life can be ignored, though the medals themselves seem quite important.

''On the left of Spenser's uniform is a strip of coloured bars, known as ribbons, annotating his many achievements for the military. Two versions of the ribbons are seen from two separate films: In HR3, Joey Summerskill meets Spenser in "Limbo," between Heaven and Hell, in a representation of the aftermath of a battle during the First World War on the Western Front. And, in HR2, Spenser opens the Lament Configuration while serving in the Far East after the War.''

Hellraiser 3 – During WWI, during his service on the Western Front

Military Cross was instituted in 28 December 1914 for gallantry and distinguished services in (ground) action against the enemy, and eligible only for commissioned officer up to the rank of captain, or a warrant officer. Queen's South Africa Medal, 1899-1902, was instituted in 1900 and was awarded to military personnel who served in the Second Boer War in South Africa campaign between 11 October 1899 and 31 May 1902. (This ribbon is identical to the Queen's Mediterranean Medal, 1899-1902, which was instituted 1900 and was issued to garrisons sent to Malta and Gibraltar who guarded Boer prisoners-of-war. Because he was given the African General Service Medal as well, it would have been unlikely for him to be in the Mediterranean.) Africa General Service Medal, 1902-56, was first instituted in 1902 for campaigns on the African continent to the British forces, and remained in use for fifty-four years. (Combatants received the medal in silver; non-combatants in bronze.)'' ''1914 Star, colloquially known as the Mons Star, was instituted in April 1917, and was awarded to those who in served in France or Belgium between 05 August 1914 and midnight on 22-23 November 1914, which is from the day after Britain's declaration of war against the Central Powers to the closing date marks the end of the First Battle of Ypres. All recipients of this medal also received the British War Medal and Victory Medal in 1919. (This ribbon is identical to the 1914-15 Star, which was not awarded until after the First World War in December 1918. Due to the fact that Spenser was still serving the War at the time, 1914 Star is the most logical candidate. Recipients of the 1914 Star were not entitled to the 1914-15 Star.)''

Hellraiser 2 – Post-WWI, during his service in the Far East

Order of Mercy, 1899-1947, ''known also as the Badge of the Order of the League of Mercy, was instituted in 30 March 1899, by the League of Mercy, to honour outstanding individuals for voluntary service assisting in the relief of sickness and suffering. 1914 Star (see details above).''

British War Medal, 1914-18, was instituted in 26 July 1919 to members of the fighting forces who had to leave his native shore on service between 05 August 1914 and 11 November 1918, commemorating some of the bloodiest battles during the First World War.

Victory Medal, 1914-18, or the Allied Victory Medal, was instituted in 01 September 1919 and was awarded to all those who entered a theatre of war, commemorating the victory of the Allies over the Central Powers.

What can we learn from these ribbons?

''First, we know what he served in South Africa during the Second Boer War for the British Army between 11 October 1899 and 31 May 1902, which meant that he had to have joined the British Army prior 1899. The minimum required age to enlist the British Armed Forces, as a commissioned officer, was sixteen to seventeen. Assuming that Elliott Spenser did complete his public-school education, which would be at the age of seventeen, he would have to been born circa 1882, by means of simple arithmetic.''

''Secondly, the 1914 Star is one of the rarest medals of the First World War, a total of 378,000 were distributed, eligible only to members of the British Expeditionary Force (BEF) who served in either France or Belgium between 05 August 1914 and midnight on 22-23 November 1914. Furthermore, although not it was not specifically named in the film, the exterior shots of the trenches, as seen in "Limbo" sequence, was called "Flanders Field" in the original HR3 script. The term Flanders Fields was the generic name of the WWI battlefields in the medieval county of Flanders, Belgium, particularly associated with the battles of Ypres, Passchendaele, and Somme.''

''The British Expeditionary Force was originally founded circa 1905, following the Second Boer War, as a raid-response force that could be quickly mobilised overseas. On the outbreak of First World War, the BEF was sent to Belgium under the General Sir John French, where they (including Spenser) fought at the Battle of Mons (23 August 1914), the first major action of the BEF, and the First Battle of Ypres (19 October - 22 November 1914); the surviving members of these forces were later bestowed the 1914 Star. The day after Christmas, 26 December 1914, the British Expeditionary Force was divided into the First Army, which went to France, and Second Army, which remained in Belgium.

''In the HR3, on Flanders Field, Spenser wears the 1914 Star ribbon, which could not have received until April 1917. We can conclude that, being in Flanders at 1917, he participated in the Third Battle of Ypres (31 July - 10 November 1917), which was fought for control of the village of Passchendaele in West Flanders. Therefore, Captain Elliott Spenser was a member in the Second Army. Also, Spenser wears the illustrious Military Cross in this sequence, which was first established in 28 December 1914 and eligible only to commissioned officers at the rank of captain, or above. Spenser must have been promoted to the rank of captain prior to April 1917 — or (in all probability) prior to December 1914.''

''Of course, the Order of Mercy is undoubtedly the most unusual of his ribbons, as it tells a different side to Elliott Spenser that is beyond professional soldiery. This is a highly prestigious medal presented to individuals who performed outstanding humanitarianism for unpaid, voluntary service in the maintenance of volunteer hospitals and/or in the relief of sickness and suffering. How did a military officer — a commissioned officer, no less — acquire (or even qualify) for this medal?'' Mariomassone (talk) 12:06, 17 December 2009 (UTC)

Vandalism?
It seems to me like there's been a bit of vandalism on this page. I tried to clean it up, but I honestly couldn't figure out how... would someone else please sort this mess out? It looks horrible the way it is right now. 83.248.207.90 (talk) 18:53, 21 October 2019 (UTC)
 * Think I fixed it. NinjaRobotPirate (talk) 03:19, 22 October 2019 (UTC)