Talk:Pirates of the Caribbean: The Curse of the Black Pearl (soundtrack)

Untitled
did anybody else notice that most of the songs didnt go w/ the scenes they were put w/


 * Does anyone else think it should be mentioned that one of the principle musical motiffs for the movie was also the principle battle themes from Gladiator? It's pretty much the exact same progression.  Anyone know where I can learn how to properly upload musical examples to an Uncle Wiki article? Ours18 08:40, 27 October 2006 (UTC)


 * Actually, all of Hans Zimmer's scores, along with his alumni's, are mostly the same. That's part of Zimmer's style that others like Badelt, Jablonsky, Powell, Mancina, Gregson-Williams, etc. have recurred to in order to make their "own" works.


 * Watched Gladiator this evening again and it's absolutly the same theme. Only differences is the ending of the theme were the melody in Gladiator is going up. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.219.24.231 (talk) 21:58, 9 January 2010 (UTC)

I've reverted the article to include a sentence you deleted, Urutapu ("for unknown reasons, this version features some minor changes to the melodies and chords"). My reason is this: the "arrangement" process you cited as a reason normally refers to making minor changes to a piece's structure and instrumentation. Changes to the harmonic and melodic structure are far less common, and in this case, they make a rather noticeable difference. I see no reason not to mention these changes in the article. Now, I'd rather not start an edit war over this, but if you'd like to further discuss your reasons for deleting the sentence, I'd love to talk it over with you here. Thanks. Datameister 23:29, 26 March 2007 (UTC)

I've replaced the commas surrounding the seven co-composers with dashes (—), as the article was originally written. This avoids confusion, since the composers are also separated by commas. If anyone has a problem with this, let's talk it over here before you change it. :) Datameister 18:55, 7 May 2007 (UTC)

Not leitmotivic?
The article says that most of the themes are not leitmotivic, yet, Jack's theme is clearly obvious to be a leitmotiv, along with the cello solo jig and the Black Pearl's pirates march.


 * Jack's theme is probably the most straightforwardly leitmotivic. It can be argued that the first melody in "He's a Pirate" is a leitmotif for the love between Will and Elizabeth, though there are cases that contradict that theory.  And there is that melody you mentioned that often (but not always) represents the cursed pirates of the Black Pearl.  Other than that...there really isn't much.  Who or what does cello solo represent?  Datameister (talk) 23:53, 19 November 2008 (UTC)


 * The cello represents Jack Sparrow's humorous antics, like when he and Will Turner sneak to the Dauntless with a lifeboat's hull upside down and his escape from the soldiers near the end. At least that's what I noticed. By the way, sorry for this late replying. Hadn't check the talk page in a while.--Surten (talk) 07:25, 30 December 2008 (UTC)Surten

Similarities to "Battle" from the Japanese musical Endless Shock
I have decided to remove the sentence that states "The track "He's a Pirate" is nearly identical to "Battle", a cue from the Japanese musical Endless Shock (2000)". Of course it's true that the musical cues are very similar (have a listen - ) but as some of the comments there point out Endless Shock was made in 2005! It's a series of musicals which started with "Millennium Shock" in 2000 which may have caused some confusion. For more information check out Shock (Musical).

I'm not an expert in the series but I believe that the music is different with every iteration of the show. In any case the soundtrack was only released in 2006 ( and ) so it's pretty far fetched to think that Klaus Badelt and/or Hans Zimmer flew to Japan and saw this musical before scurrying home, ripping off one scene and using it as the main theme for a movie!

I believe the nails in the coffin for this accusation can be seen in Hans Zimmer's original demo for the movie which can be heard here -. The "Battle" track and "He's a Pirate" follow almost exactly the same structural form but in this demo we see the themes for the film in earlier versions. It's again, very far fetched to think that Zimmer flew to Japan and saw this musical, got home and ripped off the themes in a demo with a very different structural form... and then went and made a track with the same form as the track from the musical!

I haven't done a great job describing why I believe "He's a Pirate" came first, if you need any clarification of the mess I've made of the English language above please just ask! Emailwhatsit (talk) 09:59, 17 February 2009 (UTC)

Wondering
Does anyone knows, which old pirate movie has a similar track with this movie, because He's a Pirate sounds like it was already composed in the past. Could you help me to tell me the Klaus Badelt source of inspiration for He's a Piarte. Thank you. --Tudor Tulok 18:44, 30 May 2007 (UTC)

There is a similar theme in the opening sequence ( at 1:05) of the Anime series The Twelve Kingdoms. --129.13.186.1 18:04, 31 October 2007 (UTC)

I'm thinking that perhaps the reference to this should be removed as well, I mean it's quite a similar passage but it's such a common chord progression that it's everywhere, from Brittney Spears to Bach! And the rhythm is pretty standard fanfare fare - and it's only a few bars. I think that can be chalked up to coincidence but definitely not plagiarism. I'll remove it later if there's not too much argument Emailwhatsit (talk) 11:34, 17 February 2009 (UTC)

What about the Black Pearl theme?
I was wondering if any of the themes described is the Black Pearl theme (the horn theme that enters at 0:52 in "The Black Pearl") that was abandoned after the first film? I couldn't find a description that seemed to fit. I always thought it was this theme that people thought of as ripped off of Gladiator. Rhytmically it is very much like the fanfare at 4:12 in the Battle, however I don't think it's that similar to the more famous one at 5:52. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 130.242.29.252 (talk) 10:03, 29 November 2008 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Pirates1cd.jpg
Image:Pirates1cd.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

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BetacommandBot (talk) 21:46, 5 December 2007 (UTC)

Bruckheimer's bias torwards Zimmer?
I'm not sure I agree with this edit, I think that the old version was a clearer representation of the sources available. The new version makes it sound as if Bruckheimer rejected Silvestri's score off-hand which is not supported by either the time-line (If Bruckheimer really didn't want Silvestri on the movie just because he wasn't Hans Zimmer he wouldn't have had him in the first place, rather than firing him and bringing in Zimmer & co. last minute)or the interview with Silvestri (Which states the split was not acrimonious). Also the Filmtracks.com source is merely an editorial, not an interview with anyone involved.

The old version mentions that Zimmer was involved in many of Bruckheimer's previous projects without implying that it was the only reason that he was chosen to write the score. Emailwhatsit (talk) 15:36, 21 February 2009 (UTC)


 * I agree. The filmtracks "professional" review is hardly that. Calling it "brainless" and "imbecilic"? That should not be on Wikipedia. I've removed the filmtracks review - from all three scores's articles - as it is most certainly not NPOV. Go ahead and edit the article. RadicalTwo (talk) 21:10, 31 October 2009 (UTC)

Gladiator
The stuff about "Drop Zone" is interesting. Anyone listen to the "Gladiator" soundtrack? Also by Hans Zimmer, three years before "Pirates," and one track is very, very identical to the famous "He's a Pirate" (I would argue quite a bit more so then "Drop Zone," although I def. hear the similarities there). Someone should check it out (song in question is called "The Battle," which is all similar, but particularly around 5:45 there is really no difference. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.186.83.7 (talk) 07:17, 22 March 2010 (UTC)

Criticism
I will be keeping an eye on this article as it's reception has been removed a number of times. Frankly, the negative reaction to this music from film score aficionados is an important part of its history, whether you agree or not. Hans Zimmer fan boys, beware. We will have to reference his critics from time to time... Jg2904 (talk) 02:02, 21 October 2011 (UTC)