Talk:Pith helmet

Manufacture
How is pith transformed into a hat? Why does the hat take this unique shape, which I haven't seen in any other previous headgear designs? Ace Frahm 22:20, 30 July 2007 (UTC)
 * As I mention below, the shape was to contain the pith which acted as a water reservoir. Other shapes that are more closely contoured to the head would not have the required volume. Shawn D. 16:39, 29 October 2007 (UTC)


 * Is the hat formed by putting the pith into a mold and a press?
 * That's unlikely, as that would compress the pith and reduce its water-holding capability. Think about what happens when you squeeze a sponge. The pith was probably carved. Shawn D. (talk) 12:38, 11 March 2008 (UTC)


 * Was the pith helmet dunked in water, then placed on the head as cheap cooling before the age of air conditioning?
 * Yes. Shawn D. (talk) 12:38, 11 March 2008 (UTC)


 * If so, wouldn't the hat drip on the wearer until it dries out?
 * No. The pith is spongy and holds the water. Shawn D. (talk) 12:38, 11 March 2008 (UTC)


 * The french pith helmet pictured seems to have water spots, what do you think?
 * Sure, it could be water, sweat, or damage due to improper storage. Shawn D. (talk) 12:38, 11 March 2008 (UTC)

Ace Frahm 06:29, 8 November 2007 (UTC)

I'm also still a bit confused. Pith seems to be available naturally as a narrow cylinder. It doesn't seem big enough to carve an entire hat out of, unless I am mistaken? I could imagine some sort of adhesive could be used, or is the pith inside a helmet made out of something else? -- Beland (talk) 00:37, 3 April 2012 (UTC)
 * Exactly; Carving would be incredibly wasteful and pressing with an adhesive might degrade the pith. What is the answer to the mystery of a material we have seen in movies and on TV all our lives?  I always feel totally ignorant when I think about all the things around us that we take for granted and are too stupid to question(I speak for myself).  Good question Beland  Longinus876 (talk) 13:41, 14 September 2012 (UTC)

Pith Type
"It was made from pith" What sort of pith? Rich Farmbrough 14:22, 21 May 2005 (UTC)

Does it float? Does it dry out in the sun? Become moldy if damp? Protect against falling coconuts? Deflect or absorb blowgun quills? As described here it was a great sartorial fad and custom of no particular utility or relative merit. MaxEnt 16:43, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
 * Seems clear enough to me: "The Pith Helmet (also known as Sun helmet...) is a lightweight helmet made of cork or pith...with a cloth cover, designed to shade the wearer's head from the sun. It was formerly much worn by Westerners in the tropics..." It's primary purpose is to keep the sun of your pate. SigPig 17:09, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
 * It seems clear enough to me that you could keep the sun off your head without the pith. I would guess that the pith (or cork) was intended to provide some minimal protection without adding too much weight (before the invention of styrofoam, as used in modern bicycle helmets, which also have to be lightweight). Rbean 21:21, 4 July 2006 (UTC)
 * As I recall reading in National Geographic, the pith in the pith helmet was a heat sink and helped to keep the wearer cooler. The hat would be soaked in water, with the pith essentially acting as a reservoir providing water for evaporative cooling.  Thus, it wasn't a sartorial "fad," nor was it intended to act as a shock/weapon absorber.  Styrofoam would be the worst material to use in a pith helmet, as it would be an insulator!  I can't imagine that a pith helmet would smell very good after being soaked in water and sweat repeatedly.
 * If it were purely an insulator, it would make the head hotter and hotter and hotter. If part of the system was that the pith was soaked in water before wearing, then that really, really, really needs to be spelled out in the article. As it stands, it doesn't make sense. 88.97.15.184 (talk) 23:38, 11 May 2008 (UTC)
 * NO!....You want insulation from the sun. A conductor would become too hot to touch in the sun.  Most hats are insulators as are our clothing.  This pith seems like it was a great material. Light and able to absorb moderate shocks of the normal routines of jungle activity.  This was the styrofoam of old..I like it.Longinus876 (talk) 13:56, 14 September 2012 (UTC)
 * Yes, I strongly agree. Short of some very specific function, like the ability to hold water and provide cooling by evaporation, then any compelling point to the pith helmet beyond fashion is missing. The pith helmet has less of a brim than most hat styles made for this purpose (for example, the classic "cowboy" hat, the sombrero, the slouch or bush hat from the same period), and so it doesn't seem to me to do a particular better job of sun protection than, say, a derby. Why is this pith water-holding function not mentioned in the article? Is it in doubt?--Ericjs (talk) 01:34, 23 September 2008 (UTC)


 * If this soaking-the-pith-in-water business is in doubt here is a link to site that sells the things and would seem to confirm it. From some further reading it would seem that there is another property of the pith helmet which make it particularly suitable to hot weather: ventilation. Besides ventilation holes in the side, as is common in many summer hats, the classic pit helmet has a little knob at the top with additional vents. Further, the stiffness and size of the bowl keep it away from the head to provide space for air circulation and prevent the heat conduction from a hat surface touching the head. --Ericjs (talk) 02:26, 23 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Whether made of cork or pith the tropical helmet was light, relatively cool with ventilation holes, shaded the face and was impressive in appearance - the last being an important consideration in most items of military dress up to World War I. Modern considerations of utility simply didn't apply in the late 19th century when the solar topee was at its most popular. The soak-in-water rationale is almost certainly a modern myth, useful if you are marketing replicas of the headdress as a quaint curiosity. Of course people might have done it on a particularly hot day but the water would stain the helmet (especially the white covered versions), corrode any metal fixtures and, as noted above make it smell. Not the sort of treatment that you would give an item of issue uniform likely to be required for inspection or worn on parade in peacetime. As for active service, water was not that plentiful in the sort of places where sun helmets were worn for campaigning in and unlikely to be wasted being poured over pith, only to quickly evaporate. Still if someone can come up with a contemporary quote (from Kipling perhaps) saying that it was common practice in India or wherever then I will humbly withdraw all the above :) .Buistr (talk) 08:09, 23 September 2008 (UTC)


 * In the days before the correct medical cause was known the pith helmet was developed as it was thought that sun stroke in hot climes was caused by the sun beating down on the back of the neck. Thus the pith helmet was designed to protect the nape of the wearer's neck from the sun. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 95.149.173.25 (talk) 11:01, 27 January 2017 (UTC)


 * So, I found a paper digging into how pith helmets work: The Transfer of Heat through Sun Helmets, by Henry and Rees. Apparently they were structured with two layers, the outer hat and an inner dome, with the hat, dome and head kept apart by spacers. This allowed ventilation to both the outer hat and the wearer's head, while reducing conduction of heat inwards from sun to helmet to head. The outer helmet being made of pith/cork/felt made it a good insulator for its weight. The layers were usually also lined with aluminum to reduce radiative heat transfer. 130.245.234.8 (talk) 03:39, 22 November 2018 (UTC)

USPS Uniform helmets?
No mention of the plastic "pith helmets" used by the United States Postal Service? These are just plastic shells and don't contain any pith, but they're shaped just like the traditional pith helmet. They've become a recognizable part of the letter carrier's uniform. I don't know what to list as a reference for that, though. Rbean 21:21, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

I believe the original, pith "cork", was selected to absorb water; in addition to being shaded, the water soaked helmet kept the wearer cool in hot climates. This is popular in warm, tropical regions. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.98.166.207 (talk) 13:36, 31 August 2007 (UTC)

British vs American English
Fixed a typo in the word "connexion" and changed it to "connection". 70.156.250.23 21:15, 4 April 2007 (UTC) anonymous
 * It's not a typo. The article was started in and continues in British English. "Connexion" is correct British spelling. And no, I myself spell it "connection", but that is beside the point. -- Sig Pig  |SEND - OVER 02:52, 5 April 2007 (UTC)


 * Both "connexion" and "connection" are fine in British English, the former being an earlier spelling using one less character. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 95.149.247.9 (talk) 19:27, 7 January 2018 (UTC)

spelling of scientific name
It's Aeschynomene aspera, not "Æschynomena", at PLANTS Profile for Aeschynomene aspera L. (sola pith plant) and over 100,000 other Web sites. Some may prefer the ligature on æsthetic grounds, but the International Code of Botanical Nomenclature (2000&mdash;the 2006 code is not yet on the Web) says, "the ligatures -æ- and  -œ-, indicating that the letters are pronounced together, are to be replaced by the separate letters  -ae- and  -oe-" (Article 60, section 60.6). &mdash;JerryFriedman 04:59, 13 July 2007 (UTC)


 * Just for the record, I took the original - complete with ligatures - from the Shorter Oxford Dictionary. Hair Commodore 17:13, 10 August 2007 (UTC)

Italian police
I remember seeing TV footage, a few years ago, of Italian traffic policemen wearing sun helmets.

Tropenhelm
During World War II, German troops also used sun helmets (tropenhelm) in southern Europe.

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Vietnam
From my observation, the stuff about Vietnamese wearing pith helmets is way out of date. The pith helmet is still the military uniform. But the war was a long time ago and you don't see civilians wearing army surplus anymore. Kauffner (talk) 02:51, 18 March 2009 (UTC)

Just a thought: if these have been replaced by motorcycle helmets, somebody should design a helmet that looks like an old-time pith helmet and sell it in Vietnam. (If the shape's wrong, maybe a shell built onto a more proper helmet would work?) After all, I've seen hard hats shaped like cowboy hats and if they sell, these probably would too.JDZeff (talk) 22:20, 5 December 2014 (UTC)
 * Those are the same NVA (North Viet Army) helmets alright. The one's US forces captured in the field were simply a real faded olive drab/green color, almost grayish in color.  Most had graffiti written on them in Vietnamese.  Translated by some "Kit Carson" scouts for GIs, some of them said, "Born in the North, Died in the South." Sure gave GIs an idea of NVA morale. Most GIs wanted to find a helmet with a star on it.  Many didn't have the star, and experience dictated that the GI who found the helmet didn't rip it off real fast either, because he often wasn't alone when he acquired it.  Those pith helmets and belt buckles (with a red star on them) were the best souvenirs to acquire (next to an SKS carbine or K-54 pistol).  In the film "Platoon" (Producer/Director Oliver Stone was a grunt in Vietnam, 25th ID; actor Charlie Sheen is playing his role, Hollywood style) the "mad" sergeant depicted by actor Tom Berenger is wearing a captured NVA belt buckle.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.2.62.58 (talk) 04:21, 9 August 2009 (UTC)

Worn by white people
there has to be a better way of saying this that's not so coloquial. maybe, by "Europeans" "Caucasians" or "by fair skinned people"? 66.92.71.94 (talk) 19:22, 6 February 2012 (UTC)

Governors of British Overseas Territories
Do the Governors and Deputy Governors of the 14 remaining British Overseas Territories still wear the traditional uniform on ceremonial occasions? I had read that the uniforms were to be abolished as the British government felt it presented an 'outdated image' for the 21st century but yet here we have a picture of George Fergusson being sworn in as the 133rd Governor of Bermuda last month (May 2012) wearing the uniform and pith helmet ... i.ytimg.com/vi/XXkgxyLWJmU/0.jpg 69.115.242.114 (talk) 17:30, 17 June 2012 (UTC)
 * According to the Daily Telegraph, the British Foreign & Commonwealth Office abolished the expensive traditional uniforms (including white helmets) for colonial officials during the 1990s, as an economy measure. However individual overseas territories can still provide the uniforms for governors as a charge against the local budget if they choose to do so. Buistr (talk) 20:03, 17 June 2012 (UTC)
 * It is simply incorrect to say that this uniform has been abolished. The FCO explicitly did not abolish use of the uniform; it simply made clear (in 2001) that in future the cost would have to be borne locally. Since then, the uniform has been consistently worn, certainly in the Falkland Islands and in Bermuda - possibly elsewhere - presumably because the locals legislatures in these places support its use and pay for it. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Barabbas1312 (talk • contribs) 08:32, 11 September 2012 (UTC)

Mis-Identification
I believe there has been a mis-identification on the first photograph. T. E. Lawrence is not the fellow on the left( wearing the khaki pith helmet), but the small chap in the middle of the two men wearing pith helmets. The large fellow wearing the khaki helmet is the pilot. Garagehero (talk) 22:46, 29 November 2012 (UTC)

You're right, Lawrence is the short man in the grey suit and homburg. Who is the tall man to his left? The photo should be recaptioned, but it would be better if the other pith-helmeted man could be named. Justingakuto (talk) 02:45, 29 May 2013 (UTC)

Symbolism
This article should mention that sun helmets are considered to be the symbol of colonialism. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 120.28.74.68 (talk) 10:55, 12 June 2018 (UTC)

Go to the "controversy" section. Phantomred (talk) 19:20, 7 October 2018 (UTC)

Is it possible to find any sources claiming this before the first lady went on her Africa trip? Right now all the realiable sources are just citing each other trying to make the claim true. Justm (talk) 11:45, 8 October 2018 (UTC)

There was already one source dating to 2014 that references the hat's symbolism. I have also added a New York Times article dating to 1997 that references the hat's associations with colonialism.

None of the sources claim they are a symbol of oppression, though. A symbol of colonialism, yes. I find your first source fitting well. My point is, everyone and their grandmothers suddenly see the hat as an ugly symbol of oppression. A fitting re-write would probably sound something like: The pith helmet was widely used by European colonial armies in Africa and Asia. With recent events, critics over the span of 24 hours have suddenly started calling it a symbol of colonial oppression. :P Justm (talk) 17:08, 9 October 2018 (UTC)

I just changed it from "colonial oppression" to "colonialism". I agree that this is more accurate. Phantomred (talk) 20:22, 9 October 2018 (UTC)

An excellent source for pith helmets' being a racist symbol of imperialism is George Orwell. From 1944: "Till recently the European in India had an essentially superstitious attitude towards [sunstroke]. It was supposed to be something dangerous to Europeans but not to Asiatics. When I was in Burma I was assured that the Indian sun, even at its coolest, had a peculiar deadliness which could only be warded off by wearing a helmet of cork or pith." Orwell shows how this had no factual basis; it appears to have been invented because "an endless emphasis on the differences between the ‘natives’ and yourself is one of the necessary props of imperialism." His analysis could be questioned, but most of this is his merely reporting on what he himself was told. Chassimmons (talk) 16:50, 25 July 2021 (UTC)

Greek police corps
I think that in some films (& photos) policemen (personnel belonging to the "Police of Towns", "Αστυνομία Πόλεων", "Astynomía Póleon") regulating traffic, are appearing with white pith helmets. It was possibly used by the "Greek Gendarmerie", "Ελληνική Χωροφυλακή", "Élliniki Chorophylaki", too. Anjius (talk) 06:32, 13 February 2021 (UTC)

Salakot/Pith distinction
I am unclear why this article blends discussion of the Salakot and Pith style helmets. These are two different traditions of headwear which, while both playing a role in colonial uniforms and culture, have distinct histories. Even within the article itself there is inconsistency, with the first part of the history section being drawn from the asian conical hat article (where the salakot clearly fits) while in the first image of the '19th Century' section, an example of a salacot on the left of the image is contrasted with the pith helmets shown in the same image.

The salakot and pith helmet are distinct in both origin and construction, though they share some similarities of function as sun shades.

Suggest the salakot references are kept to the specific article on that headwear. The references in this article and the salakot article that attempt to make the link between the salakot and the pith helmet are in fact contradicted by the content on those sources, which identify the pith and salakot as distinct. 2A02:C7C:3878:D900:B818:91C3:9894:B39E (talk) 10:06, 13 May 2023 (UTC)

Italian 1928-36 model
122.3.27.206 (talk) 05:25, 29 October 2023 (UTC)