Talk:Pittsburgh Keystones (baseball)

Associate team in 1921
Why such discrepancies between Holway's Complete Book and seamheads.com? Holway has the Keystones unlisted for the 1921 season, and with a 16-21 record in 1922. Whereas seamheads has them at 14-23-2, and an associate club in 1921. From what I understand, Holway considered a team an "associate" to the league if he considered them of "major league" caliber and only occasionally played league teams (p. 10, The Negro League Season, second paragraph starts with "Some teams, such as the Homestead...."). Did Pittsburgh play in 1921 and Holway just did not list them as a non-league team as an editorial decision? I am curious as to why seamheads counts them as such: difference of opinion or the uncovering of new information? Rgrds, (Dynamic IP, will change when I log off.) --64.85.214.2 (talk) 12:48, 8 April 2012 (UTC)


 * I couldn't say why Holway doesn't list the Keystones in 1921. I can tell you that they indeed played against NNL teams in 1921 (see e.g. Pittsburgh Press, on Google Newspaper Archive, July 24, 1921, p. 23--Keystones vs. Chicago Giants box score, far right column, about 2/3 down the page).  The 16-21 record for 1922 is what's reported in some standings printed at the time, and most likely this is where Holway got it.  Contemporary Negro league standings are generally not used by modern researchers unless there's no alternative, as they generally can't be verified and very often don't balance.  "Associate" status was not a category invented by Holway--it was an actual, formal or semi-formal relationship between leagues and teams that didn't compete for the championship, but wanted games against league teams. Satchel (talk) 16:05, 10 April 2012 (UTC)


 * Thanks for responding. I am relieved to hear you were using newspaper archives, and appreciate you giving the online location. I understand the associate status; I was just requesting verification the Pittsburgh really was one in 1921.  There are so many discrepancies among sources, which is frustrating and is why I questioned the edits.  Rgrds, (Dynamic IP, will change when I log off.) --64.85.217.180 (talk) 14:05, 11 April 2012 (UTC)