Talk:Plastique Tiara/Archive 1

Notability
Can we discuss notability here?

Inviting you to this discussion. I don't want to see this page marked for deletion, so if another editor reverts to the redirect, please do not revert again. Feel free to share additional sourcing here, if applicable. --- Another Believer ( Talk ) 13:10, 22 March 2019 (UTC)
 * This editor has been blocked. --- Another Believer ( Talk ) 15:18, 29 March 2019 (UTC)

I saw you redirected the article. If I'm being honest, I'm not sure whether or not Plastique Tiara qualifies for a standalone article yet. However, please know a couple editors are currently working on the article, and this is on WikiProject RuPaul's Drag Race's radar. Of course, you're invited to express your concerns here. --- Another Believer ( Talk ) 13:12, 22 March 2019 (UTC)
 * *sigh* ... and now we have AfD. I wish you would have just stated your preference for a redirect here. --- Another Believer  ( Talk ) 13:56, 22 March 2019 (UTC)
 * Hi - Didn't see this ping until I refreshed my browser, after I AfD'd this. Outside of their appearance on RuPaul's show, no real notability. But thanks, as always, for all you do here on WP. (was adding this as you were adding the above).  Onel 5969  TT me 13:57, 22 March 2019 (UTC)
 * , Sure, for the record, I created the redirect but another editor expanded the entry. I support restoring the redirect for now and not deleting the page altogether. --- Another Believer ( Talk ) 13:58, 22 March 2019 (UTC)

Residence?
In your research, did you learn where Plastique Tiara currently lives? --- Another Believer ( Talk ) 18:23, 20 March 2019 (UTC)
 * I found a source confirming Dallas, and I've updated the article. --- Another Believer ( Talk ) 22:33, 20 March 2019 (UTC)

Source for birth date?
Unless there's a source for birth date, this should be removed. --- Another Believer ( Talk ) 18:28, 20 March 2019 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 27 March 2019
I want to make it better by adding details and pictures to make this not be so boring and up for deletion Mixhael02 (talk) 20:28, 27 March 2019 (UTC)
 * Full-protection-shackle-no-text.svg Not done: requests for decreases to the page protection level should be directed to the protecting admin or to Requests for page protection if the protecting admin is not active or has declined the request. - FlightTime  ( open channel ) 20:31, 27 March 2019 (UTC)

Contested deletion
This page should not be speedily deleted because... She has multiple media appearances, basically the same, if not more than other queens who have pages, the is within the top 20 most followed from the entire series, and she WILL do more after this. The consensus for the last afd actually was not delete, there were just as many keep votes, and they explained better why the page should be kept than the opposing. This page will not be deleted, mark my words. --2600:6C5D:5880:38:493D:61A8:1FF0:E605 (talk) 06:43, 29 May 2019 (UTC)
 * Nothing's changed since the last AfD, including fans wasting editors times by recreating pages. You're right, it should be a redirect, but you, and other editors who should know better, insist on recreating this page right after an AfD. Should be changed back into a redirect and protected from recreation without Admin input. Onel 5969  TT me 08:09, 29 May 2019 (UTC)
 * , Yes, I agree, but the article history should not have been deleted in the process. Please restore for future reference. I've asked on my talk page as well. --- Another Believer ( Talk ) 13:29, 29 May 2019 (UTC)

The article history has been restored. Thank you. --- Another Believer ( Talk ) 14:40, 29 May 2019 (UTC)

Her page should be restored. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 194.81.49.187 (talk) 14:43, 18 March 2020 (UTC)

Images
BTW, there are now images of Plastique at Wikimedia Commons: commons:Category:Plastique Tiara. --- Another Believer ( Talk ) 16:56, 29 May 2019 (UTC)

Article history
Can you please restore the article history? It should be kept. --- Another Believer ( Talk ) 18:37, 21 September 2022 (UTC)


 * Putting this request on your radar as well. I don't know where it went, but I believe this article has an extensive history which should be preserved, please. Thanks! --- Another Believer ( Talk ) 18:46, 21 September 2022 (UTC)


 * I restored the article's history when you asked me to before, giving as your reason that "she is likely to be notable in the future". As far as I am concerned, I regard keeping article history for a subject that has a good chance of becoming suitable for an article in the future as preferable, other things being equal, so I was happy to accept your request. However, other things aren't always equal. Almost three and a half years after the original deletion discussion, the only effect of keeping the article's history has been to facilitate successive re-creations, by editors who have apparently used the editing history as a starting point. Obviously the absence of editing history would not prevent anyone from creating a new version from scratch, but my experience over the years is that in this situation keeping the history makes it far more likely that disruptive re-creations, ignoring consensus in deletion discussions, will take place. Considering that restoring the history last time has had the effect it has, I would therefore very much prefer not to restore it again. However, if you are really determined that I should do so then I will restore the history, and consult other editors as to whether it should stay that way. JBW (talk) 19:08, 21 September 2022 (UTC)
 * I would like the article's history restored, yes, please. In all honesty, the subject is probably notable. --- Another Believer ( Talk ) 19:12, 21 September 2022 (UTC)

Thanks for restoring! --- Another Believer ( Talk ) 12:42, 22 September 2022 (UTC)
 * OK, I've done what you asked for. Having thought about it some more, I think perhaps it can be left at that. The re-creations haven't been all that frequent. If it is re-created again, and if anyone wants it deleted again, I think deletion review would be better than speedy deletion. Personally I have no opinion as to whether there should be an article on the topic or not; all my actions (as far as I remember) have been made in the capacity of an uninvolved administrator responding to requests from editors. JBW (talk) 13:02, 22 September 2022 (UTC)

Notability
Let's discuss the subject's notability... --- Another Believer ( Talk ) 13:28, 22 September 2022 (UTC)
 * From articles on Wikipedia, we have she was on Season 11, Drive 'N Drag and RuPaul's Drag Race Live!.
 * news articles include Plastique Tiara, of ‘RPDR’ Season 11, to appear at Globe Bar & Kitchen for Pride, Plastique Tiara talks Asian representation, family pride and her accent, and Rupaul's Drag Race Star Plastique Tiara talks new generation of drag. (Bonus Plastique Tiara makes it werq)
 * These are news articles specifically about her in the websites of the primary newspapers for Spokane, Washington and Houston, Texas as well as the Hollywood reporter. Of these, the Spokesman and Chron should be perfect. The Hollywood reporter article is slightly more problematic as it is an interview, *but* there are some pieces to it that would count as secondary. Similarly interview/articles in the Washington Blade and Vogue. (I'm grabbing those from another computer, will add URLs if desired later). Note, this was with about 10 minutes of research on news.google.com for the name "Plastique Tiara".Naraht (talk) 14:28, 22 September 2022 (UTC)

Notability (again)
Where are we at re: notability? Here's some coverage from the past 12 months:


 * https://www.harpersbazaar.com/culture/film-tv/a44271821/drag-queen-history-power/
 * https://www.out.com/drag/2023/1/10/these-are-popular-drag-queens-tiktok-you-should-be-following#rebelltitem21 ("supreme queen of TikTok", she has 11.2 million followers on TikTok, "making her the most-followed drag performer on the platform by a long shot")
 * https://screenrant.com/best-tiktok-drag-queens/#plastique-tiara-plastique-tiara---11-2m-followers ("Plastique Tiara ... has gained one of the most significant followings of any drag queen on TikTok because of her ability to completely transform herself from the standard version of herself to the queen her fans know her to be. With her cosplay and glamorous looks, TikTokers can't get enough of Plastique, her fun transition videos and the glimpses they get into her life while performing at various clubs and on the Las Vegas strip.")

Do you still feel this redirect needs to be protected? --- Another Believer ( Talk ) 01:00, 20 September 2023 (UTC)


 * @JBW Can you please reply, or suggest where a discussion re: notability should be held? The last notability discussion was held almost four year ago, and (in my opinion) at this point it seems kind of silly that the subject does not have a Wikipedia entry. --- Another Believer ( Talk ) 19:06, 3 November 2023 (UTC)
 * Or, per User:SmokeyJoe at Deletion review/Log/2022 September 28, can this page be moved into draft space with the protection removed? I guess I am confused about the best path forward, but I want to work on this bio but with the article history preserved. Thanks for any help here. --- Another Believer ( Talk ) 19:17, 3 November 2023 (UTC)


 * The way forward has already been explained to you before: work on it in draft, and then if and when it's good enough it can be moved into mainspace to replace the redirect. If the redirect bothers you this much, then why didn't you simply follow the process that was already offered to you last time? Bearcat (talk) 19:29, 3 November 2023 (UTC)
 * I am trying to do what's been asked of me. Perhaps poorly, but I am asking to have this page moved into the draft space, with the protection removed, so I can work on the draft with the article history preserved. I don't understand why this is an unreasonable request. --- Another Believer ( Talk ) 19:33, 3 November 2023 (UTC)
 * Forgot to ping, but I'll also clarify, I am trying to avoid having a second page created, especially since efforts were made to keep this article history. --- Another Believer ( Talk ) 19:36, 3 November 2023 (UTC)
 * Why would preserving the article history require unprotecting the redirect in advance of the draft being completed? And replacing the redirect with a completed draft doesn't obliterate its prior history either, so why would preserving the article history require arguing about the old article instead of just buckling down to get a draft done? You can just write the draft; if it's good enough, any administrator can just move it overtop the redirect even if the redirect is still technically "protected"; and the entire edit history of the article will be intact because anything that gets temporarily "deleted" in the process of the move can easily be restored by said administrator with one click on one button. It's just not nearly as complicated as you're making it out to be — just go into the last article version of the title, copy the text, paste it into a draft page, work on it, and voila. Absolutely none of what you're complaining about right now is an insurmountable obstacle or a necessary part of the process at all. The roadblocks you perceive in front of you just don't exist outside of your imagination, because the edit history isn't going to get broken and page protection doesn't prevent a finished draft from being moved in place. Bearcat (talk) 19:44, 3 November 2023 (UTC)


 * has pretty well said it all, apart from the fact that I will repeat what I said at Deletion review/Log/2022 September 28: "Personally, I have no opinion one way or the other whether the page should exist: everything I have done has been done as an uninvolved administrator in response to requests from other editors. However, I am not willing to unilaterally overturn a clear consensus in a deletion discussion." If you follow the procedure that Bearcat has outlined and the article gets recreated, that will be fine. JBW (talk) 20:16, 3 November 2023 (UTC)
 * I figured moving this page to the draft space and transferring the protection to the leftover redirect was the easiest course of action, but since you prefer the histmerge route, I've made a copy in the draft space. I've blanked the page and will essentially start over. Expect a ping over there soon, shouldn't be difficult to demonstrate notability. Thanks! --- Another Believer ( Talk ) 20:58, 3 November 2023 (UTC)

I can keep going, but how are we looking at Draft:Plastique Tiara? --- Another Believer ( Talk ) 21:45, 3 November 2023 (UTC)
 * That's looking pretty damn good. Do you consider it finished already, or is there anything else you want to add to it before we pull the trigger? I'm fine either way, I think that's easily much better and much more mainspace-worthy than the version from four years ago, but just want to give you a chance to finish it first if you think there's still anything else needed. Bearcat (talk) 21:48, 3 November 2023 (UTC)
 * @Bearcat Thanks! Ready for a histmerge! I can do more later, but my primary goal is just getting something in the main space. Much appreciated if you're able to assist. --- Another Believer ( Talk ) 21:52, 3 November 2023 (UTC)
 * Okay, gimme a couple minutes and the job will be complete. Bearcat (talk) 21:53, 3 November 2023 (UTC)
 * Thanks again! --- Another Believer ( Talk ) 21:55, 3 November 2023 (UTC)
 * Dirty deed done, dirt cheap! Bearcat (talk) 21:56, 3 November 2023 (UTC)