Talk:Politics of Northern Ireland/Archive 1

Examples from 15 August 2005 news coverage

 * BBC Northern Ireland News
 * RTÉ News

FearÉIREANN\(caint) 23:50, 15 August 2005 (UTC)

Wise up. Less popular is not the same as less common. Lapsed Pacifist 06:43, 16 August 2005 (UTC)

100%?
Why don't the religions add up to 100%? I dont know how Northern Ireland had 100.2% of its people accounted for in 2001.


 * Anyone familiar with statistics knows that percentage breakdowns don't always add up to 100% because of rounding. Duh. [[Image:Flag of Ireland.svg|20px]] Camillus [[Image:Flag of Scotland.svg|20px]] talk | contribs 01:51, 13 December 2005 (UTC)


 * Why don't the religions add up to 100%
 * Maybe because (shock horror) there might be people in Northern Ireland whom are niether Protestant nor Roman Catholic ?? 80.229.222.48 (talk) 18:55, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

"Proving a negative"
I'm not asking you to prove a negative; I'm asking you to provide a reputable source that backs up your claim that the DUP does not have one single Catholic member. Demiurge 17:59, 24 January 2006 (UTC)

As another user said, it's kind of a common-sense thing, Demiurge. You may as well ask me for a source that proves there are no Jews in the British National Party. I ask you for the name of one (just one) Catholic member of the DUP. They must have thousands of members; one Catholic shouldn't be too hard to find.

Lapsed Pacifist 13:56, 25 January 2006 (UTC)
 * Please read WP:CITE and WP:V. You're the one making the claim; it's up to you to provide evidence for it. (Anyway, it's not so inconceivable that the BNP would have a Jewish member -- there's at least one Jewish holocaust denier. See what happens when you make assumptions based on "common sense" and "everyone knows"?) Demiurge 14:11, 25 January 2006 (UTC)

You are claiming the DUP has Catholic members; can you provide evidence for it? I've never heard of a Roman Catholic DUP member. I don't believe you have either. Given the DUP's origins (the Protestant Unionist Party) and the strong views of its leader on Catholicism, I believe it's a fair comment to make. Even were our hypothetical Ulster Catholic so pro-Union they felt more comfortable with the DUP than the UUP, the DUP might not feel so comfortable with them. Ditto your hypothetical BNP-admiring Jew.

Lapsed Pacifist 12:24, 27 January 2006 (UTC)
 * "You are claiming the DUP has Catholic members" &mdash; no I am not. I am removing your claim, not inserting mine. I am making no claim whatsoever about the DUP's membership. Demiurge 12:39, 27 January 2006 (UTC)

I changed my edit from "no Catholic members" to "no known Catholic members". What's wrong now? Some are known to you, but no-one else on Wikipedia? Do fill us in.

Lapsed Pacifist 10:46, 31 January 2006 (UTC)
 * "no known Catholic members" &mdash; not known to who exactly? Avoid weasel terms Demiurge 11:22, 31 January 2006 (UTC)

Not known to anyone, as far as I know. Unless you're going to surprise us all...?

Lapsed Pacifist 17:18, 31 January 2006 (UTC)

National Identity
I think the data from the polls may have been inacurately represented here or even tampered with. "over 60% of Catholics considered themselves Irish" "77% of Catholics considered themselves strongly Irish." So that "over 60%" is meant to indicate, at the very minimum, a good 17% over 60? or are there now catholics who do not identify as Irish but DO identify as "strongly Irish"? Have the two figures (60 and 77) just been switched? If not, then one of them has to be illegitimate. Fergus mac Róich 21:42, 12 January 2007 (UTC)


 * The results you quote are from different surveys.Kuifjeenbobbie 16:56, 1 September 2007 (UTC)


 * The Opinion Polls quoted are very old and should probably be deleted. Views on National Identity may have changed somewhat given the peace process etc.  A new poll is needed, particularly as Gordon Brown continues to hype up Britishness, talk of a British Day, ID Cards, etc. Peter Clarke 21:45, 5 June 2007 (UTC)


 * Actually the data from the 2006 survey appears to confirm data in the surveys from the 90's, showing that Protestants consider themselves to be British and Catholics Irish, i.e. little change, if any, has occured. I have included a reference to the findings of a 2002-3 study Kuifjeenbobbie 16:59, 1 September 2007 (UTC)

Irish Travellers
I am just wondering...are the Irish Traveller's similar to European gypsies or are they ethnically Irish? I am just wondering because I was reading the ethnicity section and I noticed that they were not considered white/European? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Galati (talk • contribs) 04:21, 25 February 2008 (UTC)


 * AFaIK They are generally (although not universally) regarded as being distinct from European Gypsies 80.229.222.48 (talk) 18:59, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

Workers Party
If the Workers party are to be included in the "cross community" category surely its past life as a nationalist party (when it was linked to the Official IRA and was known as "Sinn Fein-The Workers Party") are worth mentioning ? 213.40.115.69 (talk) 17:59, 6 August 2009 (UTC)

Opinion Poll out of date
The graph showing political attitudes towards the future of Northern Ireland is now out of date. In 2007 an additional option was added to the answers, "Remain in the UK with a devolved government". Where around 55% of the population wanted to remain part of the UK, it is now 66%.



Catfish Jim and the soapdish (talk) 16:35, 25 June 2010 (UTC)

Can we have a more detailed demographics table?
Table that shows religious Affiliations in Northern Ireland in 1961–2001 is not very informative. Perhaps somebody can expand it to include not only percent but also absolute number of religious groups according to various censuses (including total number/percent of Protestants according to each census). I have in mind something like demographics table from this article: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_kazakhstan#Ethnic_groups Does somebody have data to expand table used in this article like that? PANONIAN 20:06, 6 February 2012 (UTC)

Results over time and clean up
Can someone clean up the article and add results over time so we can get an idea of the trends in NI demography. - 86.44.153.140 (talk) 23:59, 14 June 2012 (UTC)

Split proposal
I think the basic demographics should be moved into a separate article. Then the politics (and relevant demographic data to the politics) can be presented. This pattern holds for almost every other country, so I don't know why NI has a different setup.--KarlB (talk) 21:17, 25 May 2012 (UTC)


 * The political demographics of Northern Ireland appears independently notable. The generic demographics is just an indiscriminate list and can probably be merged or removed. Trying to have conformity across all articles doesn't take into account that some topics are more notable than others etc. Also, Northern Ireland isn't a country in the traditional sense (or any sense?), so what holds for countries is irrelevant. If you want to fork the Northern Ireland politics section to the current politics redirect (and take some of the non-demographics, political or otherwise) content here with it), I would suggest discussing that on the main article. IRWolfie- (talk) 11:19, 27 June 2012 (UTC)


 * Comment/Opinion According to Countries of the United Kingdom, Northern Ireland is in fact a country. I do not think Northern Ireland is a special case which wouldn't benefit from the presentation improvement. And I think the improvement in presentation could be achieved by conforming with the general presentation as seen across most articles. I would agree to the fork for this improvement. Also, for what its worth, California isn't a country, but still conforms. See Demographics of California & Politics of California. I would imagine that most politically defined boundaries do because of the improvement in presentation. Brad7777 (talk) 21:13, 27 June 2012 (UTC)
 * Thanks. I'm not sure why IRWolfie's assertion that Northern Ireland isn't a country is relevant here; it has a parliament, a government, a defined territory, and it certainly has politics. Its particular constitutional status (and the fact that this status may be slightly different than that of Scotland or Wales) is frankly quite irrelevant to the presentation to the user. And in terms of discussing on the main article, this *is* the main article, this is where the content lives, so is the proper place to discuss a split. To be clear, the proposal is to move the political demographics and details of northern Ireland politics to Northern Ireland politics, and then create a new article called Demographics of Northern Ireland which would contain basic demographic data.--KarlB (talk) 21:35, 27 June 2012 (UTC)

Requested move

 * The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section. 

The result of the move request was: approved. This wasn't just a move proposal, though; I have performed the move, but splitting the article will have to be performed by other editors. Aervanath (talk) 14:29, 20 July 2012 (UTC)

Demography and politics of Northern Ireland → Politics of Northern Ireland – (a) In line with other articles in this space (b) per previous discussion above (c) the section in Northern Ireland is called Politics (d) the category is called ; (e) and all other countries/sub-regions have politics articles. The demography/demographics, while important, are not overwhelmingly *more* important here in a way that differentiates Northern Ireland from any number of other countries with ethnic or religious divides. Thus for standardization purposes and to capture the full meaning of the article, Politics of Northern Ireland is the best and most clear title. The basic demographics have already been moved to Demographics of Northern Ireland. --KarlB (talk) 15:35, 3 July 2012 (UTC)


 * No responses from others, good time to turn it into an RfC. IRWolfie- (talk) 09:15, 4 July 2012 (UTC)


 * Oppose The political demographics of Northern Ireland appears to be notable in itself. IRWolfie- (talk) 09:16, 4 July 2012 (UTC)
 * can you do the rfc? I havent done one before. Also given your response above do you suggest creating a separte article on politics and have political demographics as a sub article of that? KarlB (talk) 11:51, 4 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Amendment - As this article focuses on politics and the demographics associated with it, how about renaming it Political demographics of Northern Ireland? Mabuska (talk) 10:56, 6 July 2012 (UTC)
 * I'm hoping to add more to the article on the politics of NI, demographics withstanding; there is certainly a lot more that can be added - which is why the more generic/standard name I think should be preferred. The other alternative might be, if a specialized article is really needed, to spin part of this out into Political demographics of NI, then have a new article which focused just on the politics and government in NI.--KarlB (talk) 13:32, 6 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Support as this article focuses on politics. Not sure if the political demographics need separating, but IMHO this article could do with an improvement in its layout. Brad7777 (talk) 18:15, 10 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Support ..so long as the article includes a subsection on political demographics as suggested by KarlB. JRPG (talk) 19:35, 10 July 2012 (UTC)
 * The article currently does have such a section; although overall the article needs work, so your help welcome there. But in general, yes that section should remain IMHO. --KarlB (talk) 20:06, 10 July 2012 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

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