Talk:Pork pie hat

Doherty
Because a Trilby hat is different from a pork-pie hat, and because Doherty wears Trilbys (mentions them by name in his songs), I removed this:

Musician Pete Doherty has made the pork-pie hat famous in recent years.

--DavidShankBone 15:37, 26 June 2006 (UTC)

well sorry, but the guy on the pic is definitely not sporting a pork pie. it rather looks like a granny's hat.


 * You're right. It doesn't match the ones linked to, or the description (it doesn't seem to have a flat top).  Should probably be removed, unless we can show this is indeed a pork pie hat.  TSP 02:53, 17 February 2007 (UTC)


 * And he sure as hell ain't "sporting" it! Globe199 06:46, 11 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I replaced the image with an image that actually shows a pork pie hat. Calliopejen 01:55, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

Hi Guys, sorry this is my first commenting on a Wiki page. Not sure if I'm in the right place... Just a heads up: the guy in the purple tank top is wearing a boater, not a pork pie hat.


 * Agreed. Pork pies can be made of straw (see File:Poncie Ponce Hawaiian Eye 1959.JPG), but they have to have a pork pie crown or else they aren't pork pies. That one either doesn't, or certainly doesn't show it.  We should use better photos, photos which do. Andy Dingley (talk) 10:04, 8 September 2018 (UTC)

Another reference to porkpie in popular culture
I am surprised that no-one has mentioned that in the Britcom 'Desmond's', there is a character whose name IS Porkpie, for the hat he wears. He even had his own show once the first series ended.

Grandma Roses 19:16, 20 July 2007 (UTC)

Im surprised there is no love for Yogi Bear —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.18.217.210 (talk) 20:26, 31 December 2007 (UTC)

Didn't Rocky Balboa wear a porkpie in I, II and V? Ifnkovhg (talk) 23:12, 3 January 2009 (UTC) John McLaughlin does an incredible rendition on "My Goal's Beyond" released in 1970. t4t0nk4 — Preceding unsigned comment added by T4t0nk4 (talk • contribs) 07:04, 22 January 2011 (UTC)

I am shocked and outraged that Elvis Costello isn't mentioned anywhere in this Wikipedia article. You should be ashamed of yourselves, and may God have mercy on your souls. 219.110.218.205 (talk) 18:51, 1 March 2013 (UTC) geekpondering


 * I realize there is a bit of a tradition on Wikipedia of listing a series of cultural references that somehow relate to be topic of a given article. That such a tradition exists does not justify its continuance, however, and I am here to stand firmly on the side of limiting the amount of trivia that gets tacked onto Wikipedia articles "just-cause-I-know-it-is-true."  That Yogi Berra wore a porkpie hat may be true— but the fact is not encyclopedic.  Buster Keaton's influence on the porkpie hat is traceable and interesting; the Puerto Rican children's television show actor's influence, however, appears to be anecdotal.  Wikipedia is not a collection of anecdotes!  Yogi Berra, along with the rest of the Hanna-Barbera cartoon characters who may or may not have worn particular kinds of hats, will have to take a backseat to Buster Keaton and Robert De Niro.  So say I.  From over here.   KDS 4444  Talk   11:41, 8 July 2013 (UTC)


 * I have no position on the encyclopedic nature of persons who do or don't wear a hat. However, it is important to note that Yogi_Berra is a person, and Yogi_Bear was a Hanna-Barbera_Productions cartoon character (and in fact their respective pages caution against confusing the two).

Most of these others were famous for wearing pork pie hats, whereas Keaton usually wore a boater. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.128.53.226 (talk) 08:33, 5 January 2014 (UTC)

Warning
We've been having these minor and stupid vandalisations at nearly all the hat articles. If Salvio does not bring it to ANI, I will. Fair warning. Djathink imacowboy  21:57, 23 December 2011 (UTC)

Robert Oppenheimer
J. Robert Oppenheimer also sported a porkpie hat. "Up to 1954 Dr. Oppenheimer's big-brimmed brown porkpie hat, size 6 7/8, was a frequent (and telltale) sight in Washington and the capitals of Western Europe, where he traveled to lecture or consult." at http://www.nytimes.com/learning/general/onthisday/bday/0422.html

is 3 the new 4?
"A pork pie hat is one of three or four different styles of hat..."

I suppose this is just Wiki being Wiki...vague, disorganized, amateurish...but if you're going to organize it that way, please point out the three definites and the one maybe that constitute "three or four." 108.49.32.70 (talk) 02:01, 13 August 2018 (UTC)


 * Three or four is not a number, but a rough estimate, a little more than two or three, and tantamount to saying a small handful. Where the figure is imprecise by definition, and only its relative size capable of estimation, the appelation becomes applicable. The world cannot be reduced entirely to an Arithmetic of squared paper: there is of necessity a place for the human dimension, the blurred outline, the guess.


 * Nuttyskin (talk) 04:10, 16 November 2019 (UTC)

An image of a crowd wearing pork pie hats in another article
There's an image of a crowd wearing pork pie hats in the article about Time Square. I'm not a 100% sure if they really are pork pie hats but it does look like it. Just thought it would fit in this article. The reason why I'm writing on this talk page is I don't know how to add the image myself. Eestimees94 (talk) 09:00, 9 May 2020 (UTC)

Jamaican Rude Boy
The "rude boy" hat does not resemble a "normal" pork-pie hat. Pork-pie hats are circular, with the crown-indentation also being circular. Rude-boy hats look like rather tall trilbys, with a pointed front, and a creased crown, taller at the front than the back. In particular, rude-boy hats do not call to mind the appearance of a pork pie. They look more like a seaside-resort "kiss-me-quick" hat.

I would like to see some text here that explains the origins of the rude-boy hat, and why it is referred to as a "pork-pie" hat. I don't mind that the rude-boy hat is called a pork-pie; it's OK for a word to mean two different things. But these *are* two different hats. You just have to look at them. So while contrasting these two hats, I'm calling the Jamaican style a "rude-boy" hat, but I'm not suggesting that it's shouldn't be called a pork-pie hat. I do not have the knowledge or sources to write this prose myself.

Rude-boy hats are quite common on the street around here (nearly always worn by young white men). Pork-pie hats seem to be very rare - my father had one, but I never saw him wear it. I think I've seen more people wearing a bowler than a normal, round pork-pie.

I plan to remove the paragraph about rude-boy hats, maybe in a day or so. There should be something here about rude-boy hats, but it's not right to conflate them with "normal" pork-pie hats.

MrDemeanour (talk) 10:21, 14 October 2021 (UTC)


 * So I went ahead and changed the paragraph (I didn't delete it), clarifying that a rude-boy hat is more like a trilby than a pork-pie hat, but noting that it is indeed known as a pork-pie.


 * Incidentally, if anyone knows (sourced!) how a rude-boy hat came to be known as a pork-pie, I'd love to learn.


 * MrDemeanour (talk) 14:50, 15 October 2021 (UTC)

Addition of content to article
Would love to contribute to this article by adding a little more about the origins of the Pork-Pie Hat in western fashion! The Dictionary of Fashion History cites the pork-pie hat as an article of womenswear, popularised in the 1860s, described thusly “A hat with a low, flat crown or straw or velvet, with a narrow brim turned up close all round.” (Cumming, Cunnington, and Cunnington, 2010, p.213). Further, The Encyclopaedia Britannica offers great description of the style, and reference to similarly shaped styles worn in Europe during the Middle Ages. Important descriptions ascribed to objects held in the collections of the V&A (London) could also be referred to. Many thanks! Diary of a Dress Historian (talk) 14:55, 19 June 2023 (UTC)

Oppenheimer
I've seen multiple descrptions of J. Robert Oppenheimer's famous hat as a pork pie, but looking at the photos, it doesn't seem like what is described here. Thoughts on adding a mention? Citations are available but maybe more context would be useful before adding them. 2601:644:8584:2010:0:0:0:5FA4 (talk) 20:52, 8 August 2023 (UTC)


 * It's a frankenhat. It has the crown of a pork-pie, with a round dent surrounded by a raised rim; but it has eyes at the front, like a fedora, and a broader brim than a pork-pie.
 * It always looks beaten up, as if he makes a habit of jumping on it before putting it on. MrDemeanour (talk) 10:12, 9 August 2023 (UTC)

contemporary associations
two of the most important associations are musicians Thelonious Monk, who is likely responsible for Tom Waits'wearing this style, and saxophonist Lester Young. Charles Mingus' composition 'Goodbye, Pork Pie Hat' is dedicated to him. 2601:603:4E00:1A10:58B7:9412:9C9D:1B3C (talk) 00:34, 26 December 2023 (UTC)