Talk:Positional asphyxia

Crucifixion
I've heard that one of the usual ways people ultimately die during crucifiction. Is this true, and if so is it worth mentioning here? Dan 05:49, 25 November 2005 (UTC)

Assessment
Apparently some self appointed 'expert' thinks this topic is 'low importance' Go figure - I thought it killed people and resulted in multi-million dollar law cases. If Wikipedia is going to start having 'experts' to rate articles, I'd like to see the qualifications/publication track record of the rater. At least proper peer reviewed sources use genuine experts on the article to conduct the review. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.155.80.244 (talk) 17:22, 9 June 2009 (UTC)


 * I'm not an expert, and this is a statement of its importance to this project and not a statement of its overall importance to the world. As you clearly state elsewhere, this subject is of great interest outside of medicine.  Doubtless a wikiproject that dealt with another area would consider it to be a much higher priority.  WhatamIdoing (talk) 16:17, 10 June 2009 (UTC)

"Major cases of positional asphyxia-related deaths in police custody" needs better sourcing or to be removed
None of the sources (except for the Times opinion piece, even mentions the term "positional asphyxia" (and doesn't state Garner died of it)—so this is WP:SYNTH and WP:OR at best. Worse, the George Floyd the official preliminary report specifically stated there were no signs of asphyxia, and the autopsy found that he died of a heart attack, not asphyxia; only a private autopsy paid for by the family's attorneys had any such finding. The ME in the David Smith case said he died of "mechanical asphyxia" but the article describes a legal settlement, and never uses the term. I would absolutely remove the Garner and Floyd cases, or at the very least make clear that there were allegations of asphyxia that were never proven. And if the "prone restraint" is the larger issue, then perhaps this should be in another article.

There are other problems with the article—such as the source for the entire lead being taken from an original source not known to be reliable and is specifically about "hog-tied" subjects, not simply the position they're in. Tambourine60 (talk) 23:39, 12 June 2020 (UTC)
 * If positional asphyxia does not imply mechanical compression in any way, but instead a position (like hog tying) resulting in asphyxia, as the NCJRS reference implies, perhaps much of this content should be moved to the Mechanical Asphyxiation Article section of the Asphyxia article. URL: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asphyxia#Mechanical_asphyxia
 * If this change is supported then the Garner and Floyd cases should be moved there as well as reference to knee on belly position. It would be more appropriate to illustrate hog-tying for this article. Also the compressive asphyxia and mechanical asphyxia articles in the asphyxia article should probably be combined.Thehittite (talk) 19:58, 22 June 2020 (UTC)

Inclusion of death of George Floyd
Pretty biased to use the 3rd party autopsy report that the family of the man had done to include him in this article. At least it should be noted where this information is coming from and that it conflicts with the official report.
 * I agree that there is a discrepancy between the autopsy reports of the family and the Medical Examiner's and one could add details from the Medical Examiner's report regarding factors which may have contributed to his death. Here is one potential source: https://www.cnn.com/2020/06/01/us/george-floyd-independent-autopsy/index.html
 * It would be great if you could make a suggestion for such an edit. Please sign your entries on the talk page with four of these ~ in a row like thisThehittite (talk) 19:39, 22 June 2020 (UTC)

George Floyd two knees on back
I'd like to modify to the following sentence from "On May 25, 2020 George Floyd died by asphyxia when Minneapolis Police officer Derek Chauvin knelt on Floyd's neck for almost nine minutes as Floyd lay on his stomach on the pavement." to "On May 25, 2020 George Floyd died by asphyxia when Minneapolis Police officer Derek Chauvin knelt on Floyd's neck for almost nine minutes and two other officers knelt on Floyd as he lay on his stomach on the pavement. Two knees were placed on Floyd's back compressing his lungs." supported by the following reference https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/george-floyd-s-family-was-told-other-officers-will-be-n1221926

This clarifies how positional asphyxia could have occurred. Suggestions are welcome!Thehittite (talk) 17:30, 22 June 2020 (UTC)

Scope and Range of article
As a reader hoping to find out more about positional asphyxiation, seeing an article with 80% of the focus on police methods, and a dearth of information on non-police related asphyxiation, is disappointing. More information on the mechanism of action, including a diagram is needed. Such paltry mention of infant positional asphyxiation (not an obscure form of asphyxiation, such that it’s relative word count as compared to asphyxiation related to law enforcement interaction is rather noticeable), work related fatalities, accidental death from asphyxiation resulting from a fall into an abnormal position, and a passing reference to the four factors that contribute to positional asphyxiation in the form of restraint, lead me to believe this piece was written with the intent to highlight problematic police interaction. In fact, the four factors mentioned are mentioned in a misleading way, because these four factors go to positional asphyxiation per se, not only such asphyxiation due to restraint. Rather, what is more appropriate is to break the article into sections highlighting different types/causes of positional asphyxiation (restraint more generally, infant, accidental death, positional asphyxiation in adults, etc) with mention of police restraints as having been contributing factors to death as a subheading under the restraints generally heading. From within this subheading, links to an article on police related deaths with a subsection with more in depth focus on positional asphyxiation is more appropriate. From there, of course, a link to positional asphyxiation generally. This article should be much, much larger and more in depth. 172.58.29.114 (talk) 23:29, 26 February 2023 (UTC)