Talk:Presidential state car (United States)/Archive 1

June 2006
Merging Cadillac One into Presidential limousine would make sense, but the merge the other way was bogus. The term "Cadillac One" isn't even used much, from Google. --John Nagle 23:11, 16 June 2006 (UTC)

Merge in progress; adding info about Presidental Lincolns. --John Nagle 23:21, 16 June 2006 (UTC)

Merge complete; motorcade info imported from Cadillac One, all info now sourced, fixed links, redirected Cadillac One to here, removed merge tag. Done for now. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Nagle (talk • contribs) 23:33, 16 June 2006 (UTC)

Rename needed
Either this article needs renaming to "US presidential limousine" or material on other countries needs to be added. TimVickers 23:13, 28 September 2006 (UTC)

Removing "(at various times, the "Sunshine Special" and the "Bubble Top" have also been on display at that museum)."
I am removing "(at various times, the "Sunshine Special" and the "Bubble Top" have also been on display at that museum)." from the paragraph as it simply is not true. Both the Sunshine Special and the Bubble Top are on permenant Display in the Museum and have not been moved since the 90s; they will remain there unless repair work is needed, or they are destroyed. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.149.233.3 (talk • contribs) 19:32, 26 November 2006 (UTC)

Plagiarism of Wikipedia
Looks like someone has plagiarised this content: http://automen.blogspot.com/2007/01/limousine-of-us-president.html — Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.194.36.30 (talk • contribs) 03:29, 18 January 2007 (UTC)

Armchair quarterback speculation need to be substantiated or deleted
This article is full of armchair quarterback speculation. This speculation needs to be explicitly noted as such--which probably would mean it needs to be deleted since it would not be encyclopedic--or substantiated. I have marked several "facts" as needing citation because they are far from certain. This article's speculative nature is unfortunate for such a well-known vehicle. Nova SS 20:37, 20 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Most of the sections you marked as needing citations are facts and not speculative at all. I think they should be cited, but I read through and nothing is speculative except perhaps the night vision and four-wheel drive. Everything else I've read in a Popular Mechanics article. I might go locate it and put in the proper cites. ~ Rollo44 05:55, 16 February 2007 (UTC)

possible plagerism
http://www.rediff.com/money/2006/aug/18cars.htm about half way down the page is exactly copied. Fibinachi 23:55, 19 February 2007 (UTC)

another apparent reference
There also seems to be some content from this article here: http://www.automobilemag.com/features/news/0501_george_bush_inauguration_cadillac_dts_limousine/ I am new to Wikipedia and not savvy on how to create a Reference section so perhaps someone else could take a look at this? Paul --Paul Cone 03:49, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

Revise
At once, the Kennedy Lincoln was known as the SS100X, not the "X-100" as some dumb bastard called Steve Baker would have us believe. "barnstar" my ass, lets ban him for ever for including dubius information-Margeret Suckley and Harry Swoger.... — Preceding unsigned comment added by 209.244.31.187 (talk • contribs) 00:01, 20 April 2007 (UTC)

Presidential SUV?
The article lacks information about the presidential SUVs sometimes used instead of the stretch limos. I remember seeing these vehicles in TV coverage of the president's first visit to New York City after 9/11, and I was unaware of their existance before that. Like the regular limos they have flags and the presidential seal. What model are they and are they merely regular armored Secret Service SUVs with symbols added or are they as unique as Cadillac One? It would be interesting to know what determines the choice of vehicle. Based on its appearance at Ground Zero and in post-Katrina New Orleans it may be preferred in disaster areas or when the trip was arranged at short notice. I'm not adding this to the article because I'm unable to find any detailed sources beyond confirmation that the president sometimes rides in an SUV. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.111.195.56 (talk • contribs) 01:40, 5 June 2007 (UTC)
 * I added a blurb about it (with a ref to a photo), simply because I feel a reader might think the president never rides in anything but a limo from reading the article. The point can be expanded upon further if anyone digs up any more info. The fact that he rode it at a military base and at disaster sites may indicate that transporting the SUV is easier logistically than moving the limo, and it can thus be deployed faster/easier. But that's just idle speculation. Bahamut0013 17:46, 26 July 2007 (UTC)
 * As I recall, George W. Rode in an SUV when he visited the Daytona 500 in 2004. The most likely reason for this is that the old tunnel had an steep grade and long wheelbased vehicles could bottom out at the entrance and exit. I don't remember what the other presidents used. jamskatelake 13:18, 17 January 2008
 * SUVs are frequently used. For example, Trump was in an SUV when his motorcade was given the finger in Potomac Falls, VA and when Obama did an extended interview that included picking up burgers at Five Guys. Usually the Suburbans are used when trying to maintain a lower profile. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.96.221.240 (talk • contribs) 22:24, 1 February 2020 (UTC)

Copy edit
I completed some copy edits for style and sentence structure, and removed duplicate links (Nixon was linked repeatedly for some reason). Please remember to sign your posts. Cheers! ZouBEini 11:06, 15 July 2007 (UTC)

Article about presidential cars
Can anyone give a hand with the article about Official state cars? Thanks ;p --Hetfield1987 (Wesborland | James Hetfield) 17:17, 28 July 2007 (UTC)

Flag Error
The article specifically states that the United States flag goes on the right fender, and the Presidential Flag goes on the left fender, but the picture beside that paragraph shows the exact opposite. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Winkie (talk • contribs) 13:50, 3 September 2007 (UTC)

First Hand Account
I know that a lot of the information is from other sources but I have tried to clean up as much of it as I can. After a first hand account and personal detailed tour of the Presidential Limos, including the SUVs, I felt I have the proper knowledge to write and edit this article. I would like to add that the SUVs are heavily armored, similar to the Cadillac as they are built on a similar chassis. The SUVs are all Chevrolet Suburbans with a few chase cars that are Lincolns and a Ford Expedition. When you see vehicles other than these in a motorcade, they are rentals or hired drivers. The ambulance in the rear of the motorcade is staffed with a Paramedic and an EMT. Generally with the same equipment they always carry. They do not carry blood as they do not have a means to keep it cold. There is a physician and nurse in the motorcade, but they are not in the ambulance.I have a lot more information on this and other Presidential subjects. If you have questions, let me know. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 165.201.142.50 (talk) 13:47, 1 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Unfortunately, first-hand accounts are not reliable sources. Even if it were not an anonymous account, it would probably fall under 'original research', which is also not good enough. I'm going to remove some unsourced facts from the 'current model' section, or at least indicate that they are speculative. I'll post removed material here on the talk page so that others can try to source it and add it back in later... Cheakamus (talk) 22:48, 30 December 2007 (UTC)

Vehicle weight is wrong.
Cadillac lists the specs for their limos at a maximum GVWR of 6790 pounds. Even accounting for unspecified secret upgrades for Presidential use, it is not possible for this vehicle to weigh 60000 pounds. Verify at :http://www.cadillac.com/cadillacjsp/spotlight/ProV/specs.jsp?type=limousines  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.199.170.82 (talk) 17:35, 3 November 2007 (UTC)
 * its just a random number pulled out of some ones ass. It could be 60,000 Lbs if armored with lead.   But you know what. Considering its not even a Caddy DTS chassis but truck.  My educated guess and i do deal with Armor plating at my job.  We are a aerospace,defense,medical supplies contractor.  I would say its 10-14 thousand pounds  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.109.127.19 (talk) 05:44, 5 November 2007 (UTC)

November 2007
Also i am sorry the armor is not 5 inches thick. If it was the car would weigh so much that it would need more then 4 tires. The Glass would be 5 inches thick and is. Most armored cars have glass which is 2-5 inches thick roughly. I wouldnt call is glass. Its a composite of safety glass, Polycarbonate and epoxy resin. The problem with this is that the glass is so thick it cannot be curved. Also no serious armored car has windows that can go down for 1 its a serious security flaw and for 2 each winder weighs around 50lbsI have no clue and no one here has a clue whats in it. The article is mostly BS. Odds are its a composite of steel armor plating, A few layers of ballistic fiberglass and or kevlar or even spectra shield but i doubt the spectra shield since it has a limited shelf life compared to other aramid fibers. Hell about 75% of this article is plagiarized http://www.topspeed.com/cars/car-news/cadillac-onelimousine-of-us-president-ar25623.html  any questions feel free to email me at sfazekas@shoreline-motorsports.com  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.109.127.19 (talk) 05:56, 5 November 2007 (UTC)
 * True. No way could it weigh 60,000 pounds and run on four car-sized wheels. The  wheels would sink into the ground.  A Bradley weighs about 50,000 pounds, and an Sherman tank slightly over 60,000, depending on version. Those are tracked vehicles.  The Stryker weighs about 40,000 pounds, and runs on eight big tires.  Eighteen-wheel trucks are limited to 80,000 pounds.  --John Nagle (talk) 04:55, 27 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Whoever said that the armor is as heavy as steel? Not that this makes the poorly sourced statement correct... Nova SS (talk) 00:56, 2 January 2008 (UTC)

Unsourced facts about current model
Please help find reliable sources for the following facts about the current model, then add them back to the main article: Cheakamus (talk) 23:48, 30 December 2007 (UTC)
 * "a GM truck chassis with a specialized engine is used"
 * "The standard DeVille flush-style door handles have been replaced by a loop-type design, made specifically for this vehicle. The security door handles may only be opened by trained Secret Service personnel."
 * "The exterior wreath-and-crest emblems located behind the rear side windows are the only stock components."
 * "run-flat tires are custom made twice annually by GoodYear."
 * "While on a June 2007 overseas visit to Rome, Italy, the presidential limousine in which President Bush was riding experienced mechanical failure and stalled during a motorcade. In a video widely available on the internet, the presidential limousine can be seen coasting to a halt while the Secret Service agent at the wheel attempts to restart the engine.  The vehicle was not able to be immediately restarted and the President was evacuated from the car and placed into the backup limousine.  Secret Service and Italian Police are observed attempting to secure the crowd and form a security cordon during the unscheduled stop; finally, after a period of some time, the President emerges from his original car and is whisked away."
 * This article from the herald-tribune http://www.iht.com/articles/2007/06/11/frontpage/notebook.php reports that the motorcade stopped, but doesn't mention Bush changing vehicles.
 * "The Vice President of the United States has his own distinct Cadillac limousine, which is currently a 2001 DeVille model displaying the Vice Presidential flag and bearing the Vice Presidential Seal on the rear doors. It is also transported as needed, whether for overseas trips or within the Washington, D.C. area."
 * Not sure what section of the article this should go into
 * Thank you for doing this. The presidential limo has way too much lore that is communally reinforced as fact. Nova SS (talk) 00:43, 2 January 2008 (UTC)

Improper text placement
The following text is about the 2001 limo and does not belong in the section about the current vehicle:"Many details of the limousine's construction are secret or classified, but speculation in the press is that the exterior is paneled with five inches of ballistic armor, and that the underside of the car is also armored. The car is also thought to have a run-flat tire system and to be environmentally sealed against chemical and biological attacksSimilar to its predecessor, the 2001 Presidential Limousine, the stretch Cadillac features an executive plush interior with a rear foldaway desktop, an extensive entertainment system featuring a 10-disc CD changer and adaptive, massaging cushions. The president sits in the rear seat, facing a console-mounted, secure communications panel which is connected to five antennas mounted on the trunk lid. The vehicle has a United States flag mounted on the left front fender and a Presidential flag on the right front fender. Flush-mounted high intensity discharge (HID) spotlights illuminate the flags at night. Similar to an option available on the standard Cadillac DTS, the presidential limousine is said to have a night vision system, with the camera placed in an undisclosed location." It would be speculation to say this applies to the current car. How should this content be folded into the article? Nova SS (talk) 00:54, 2 January 2008 (UTC)

Topseed.com is not a reliable source
http://www.topspeed.com/cars/car-news/-cadillac-onelimousine-of-us-president-ar25623.html appears to just parrot http://automen.blogspot.com/2007/01/limousine-of-us-president.html which in turn may mostly parrot http://www.popularmechanics.com/automotive/new_cars/1269716.html. Please do not use the topspeed or automen articles as sources. They appear to be bandied about in this discussion page. Nova SS (talk) 00:58, 2 January 2008 (UTC)

1962 Grill
Kennedy had nothing to do with the decision to upgrade the front clip with a contemporay grill/bumper. Secret Service made this call as well as changing the color to a darker blue. Some scources claim the car was built by Ford with Hess and Eisenhardt installing the interior components, does anyone have any more info as to who built what? 65.43.180.138 (talk) —Preceding comment was added at 16:32, 12 January 2008 (UTC)

Additional Information In The New York Times
Excellent article that relates to the subject in the November 2nd, 2008 edition of the Sunday New York Times titled, "Executive Privilege, All Stretched Out and Armored." http://www.nytimes.com/2008/11/02/automobiles/collectibles/02PREZ.html?hp —Preceding unsigned comment added by Wiseguy007 (talk • contribs) 09:16, 2 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Writer's Note From Wiseguy007: I apologize for not leaving a signature. I was unaware of the proper procedures and etiquette. This is the first time I have contributed to a discussion page. --Wiseguy007 (talk) 09:29, 3 November 2008 (UTC)Jonathan Williams.

Source for use

 * Obama's wheels: Secret Service to unveil new presidential limo --Nehrams2020 (talk) 21:30, 6 January 2009 (UTC)

New article split
I split off a good deal of specific information about a previous presidential limousine into the 2005 Cadillac DTS Presidential State Car (United States) article. Images relating to that car should be added there. Happyme22 (talk) 00:47, 21 January 2009 (UTC)

CS Monitor graphic
http://features.csmonitor.com/wp-content/themes/csm/popup.php?headline=Obama%26%238217%3Bs+new+limo+-+ugly+but+it+can+fend+off+asteroids&subhead=&graphic=http%3A%2F%2Ffeatures.csmonitor.com%2Fpolitics%2Fwp-content%2Fassets%2F19%2F744%2Fgraphic0.jpg has lots of facts - no attribution though beyond the paper's site. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.103.6.106 (talk) 21:52, 21 January 2009 (UTC)

Obamobile
Popular media use the name "Obamamobile" or "Obamobile" for the presidential car. I wanted to add an entry in wiki for this, but my contribution was deleted (!). Perhaps a reference can be made in this article? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Pluisjenijn (talk • contribs) 07:57, 22 January 2009 (UTC)
 * That would seem rather trivial. I don't think a mention is necessary. Happyme22 (talk) 22:18, 22 January 2009 (UTC)

Clarification
Is there any particular reason for the transition from Lincoln to Cadillac vehicles? --MercZ (talk) 18:16, 25 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Hmmm, I am not sure. That would be interesting to find out. I'll look into it. Best, Happyme22 (talk) 19:19, 26 January 2009 (UTC)

Criticism
There are critics because this is not an hybrid electric car. --147.84.132.44 (talk) 14:24, 19 February 2009 (UTC)
 * Please provide a source if you believe this should be included in the article. 00:39, 21 June 2009 (UTC)  — Preceding unsigned comment added by AniRaptor2001 (talk • contribs)

June 2009
I'm removing the following; I'm not sure what the intended meaning is, and it doesn't even make sense; why would Obama use the older limo model? Failed verify is also a problem. During his presidency, Barack Obama has consistently used the limousines of former President George W. Bush during visits nationwide and internationally. — Preceding unsigned comment added by AniRaptor2001 (talk • contribs) 00:36, 21 June 2009 (UTC)

The Sunshine Special
"The first car specially built for presidential use was the 1939 Lincoln V12 convertible called the 'Sunshine Special', used by Franklin Roosevelt. It remained in use until 1950. The Ford Motor Company leased the car to the office of the president for $500 a year; it is now on permanent display at the Henry Ford Museum in Dearborn, Michigan."Could we get a photo of this for the article? Its a very unusual car. --98.232.181.201 (talk) 04:15, 26 July 2009 (UTC)

Hybrid
According to a whitehouse.gov information article the current limousine is actually a "fuel efficient hybrid." Wondering if anyone has heard of this before? ~Planes&Mustangs510 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.178.183.39 (talk) 03:03, 8 January 2010 (UTC)

Replace Kennedy car photo
The article illustrating the car during the Kennedy years is currently unfortunately File:Moorman.jpg, which is a photo that was taken exactly as the President's head was being blown apart. It's a Polaroid showing only the back of the car. A more appropriate photo should be located. Comet Tuttle (talk) 21:24, 6 May 2010 (UTC)

Relationship with Cadillac / Branding
Can anyone give the reason that the newest limousines bear the Cadillac brand? Is there an agreement between the federal government and Cadillac that requires the federal government to place the Cadillac brand on these custom-made vehicles? Is there some kind of endorsement contract?Although "Cadillac One" is an informal name that given to the vehicles, there must be some reason that this almost completely custom-made car's grill bears the Cadillac brand. Was GM the prime contractor for building this car? Have Ford or Chrysler tried to get their logos attached to one of these tanks recently? I can't think of any other brand or product that appears to have been directly endorsed by recent Presidents the way that Cadillac is endorsed here.68.110.237.188 (talk) 06:27, 6 September 2010 (UTC)
 * yes. this should be obvious from the fact that it has cadillac branding.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.154.72.36 (talk) 18:09, 23 May 2011 (UTC)

Price
I think we've got to find a better source for the price of the vehicle. I find it very difficult to believe that this vehicle, with all of its advanced features, cost only $300,000. That's what it says in the Guardian article, but could that be a typo? $3,000,000 seems more believable. –BMRR (talk) 16:08, 16 January 2011 (UTC)
 * Agreed. I think it should be removed as nonsense. Even if that was the price paid by the White House by a PR-craving automaker the actual cost had to have been an order of magnitude higher. 96.49.150.214 (talk) 17:58, 28 October 2012 (UTC)
 * I think I've found the original graphic. http://go635254.s3.amazonaws.com/gas2/files/2009/01/cadillac_one.jpg  It says 300,000 GBP (Pounds) which is roughly $480,630 USD on November 2, 2012 night according to Google search.  Still, even at half a million USD I think it is still way too much of a bargain for a piece of customized military grade equipment.  To put it in perspective, a Bugatti Veyron cost about $1.7million USD.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 174.252.156.185 (talk) 04:12, 3 November 2012 (UTC)
 * http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1390180/President-Obamas-armour-plated-car-The-Beast-scuppered-ramp-Ireland-Lets-hope-doesnt-hit-London.html>$1million in text of article; >£1million on graphic caption. ---Blouis79 (talk)  —Preceding undated comment added 17:59, 21 January 2013 (UTC)

Truth in the claim that rebodied 1972 Continental was truly Reagan's getaway vehicle in 1981
I question the claim that the 1972 Lincoln Reagan used for shelter during the 1981 assassination attempt is the same vehicle at the Henry Ford museum. The vehicle shown in the 1981 incident most obviously has a 1972 rear bumper and taillight assembly, while the 1972+1977/9 at the Henry Ford museum was re-bodied before this incident. The difference would have reflected itself in the video. Furthermore, keep in mind that photographs of a stretched and armored '75/76 Continental in presidential service exist as well - mind you, duplicates and similar vehicles did exist simultaneously on the fleet. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.8.8.87 (talk • contribs) 04:26, 17 January 2011 (UTC)

Possible Citations
I remember seeing a special either on NatGeo or Discovery Channel (not sure which) titled Secrets of the Secret Servicewhich confirms several citation-needed parts in the section 'General Specifications'. The parts I remember on it that I can recall is the following: MAybe someone could check it out and get the citations cleared up? 75.12.45.138 (talk) 05:53, 21 January 2011 (UTC)
 * It DOES have run-flat tires
 * It DOES have a (foam?) lined fuel tank that is extremely resistant - or invulnerable - to explosions
 * It IS equipped with the tear gas cannons
 * It DID MENTION a bloodbank in the rear containing the President's bloodtype
 * It also DID MENTION a Remington stashed between the door and the seat.

Fuel consumption
Hi there. I recently added a sentence which referred the fuel consumption of the vehicle. I added a reliable source and I entered the sentence on the topic referring general specification. Then it was removed. Can someone tell me why on this article there is no reference to the fuel consumption of the vehicle? Is not that relevant considering so many other specifications present on this article?"The vehicle fuel consumption is about 8 miles per gallon which on metric system corresponds to around 30 litres/100km."Thank you very much João Pimentel Ferreira 12:50, 24 March 2011 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Joao.pimentel.ferreira (talk • contribs) 12:50, 24 March 2011 (UTC)
 * The reason I removed it was because when I went to the link you provided, it redirected to a "best of YouTube" video site that didn't seem to have anything to do with the car or its fuel consumption. I certainly agree that the fuel consumption is important and that it should be referenced. Do you know of any other reliable sites that have that information and could be used as a reference? Thanks, BMRR (talk) 16:39, 24 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Hi there again, may you kindly tell me if you consider the following sources as reliable. I've done a deep and wide search throughout the cyberspace to try to find out the presidential car fuel consumption and the only sites I found were the following ones. Nothing on CNN nor on nytimes.com
 * Obama’s presidential Car on Autofeat.com
 * World Interesting facts web site
 * Obama inspires me web site
 * A web site about car reviews
 * greetings João Pimentel Ferreira 11:09, 26 March 2011 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Joao.pimentel.ferreira (talk • contribs)

Photo of license plate of US state car?
If anyone has ever had the change to take a photo of the original license plate of the US state car, or has a resource to such a photo, it would be an awesome addition to this article! Thanks! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.163.144.31 (talk) 21:01, 19 April 2011 (UTC)
 * I'm thinking that not only should there be a photo, but some discussion of Clinton's decision to use the DC "Taxation Without Representation" plates.--Dnj710 (talk) 20:57, 16 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Presidential motorcade.jpg I would like to ask somebody to add the Washington D.C. 800 002license plate(s), also missing at Vehicle registration plates of Washington, D.C. I'm asking because I have no references at hand, maybe there are other license plate assignments, too. I've heard, that at least two presidential cars of the U.S. have the same number assigned...--Scriberius (talk) 17:12, 17 December 2011 (UTC)

How many are there of the 2009 version?
The article seems to imply there's only one vehicle of the new 2009 version (when seen from the front with 1 dividing line in the front grille instead of 3 in the models primarily used by GWBush). That seems a little hard to believe considering how often it's used and in so many locations. And how many available Air Force One planes there are. Yeah the older limos are still available and SUV's, but still. Pmcgrane (talk) 20:15, 19 February 2013 (UTC)

Decoy car.
There's no mention of the use of the second car as a decoy. Obama was staying opposite our office last weekend, and the two cars were in the middle of the convoy as it left. The media made several references to the cars alternating position in the convoy to thwart attacks. Is this true, (it makes sense), or is it just media hype.--Dmol (talk) 07:28, 17 November 2014 (UTC)

Possible incorrect information
The president possibly never used Al Capone's car. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 104.57.188.134 (talk) 02:13, 5 March 2015 (UTC)

U.S. Embassy at Dublin incident
In the Maneuverability part under the Current model section its shown that the current model (2009 Obama's Cadillac one) was stuck, And it was the 2005 Bush's DTS, So it should be removed from the Current model section. Mutasim0hourani (talk) 01:50, 24 May 2015 (UTC)
 * The article now appears to have no reference to this incident at all. This is odd, as it received a great deal of media coverage at the time, with observers commenting on the irony of a supposedly impregnable car being immobilized by a road hump. --Ef80 (talk) 21:51, 22 April 2016 (UTC)

Registration
Have noticed that the limos wear District of Columbia license plates, as opposed to US Government plates or Presidential Seal plates. Has this always been the case? - knoodelhed (talk) 15:20, 5 September 2015 (UTC)