Talk:Princess Kakyuu

Check
Would someone who knows this stuff please check Dasrik's edits? He's been permanently banned for vandalism. If this is more of the same, it's more subtle than usual. Thanks, Tualha 6 July 2005 14:37 (UTC)
 * I changed it back. Better safe than sorry. Danny Lilithborne 05:25, 16 August 2005 (UTC)

Hero Box
If we are trying to Keep the Hero's pages uniform and since shes a senshi (Although only in the manga but thats what the anime came from so Manga>Anime>Live action) Should she have a "Hero box"? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Lego3400 (talk • contribs).

in the anime she had a true star seed and was a senshi but never transformed probly Sailor cuteness 14:17, 20 October 2006 (UTC)


 * Good point! I think she should. --Masamage 17:50, 19 August 2006 (UTC)

Sailor Picture
We need a Picture of her in her Sailor Suit from the Manga! Lego3400: The Sage of Time 22:09, 4 November 2006 (UTC)
 * Good call! I've grabbed one; how's it look? --Masamage 02:25, 5 November 2006 (UTC)

Teeny little edit
Changed "Prince" to "lover" in the manga info section. There's no indication given in the text as to the gender of her lover, or whether s/he was royalty. (Although I think the Alex Glover translation says he, the original just says "ano hito", or that person.) Did it say Prince in the English manga? I'm not sure if it's really necessary to make a note of something this small, but oh well. ^^; Yumecosmos 02:52, 16 November 2006 (UTC)
 * Looks good to me; more accurate. :) So thanks! Interesting question about the English manga...I wish I knew. --Masamage 04:10, 16 November 2006 (UTC)

Forehead mark
I'm going out limb here (ok not really) and assuming that the mark on her forehead means the same thing for her as the crescent does on Sailor Moon, that it is her Planetary Symbol. Can anyone find a close up of it and cut it out? To display like we do for the senshi. And would a Star be the Starlights Planetary Symbol? --Lego3400: The Sage of Time 02:52, 26 November 2006 (UTC)

it dosnt say in the anime i havent read the manga (BUT I WANT TO MORE THEN LIFE ITS SELF) so im not sure what happend or if its mentiond Sailor cuteness 21:36, 8 December 2006 (UTC)


 * I think they are flowers (or clovers). There was a bunch of them surrounding her body when ChibiChibi found her in the manga.  - Saturn  Yoshi  THE VOICES 23:55, 8 December 2006 (UTC)


 * More accurately, they might be lilacs. There is a mention to the smell of lilacs in regards to the Starlights and Princess Kakyuu in the manga (as opposed to olive blossoms in the anime).  - Saturn  Yoshi  THE VOICES 00:00, 9 December 2006 (UTC)


 * Does it really say lilac in the manga? I could've sworn it said "kinmokusei", which is sweet osmanthus.  Otherwise the whole "Kinmoku sei" pun doesn't make sense.  And the osmanthus flower does look quite a bit like the symbol on her forehead: http://www.floridata.com/wallpaper/jpg/Osmanthus_fragrans800b.jpg

--Yumecosmos —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 24.165.111.9 (talk) 04:06, 11 December 2006 (UTC).


 * The English manga does indeed say lilac. Usagi says she smells lilacs when Seiya rescues her at the beginning when Mamoru was attacked by Galaxia, again when she recieves those cards in the mail (from Seiya) and again when ChibiChibi shows her the inscence burner that Kakyuu was healing in.  Given that both lilacs and osmanthus flowers both belong th the Oleaceae family, the joke is not ruined.  - Saturn  Yoshi  THE VOICES 07:41, 11 December 2006 (UTC)


 * Even if they're in the same family, I'm pretty sure the Japanese word kinmokusei refers specifically to osmanthus. I could be wrong, though.  (The materials collection only says "kinmokusei" which doesn't really help prove my point.)  I didn't know it said lilac in the English manga.  Should the article give both, do you think?Yumecosmos 23:10, 11 December 2006 (UTC)
 * Kinmokusei is definitely fragrant olive. It's probably appropriate to mention very briefly that the English manga translated it differently. --Masamage 00:09, 12 December 2006 (UTC)

The Materials Collection describes all those symbols and ornaments as fragrant olive. --Masamage 22:24, 11 December 2006 (UTC)


 * It could be that the Japanese language only has one word for all the members of this flower family. - Saturn  Yoshi  THE VOICES 08:41, 12 December 2006 (UTC)


 * The type of fragrant olive that appear on the upper part of her outfit (including head piece and forehead) are part of Osmanthus fragrans, but are known as the Aurantiacus variation. "Aurantiacus" apparently means "Orange-red coloured". They are similar to the "Thunbergii" variation that someone mentioned above. But the ones her outfit display are in fact the Aurantiacus. Fighter4luv 12:52, 4 March 2007 (UTC)

English language manga
I am currently reading the Stars arc in the English manga again, and I have yet to see Princess Kakyuu be called "Princess Fireball". They refer to her as "Princess Kakyu" (note the one "u"). - Saturn Yoshi  THE VOICES 01:24, 13 December 2006 (UTC)


 * Huh. Nuke it, I guess. --Masamage 01:39, 13 December 2006 (UTC)


 * The only time I saw her refered to as the "Fireball Princess" was the subtitles of my Sailor Stars DVDs. - Saturn  Yoshi  THE VOICES 01:52, 13 December 2006 (UTC)


 * Pending the discovery of this name within the Tokyopop manga, I'll go ahead and make the switch. Thanks for catching that! --Masamage 02:01, 13 December 2006 (UTC)


 * i saw it as well dose the stars anime use the name kakyuu because i only remember them useing fireball and just princess Sailor cuteness 17:10, 14 December 2006 (UTC)


 * Because there are so many versions of the subbed anime, and because none are official, we probably don't need to take them all into account. (Just as well, since it'd be hard...) --Masamage 20:58, 14 December 2006 (UTC)


 * I don't rember how that came about. One user had proof, though someone had reverted it, saying it was fan-crufty. So i pointed them at that user's proof and we put it back. I forgot who orginally added it though.... —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Lego3400 (talk • contribs) 16:36, 15 December 2006 (UTC).

Image caption
The top image of Kakyuu already has one caption; the infobox says "Princess Kakyuu" right on top of it. It doesn't need two. --Masamage 00:44, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

Song
Kakyuu seems to share a song with Saturn.. You know that La la laa one.... Do we know what that song is. Lego3400: The Sage of Time 02:39, 7 February 2007 (UTC)
 * If you mean the breathy haunting one, it's probably just a BGM. Galaxia shares one with Mistress 9, too. --Masamage 03:58, 7 February 2007 (UTC)

merge with Starlights
should she be mureged with the starlights or vice vercer because they come from the same planit and have the same backstory ♥Eternal Pink-Ready to fight for love and grace♥ 13:02, 22 March 2007 (UTC)
 * That would solve the problem of her having such a short article, but A) Is it necessary? and B) What would it be called? --Masamage 18:43, 22 March 2007 (UTC)

It could still called there planit name (can't spell and can't be botherd to paste) or still starlights and just have her own section in there page ♥Eternal Pink-Ready to fight for love and grace♥ 18:46, 22 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Technically she's not a Starlight though so that would cause problems, but I do agree there should be a merge. Kinmokusei Soldiers? Something like that. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Hitsuji Kinno (talk • contribs) 14:52, 13 May 2007 (UTC).


 * what about Kinmoku Senshi?? ♥Eternal Pink-Ready to fight for love and grace♥ 15:54, 13 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Hmm...how about just Kinmoku? --Masamage ♫ 17:03, 13 May 2007 (UTC)


 * I thourght that but were talking about the Senshi not the planit it's self ♥Eternal Pink-Ready to fight for love and grace♥ 19:40, 13 May 2007 (UTC)
 * I was thinking we could format it like it was about the planet--have the intro talk about Kinmoku's name and stuff, with the major section being "Key figures" or something. Kinda like Silver Millennium. --Masamage ♫ 22:19, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

I put up the templates. Is Kinmoku a good article name or no? --Masamage ♫ 15:16, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

I think its a good idea ♥Eternal Pink-Ready to fight for love and grace♥ 11:09, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

Well her senshi Uniform kinda points that she is yet isn't She wears the same top and brooch as the star lights, but the top is red her dress shortens into a little puffy red thing, (Simlier to the her normal dress has) with little see though peices of red fabric sticking off. her arms have each have a red puff on them. Her shoes stay the same. Lego3400: The Sage of Time 15:41, 16 May 2007 (UTC)


 * I don't think this is a good idea. The matter is complicated by the manga and the anime having different backstories. JuJube 20:01, 20 May 2007 (UTC)


 * I thought they had the same both planets destroyed by galaxia I thought the only diffrence was the princess being a senshi and the gender changing thingy ♥Eternal Pink-Ready to fight for love and grace♥ 20:07, 20 May 2007 (UTC)
 * There are other more subtle things mostly having to do with the manga characters journeying into space where the anime didn't. JuJube 20:13, 20 May 2007 (UTC)


 * oh but couldn't we cover it in the article? with anime and manga sections or just writing in manga they flew into space and in anime they went to a tv station lolz ♥Eternal Pink-Ready to fight for love and grace♥ 20:16, 20 May 2007 (UTC)


 * What are you referring to specifically, JuJube? I can't think of any differences that wouldn't be amply covered. If they go into space in the manga, and not the anime, we'd have to talk about that in both the Kakyuu and Starlights pages anyway. I don't see how that prevents us from merging, especially because then we'd only have to mention it once. --Masamage ♫ 23:27, 20 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Specifically, while certain key elements of the story remain the same (ie. ChibiChibi protecting the incense burner from destruction), the storyline differs drastically. With that said, I suppose I'm no longer opposed to merging, although I still think it's a bad idea.  I just can't adequately articulate my reasons right now. JuJube 00:28, 21 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Storyline is what Sailor Stars is for. :) Probably a lot of what we've got in here now could be merged out. --Masamage ♫ 00:53, 21 May 2007 (UTC)


 * When is the merge going to start? ♥Fighting for charming Love♥ 20:05, 23 May 2007 (UTC)


 * I guess it has been a while. Let's deadline it for Friday, maybe? If nobody complains by May 25th I'll start working on it that morning. --Masamage ♫ 21:05, 23 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Merging will also allow the introduction of Princess Kakyuu's prince in a bit more detail. (I know one or two sentences talking about the manga... but still it's a minor character that we never see, but she mentions). --Hitsuji Kinno 14:49, 24 May 2007 (UTC)


 * Did it ever say it was a prince? I think it just said lover ♥Fighting for charming Love♥ 21:15, 24 May 2007 (UTC)
 * "Princess Kakyuu, also," he says. "Her beloved was lost to Galaxia... Sailor Moon, whatever battle awaits you in the galaxy, we have power at your side." He kisses her hand. "We will protect you." (Alex Glover Act 46) However it's indirect speech model... because previous page Princess Kakyuu said, "The desire of the strong, beautiful guardian soldiers of the solar systems is to be sailor soldiers scattered across the galaxy. You took the Prince's hand, and you showed the shining of this planet's next king and queen. In that moment, the power of this planet's light, filled with the power of life, crossed time and space and spread throughout the entire galaxy. That was a message from this solar system stronger, brighter, and warmer than ever before. I have wanted to meet you for so very long." Japanese is supposed to be intuitive... beloved in the kanji context implied more than just "passing by lover" but something along the lines of Endymion and Serenity kind of thing. I don't know how to term that since Japanese have concepts of "crush" "light non-serious romantic love interest" "boyfriend" "going steady person who is male" "lover" "deep infatuated with lover" "Live-in lover" "married"... the words used were along the lines of "long time lover that she was very, very serious about" juxtaposed to the "rare for a prince and princess to join hands" text. --;; I don't think that kind of thing will float with an American audience who wants everything to be spoken out rather than intuited. But it's worth a shot explaining Japanese mode of communication through contextual basis. Speech is never without context unless artificially made to be. --Hitsuji Kinno 22:50, 24 May 2007 (UTC)
 * I thought for sure there was a place she herself talks about it? Alex Glover translated her as saying 'him', and I assumed she was saying 'kareshi'. Am I making stuff up? --Masamage ♫ 00:05, 25 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Really? I'm not sure which pages to look for... ^^;; (Been busy lately *guilty*)--Hitsuji Kinno 02:17, 26 May 2007 (UTC)

I'm working on the merge now. --Masamage ♫ 00:04, 27 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Blech. Reverted. See Talk:Sailor Starlights for why. --Masamage ♫ 01:29, 27 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Remove tags then? or will there be anther attempt? --Hitsuji Kinno 08:01, 2 June 2007 (UTC)
 * I wanted to wait and be sure everyone was satisfied with the merge not going through; by this point that does seem to be the case, so I'll remove them and a make a note of it at the main page. --Masamage ♫ 21:38, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

Kakyuu's prince
Continuing discussion from the section above...

I found it, Hitsuji! The line is from Act 46, translated like this by Alex Glover: "Sailor Galaxia," says the woman [Kakyuu]. "She is the soldier of destruction! The planets attacked by Galaxia are turned to planets of death. Things with and without life alike are destroyed. And he was too... Right in front of me..."

That strikes me very much as the kind of line that would require a 'kareshi'. Could you (or anyone else with the Stars manga) check it out? For context, here's the full page. It's right after she puts the cats on a blanket and right before her eyes tear up. --Masamage ♫ 23:47, 27 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Posting my findings:
 * hakai senshi galaxia ni osowareta hoshi wa imechiaru mono monaimono mo subete horibosare shi no hoshi ni naru. Ano Hito mo... me no maede...
 * So no "Kareshi"... but then remember that Japanese drops objects and I a lot. It's highly intuitive. The fact she's crying, the fact she said that prince and princesses uniting is rare, and the dialogue explained by Seiya and Yaten later all point to something more than lover... Japanese is highly intuitive. It's not definitive like English. Worse comes to worse I'll ask a person from Genvid to add it to their list of questions when they get in contact with Naoko Takeuchi. =P Sailor Cosmos is on the top of that list for me. (BTW, the romaji was sloppily done. =P You try to type and read Japanese at the same time. Page 28 of Volume 17 in the original.)--Hitsuji Kinno 01:02, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

Zero no Tsukaima: Futatsuki no Kishi 2, Zero no Tsukaima: Futatsuki no Kishi 3 Image of a different series makes the same statement. "Ano Hito" for the person she loved. I thought it was worth noting for the sake of it, but not for inclusion. --Hitsuji Kinno 01:50, 24 July 2007 (UTC)

I've been watching more Japanese Dramas, "Ano hito" is always used for a dead person and always a lover or a spouse. "Ano Hito" was used in several japanese dramas for dead significant others. It was never used by children of the deceased who called them by either title or name. I can give direct instances of this... but I'm not sure if it's too OR. But this is about Japanese usage, isn't it? Oh and the subbers almost always substitute the person's name in place of "Ano Hito" when it appears. --Hitsuji Kinno (talk) 07:23, 5 February 2008 (UTC)

Re:Song
Finnally found it on the net... It is a BGM... Its called... Holy Grail Thats all its called... Just holy grail...Lego3400: The Sage of Time 02:08, 4 July 2007 (UTC)
 * Where'd you find that? --Masamage ♫ 05:59, 4 July 2007 (UTC)


 * Its called that on limewire ♥Fighting for charming Love♥ 13:31, 4 July 2007 (UTC)
 * Okay...Sailormusic has a song called Holy Grail, but I don't recognize it at all. Can someone tell me when it plays over Kakyuu so I can listen to it there? --Masamage ♫ 16:22, 4 July 2007 (UTC)


 * In the first episode she appers and the one after that where she tells them about the Sailor Wars ♥Fighting for charming Love♥ 16:30, 4 July 2007 (UTC)


 * It also plays practically every time the starlights talk about her to anyone.--Lego3400: The Sage of Time 05:06, 5 July 2007 (UTC)


 * And when she died ♥Fighting for charming Love♥ 10:46, 5 July 2007 (UTC)
 * Well, the thing I've found called Holy Grail in one of the tracklists is definitely not it, but the correct song does seem to be called "Holy Grail" in the Memorial Music Box, and "Holy Grail, Messiah" in yet another tracklist. XP Confusing. By the way, why do we need to know the title? --Masamage ♫ 18:19, 5 July 2007 (UTC)

Music Storage

 * In the musicals, Kakyuu is given an operatic singing style for her solo song, "Toki Michite Kourin."
 * She also joins in the group song "Kakyuu to Three Lights."
 * In the anime she doesn't have a charcter song, but she Shares the BGM entitled Holy Grail with Hotaru. It plays whenever she is mention, and at her death —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.77.89.15 (talk) 14:13, 16 September 2007 (UTC)

wikilinking
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Osmanthus_fragrans is a direct link to the particular Osmanthus being references.Is it worth it to shift the link?--Hitsuji Kinno (talk) 17:09, 24 February 2008 (UTC)