Talk:Princess Vittoria of Savoy

Requested move 30 January 2024

 * The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: not moved. per WP:COMMONNAME (closed by non-admin page mover)  ❯❯❯  Raydann  (Talk)   17:16, 7 February 2024 (UTC)

Princess Vittoria of Savoy → Vittoria di Savoia – Italian monarchy was abolished in 1946, over 50 years before Vittoria was born, and Wikipedia should have a NPOV.

WP:NCROY states "Do not use hypothetical, dissolved or defunct titles, including pretenders (real or hypothetical), unless this is what the majority of reliable sources use."

Most of the sources refer to her as "Vittoria di Savoia", including her own Instagram. D1551D3N7 (talk) 22:08, 30 January 2024 (UTC)


 * Oppose: Per WP:COMMONNAME. As Article titles says, Article titles are based on how reliable English-language sources refer to the article's subject.. The article subject is called "Princess Vittoria of Savoy" by Tatler, Business Insider, Vanity Fair, Vogue, New York Daily News, and Marca. Also, NPOV gives the most weight to the most prominent view on a subject, meaning the name most commonly used by English RS will be chosen. Any argument about monarchy and the article title being misleading is WP:RIGHTGREATWRONGS and WP:OR and should be automatically discarded by the closer. --StellarHalo (talk) 10:45, 31 January 2024 (UTC)
 * Most of those sources are celebrity or gossip magazines who of course would play up the royalist viewpoint and I would not consider them to be unbiased sources. The Business Insider article you linked clearly refers to her as "Vittoria di Savoia" in the first bullet point "Teenage influencer Vittoria di Savoia" they only use "Princess" later in the article as it talks about House of Savoy and her position within it. Sources that are considered generally Reliable do not use the title of Princess to refer to her:
 * ABC News uses "Vittoria di Savoia"
 * NY Times uses Vittoria throughout and never with "Princess". Also uses "di Savoia" as surnames for her parents. D1551D3N7 (talk) 15:45, 31 January 2024 (UTC)
 * Whether or not sources are unbiased is not relevant to what an article's title should be. None of the sources I listed has been deemed unreliable per community consensus while Vanity Fair and Vogue have been deemed generally reliable. The Business Insider calls her a princess as part of the headline. The ABC News article uses "Princess Vittoria di Savoia" in the third paragraph. The NY Times article never refers to the article subject as anything besides "Vittoria" and does not use the name you want to move this article to. StellarHalo (talk) 18:51, 31 January 2024 (UTC)
 * Support per wp:ncroy Do not use hypothetical, dissolved or defunct titles—blindlynx 15:06, 31 January 2024 (UTC)
 * Nope, that's not what it says. -- Necrothesp (talk) 17:15, 31 January 2024 (UTC)
 * Oppose per WP:COMMONNAME. -- Necrothesp (talk) 17:15, 31 January 2024 (UTC)


 * Move — To "Vittoria di Savoia Carignano." Per nom, but "di Savoia" is WP:BIAS when Aimone is called "di Savoia-Aosta." UmbrellaTheLeef (talk) 13:18, 1 February 2024 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
 * Oppose - This is English Wikipedia, not Italian Wikipedia. So let's keep using what's recognizable to english-language readers. GoodDay (talk) 21:16, 3 February 2024 (UTC)
 * I didn't realise the Italian monarchy was supposed to still be recognised in the world of English apologies.
 * It's a surname, you shouldn't translate surnames. English sources use this name also.
 * Google search results:
 * Vittoria di Savoia - 104k
 * Vittoria of Savoy - 4k
 * D1551D3N7 (talk) 23:22, 3 February 2024 (UTC)
 * Oppose, per WP:COMMONNAME. English language media uses the name "Princess Vittoria of Savoy." --  Cosmic6811  🍁 ( T ·  C ) 00:52, 4 February 2024 (UTC)
 * Oppose as per WP:COMMONNAME. - Therealscorp1an (talk) 07:37, 4 February 2024 (UTC)
 * Oppose per WP:COMMONNAME. - AviationEnzo (talk) 16:07, 7 February 2024 (UTC)