Talk:Puukko

comments
This edit looks odd to me. To fact-check a part of it, the additions state that "everyone in Finland" has heard of the weapon's usefulness during the Winter War. I've been here for close to 21 years and never have, how about the other Finns present? --Kizor 19:32, 17 December 2005 (UTC)

I know no one besides me who has. --Fagyd 17:56(GMT+2), 20 December 2005

You certainly cannot say that everyone knows about it. Also the talk about the rite of passage seems a bit odd. Maybe change "many families" to "some families" to indicate that this is probably not a majority of the people. --Rackham 18:11, 31 December 2005 (UTC)

I agree. I'm not sure about West-Finland, but here in the east it's very uncommon. --Fagyd 19:17, 1 January 2006 (UTC+2)

With half my years spent in Häme and the other half in Western Finland, I haven't heard of the puukko as a rite of passage in either. I'm starting to think we should just call BS on the additions. Incidentally, Fagyd, what have you heard about the weapon in the winter war? --Kizor 17:28, 1 January 2006 (UTC)

I certainly have heard of war uses. Naturally it was also a tool there, but also a weapon. "Ensimmäinen työkalu ja viimeinen hengen turva." 213.216.199.10 21:10, 20 June 2006 (UTC)

I have heard of the war use, but never a reference to initiation rite status of puukko. Is this outdated information or does it hold true in some area (Lapland)? I'm from Central Finland (Keski-Suomi), my parents come from Savo and Ostra Bothnia (Etelä-Pohjanmaa). My father had small collection of handmade puukko's. Yet I've never heard anything of initiation by giving a puukko to-be adult of the family. --Sumiko 13:01, 28 January 2007 (UTC) (Suviko in fi-Wikipedia)

I also think the passage about "rite of passage" must be completely wrong. Actually, the only puukko I own I got as a kid (as soon as my parents thought me old enough to handle it safely) because I asked for it for Christmas (I used it when fishing and for some basic woodwork - making toy bows and such). This must be very outdated information, if it ever was true. It should be deleted. Also, what on earth is this? "Men's and women's puukkos do not significantly differ. The only difference is that women's puukkos are often shorter, may have decorated sheaths, and are better suited for working with foodstuffs." I never heard of there being men's and women's puukkos in the first place; I, for example, got a short and wide one because it was thought safer for a child. The phrase above may have been true sometime in the history - possibly - but surely has nothing to do with how people choose their puukko these days. It should be either deleted or modified if indeed there historically were different puukko for men and women. Shadowcrow 04:18, 5 September 2007 (UTC)

-There is no "rite of passage" per se, no flashy seremonies or anything but everyone i know of has a puukko and it was given to   him/her as a gift (most of the time from parents). Usually it was accompanied by a speech of "how he/she is now old enough to safely own a puukko". In my case, my father gave me the puukko and the speech was "hopefully your not dumb enough to cut yourself". I say there is a deep rooted "rite of passage" in the giving of puukko, but surely most of the finns have been given a puukko in the early age with the same kind of speech. Most of the traditions here are as straightforward anyway -Random Knife Junkkari


 * "Rite of passage" might be too much, but what about the national costumes in some (all?) parts of Finland, where costume includes a puukko on your belt? I remember getting my first costume, which I hated, but which also had a tiny little puukko in its scabbard on the belt. Its dull blade was about 3cm long. :) Jedku —Preceding comment was added at 21:28, 12 June 2008 (UTC)

I've just removed several very dubious-seeming paragraphs from the article, having failed to verify the facts presented. If I'm wrong, my sincere apologies, and please cite your sources! --Kizor 00:50, 5 January 2006 (UTC)

The (absence of) guard talk is BS. The handle shaping and in some cases the end design (esp in leuku) makes the knife very reliable and easy to handle. Even when wet and under water (say, peeling potatos). The only reason guards have been ever added is "women's versions" for people who are scared of the real design and/or can't trust themselves to handle it.

The correct length for the blade is about the width of the user's palm. Err on less, not more as the current fashion sadly seems to do. Woodworkers especially favour shorter blades down to 3cm or so. This happens to hit close to the handle length in the longest version (setting aside the larger leuku).

An important quintessential remark is that puukko is a product of the way of thinking that perfection is not attained when there is nothing to add, but when there is nothing more to take away. It is extremely simplified and the remaining features in the pure forms are supremely utilitarian.

Unfortunately, again, the modern culture is trying to add all kinds of flashiness into the models trying to attract more users. The plain austere models can't sell at high premiums or high volumes, so market-driven makers go for either flashy or cheap.

Want sources? http://puukkosivut.net has fair quality info on many things.

213.216.199.10 21:10, 20 June 2006 (UTC)

I removed this: "The puukko has also given the root for Finnish language verb puukottaa 'to stab'." The verb "puukottaa" does not translate as "to stab" but "to stab with a knife". To my knowledge you can say "to stab with a fork/stick/scissors" in English, but you can not translate it as "puukottaa haarukalla/kepillä/saksilla". It would translate back to English as "to use a knife to stab with scissors" or something like that. Instead you can say "pistää haarukalla/kepillä/saksilla" which would literally translate as "to sting with a fork/stick/scissors".

You can say you "stab somebody with scissors" as "puukottaa saksilla". All native speakers understand it. I would certainly use it. --Sumiko 13:01, 28 January 2007 (UTC)

I don't think the term "all native speakers would understand" really count's anything. I'd find it rather weird choice of words if ie. local newspaper had a headline "miestä puukotettiin haarukalla" (man was puukotettu with a fork). Usually the headline is "Lyötiin haarukalla" (was hit with a fork). The term Puukottaa definately means it was done with a puukko or knife. as a rather lousy comparison: you can say in english "I ate pig's meat" since everyone would understand what it means but it would be more correct to say "i ate pork". —Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.250.33.140 (talk) 15:40, 14 December 2007 (UTC)

It might be worthwhile to point out that, where in English the normal word for knifing (e.g. in a fight) would, in Finnish this would indeed be "puukottaa"; this is an interesting cultural fact. Certainly the word does tnot work the same way as the English word "stab", but then words rarely work in exactly the same way in different languages. I think the word "puukottaa" can be included by all means, only we need to translate and/or explain it in a way that makes it clear what exactly the meaning of the word is - normally "to stab with a knife" or, even better, "to knife"! Shadowcrow 04:18, 5 September 2007 (UTC)

By the way, should there be some brief mention of puukko being used in Finland historically also as a weapon in fights, giving rise to the word "puukkojunkkari" in late 19th century Southern Ostrobothnia? I do think one of the clichés of Finnishness is getting drunk on moonshine and fighting with puukkos (the other clichéd weapon being the axe). Shadowcrow 04:29, 5 September 2007 (UTC)

I have my doubts about this article. For one, I don't think what people remember today determines what traditions were in effect a couple of generations ago. For example, in the US the puukko was given with some ceremony to teens, as a remembrance of Finnish ancestry. As for the meaning of "puukko," the widely held belief in the US follows this wiki entry: http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/puukko   diogenes99 15 September 2009  —Preceding undated comment added 14:01, 15 September 2009 (UTC).

I have added a citations needed template as citations are needed Trevey-On-Sea (talk) 06:09, 30 July 2019 (UTC)

tommi puukko
I've cut what seems to be purely puffery from www.kainuunpuukko.com or their friends. The facts I've left in I haven't referenced because they don't have very good sources:
 * http://guns.connect.fi/gow/QA10.html
 * http://www.britishblades.com/forums/showthread.php?87953-Big-Tommi-%28Anssi-150%29
 * http://www.nba.fi/sv/manadensfm_tommi (via Google Translate)
 * http://www.nba.fi/fi/kansatieteelliset_puukko (via Google Translate)

- convincing, but hardly encyclopedia quality! Oddly, the [|Finnish-language puukko article] is no help at all - seeming to refer only to knives in general, but http://www.puukkosivut.net/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t=842&highlight=tommi is a thread (in Finnish) asking what's so special about the Tommy/Tommi. - Snori (talk) 12:41, 18 April 2010 (UTC)

Scrimshaw

 * "The traditional material for the handle is birch. Also oak, ash, pine bark, horn (especially elk and reindeer), scrimshaw and bone are used." [emphasis added]

Scrimshaw is a process, not a material. Is, perhaps, walrus ivory or something similar intended here? Heavenlyblue (talk) 06:33, 13 January 2013 (UTC)

This may refer to the practice of decorating the handle with a pattern in thin inlaid silver wire, known particularly from Ostrobothnian models. Real scrimshaw, of course, involved filling patterns cut into a whitish material such as bone or ivory with a black medium. Some puukkos -- particularly those made in Lapland -- may have handles and sheaths made from reindeer antler and decorated with real scrimshaw. I would question the use of "pine bark" in puukko handles. Pine bark is too soft for such a use. What may actually be meant here is birch bark. A birch bark handle is made by compressing a large number of small discs or squares of birch bark with glue in between into a blank, which is then cut to shape when set. A birch bark handle is not quite as hard as a wooden one, but it is less slippery and good to hold when, e.g., a combination of good control and high pressure is needed. It also looks quite nice and is less liable to split.--Death Bredon (talk) 16:06, 28 July 2016 (UTC)

Merger proposal
I propose that puukko be merged into Sami knife. I think that the content in the puukko article can easily be explained in the context of Sami knife, and the Sami knife article is of a reasonable size that the merging of puukko will not cause any problems as far as article size or undue weight is concerned.
 * Kortoso (talk) 18:27, 5 January 2017 (UTC)

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The finka knife
Popular in the Russian underworld? In Poland, for decades the "finka" has been a part of standard equipment of scouts in their outdoor activities. 89.78.169.249 (talk) 09:26, 5 November 2022 (UTC)