Talk:Quentin Kawānanakoa

Untitled
Despite of perhaps presented claims, the Kawananakoa do not descend from the Kamehameha dynasty. Actually, Kamehameha dynasty went extinct in 1884, there is no known descendant left.

Kawananakoa descend from a first cousin of Kalakaua and from a sister of Kalakaua's queen - which facts may make them sort of collateral line of Kalakaua dynasty - or then not. However, there is additionally a big question mark in actual descent, as David Kawananakoa did not recognize his wife's first child as his own, and if she was not David's biological child, then there seems to be no descent through which Quentin could be of Kalakaua's relations. 217.140.193.123 20:08, 10 July 2005 (UTC)


 * Prince Quentin's father was Edward Kawananakoa who was the son of Abgail Kawananakoa who was the daughter of Prince David Kawananakoa. through Prince David kawananakoa's father, David Pi'ikoi, prince kawananakoa is the grandson of kekahili, daughter of kamokuiki. kamokuiki is the mother of kapa'akea who is the father of the last monarchs. there you have it. yes, the kawananakoa lineage is a collateral line of the kalakaua's. their common anscestor was liliuokalani's and kalakaua's grandmother. mahalo 808Poiboy (talk) 18:54, 17 November 2023 (UTC)


 * This unfounded claim that Abigail Kapiolani Kawananakoa was illegitimate seems to be rooted in her omission from her father's will, but he did this and explained it was because she was legally adopted by her maternal grandmother Abigail Kuaihelani Campbell and was going to inherit part of her wealth under Hawaii Territorial laws. In the same legal statement linked, he list her as one of his three children. KAVEBEAR (talk) 05:24, 18 November 2023 (UTC)
 * I see that. it is interesting that people think that she was an illegitimate child in general. I have heard about his will before. the house of kamakahelei and house of la'anui-wilcox-salzar uses the will against quentin for reasonable and legitimate reasons when deciding "which house would rule hawai'i if and when restored again". the will states that she's NOT IN THE LINE OF SUCCESSION when it comes to headship. (I have read this further. though it was Abigail campbell who adopted princess kekau, prince david apparently mentions accepting kekau as his adopted because he says "my wife and I have this daygiven in adoption). sadly in this specific newsletter I cannot find where he says that quinten Kawananakoa's grandmother is not allowed to inherite the right to succession but it is true. this is trubelsome but as I said this prince Quinten's cousin, he is still an ali'i nui, and we must honor that. especially with such a lineage which I am proud to be related to. how I am related is sadly not too publicly known about, but I am trying to slowly reverse that. there is a lot more first cousins then the kawananakoa's to the kalakaua family. proud to be one of them. mahalo 808Poiboy (talk) 05:41, 18 November 2023 (UTC)
 * The 1908 will adjustment refers to Quentin’s grandmother Abigail Kapiolani not Kekau who was not born yet. Abigail Kapiolani was adopted by her grandmother Mrs. Abigail Campbell and Kekau was adopted by her grandmother Abigail, the Princess David Kawananakoa. There has been multiple adoptions in the family. KAVEBEAR (talk) 09:59, 18 November 2023 (UTC)
 * wait Abigail was also adopted? that could be a problem in the line of succession. I have gone through the campbell-maipinepine lineage, and the ali'i genealogy is sadly quite weak. maybe they knew something that the rest of hawai'i lost. who knows. if only the adoptions were made by prince kawananakoa. that would be a very very strong hanai. there geneologies are probably the purest I have seen in modern times. 808Poiboy (talk) 17:25, 18 November 2023 (UTC)

The intro of this page reads:

Quentin Kawananakoa, formally Quentin Kuhio Kawananakoa (September 28, 1961- ), is the current head of the House of Kawananakoa and holds the title of prince and heir to the throne of the Kingdom of Hawai'i.

Saying that Kawananakoa "holds" the title of prince and heir to the throne of the Kingdom of Hawaii is pushing POV, IMO. It implies that the title held is an official style rather than a personal style. Thus, I'm changing the wording of the intro to replace "holds" with the less POV word "claims." &#38738;&#12356;(Aoi) 10:30, 23 July 2005 (UTC)

Could someone please clarify what college Kawananakoa attended? Thank you, &#38738;&#12356;(Aoi) 08:33, 3 August 2005 (UTC)

Besides that, could someone cite this article's sources? Thanks, 青い(Aoi) 09:45, 11 December 2005 (UTC)

Is it just me or does this scream 'vanity edit'? Rex 21:03, 27 March 2006 (UTC)

Not actually a vanity edit. This guy after all is a pretender of a fallen monarchy - such tend to have articles in WP as well as in other extensive encyclopedias. Cf e.g Louis Alfonso, Duke of Anjou. On the other hand, the content (which might be vanity if left to writing by supporters) is currently rather neutral. Of course, everyone should watch the contents, since articles of this sort of issues tend to become POV battlegrounds. 217.140.199.142 14:07, 20 April 2006 (UTC)

Major rewrite
I recently reread over this article and noted that this article seems to treat his (legally unrecognized status) as heir to the Hawaiian throne as being more important than his very notable political career. Of course, his status as a pretender to the Hawaiian throne is very notable, however, I think this article should also emphasize his work as a politician. I'm currently working on a rewrite of this article, which I will post here when ready. Any comments and feedback would be greatly appreciated. 青い(Aoi) 08:21, 9 June 2006 (UTC)

Once again
One MUST be careful about using the title "recognized" with a royal title, such as was done in this aection: In September 1995, Kawananakoa married Barbados native Elizabeth Broun. They had their first child in June 1996, Kincaid Kawananakoa. In December 1999, the couple had another child, Riley Kawananakoa. Both became recognized with the title of prince.

Recognized by whom? Certainly not the State of Hawaii or the U.S.. Perhaps a european or african or asian royal family? Maybe the king of Tonga, the last Polinesian monarch. Unfortunately we aren't told.

Contrary to popular belief, the US constitution doesn't prohibit citizen's from holding noble or royal titles. However, it does phohibit certain people from holding them. It is possible that this might apply to a member of the Hawaii State Legislature. It would certainly apply to a US senator, thus I doubt that Mr. Kawananakoa actively claims the title of prince these days, if ever. One would doubt his ability to pass on a title he doesn't claim.

I'm sure you own items that you haven't used for sometime, however they still remain your possession. He could publicly renounce it, but he hasn't. So used or not it is still there. My family does not use their titles in day to day dealings or introductions, however they remain. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.235.3.239 (talk) 01:43, 29 July 2011 (UTC)

True, but he said once in an interview (sorry I don't have the source handy) that he neither uses nor rejects the title of prince. It's a sensitive point. If he had said "Dont call me Prince under any set of circumstances", he'd be disrespecting the Hawaiians as a people, to whom this genealogical stuff is quite important. It's a sensitive matter, you see---one of his recent predecessors, Abigail Kawananakoa, acted a lot more like a pretender (was very commonly called "The Princess", was mostly known as patroness of a bunch of charities, etc.); another, Edward Kawananakoa, also commonly called Prince, I remember once participating in a bigtime ceremony on the grounds of Iolani Palace also attended by the Head of State of Western Samoa and the King of Tonga and the pretender to the throne of Tahiti; ergo, I think it would be impossible for Quentin Kawananakoa to renounce entirely the wearing of the "Head of the House of Hawaii" hat. On the other hand, Hawaiian royalists have in fact commonly expressed disapproval of the degree to which this family, not just Quentin, is involved in partisan politics (the Republican Party).
 * Exactly. It can be argued that his first cousin once removed Abigail Kinoiki Kekaulike Kawānanakoa, is going to be the last of the Kawananakoa's to act like a royal. He as aspiring policitian cannot actually publicly endorse his royal status, but he can't disrespect the Hawaiian community which still view his family as the living representatives of the former monarchy. Whenever their is a parade, a national leader visiting Hawaii, or special event or anniversary at the Iolani Palace, one of his family members, alongside the governor of Hawaii, will be there since they are the closest relatives of King Kalakaua and Queen Liliuokalani. His aunt, who married an Italian aristrocrat, was invited to an event hosted for a Japanese prince and princess. However the younger generation might be losing the attitude and treatments of the earlier generations.--KAVEBEAR (talk) 01:07, 2 August 2013 (UTC)

The Constitution doesn't prohibit people from HOLDING titles of nobility, or even from ACCEPTING titles of nobility from foreign governments; it prohibits Congress or the States from GRANTING such titles, and it prohibits any person holding a Federal or State office from accepting a title or emolument from a foreign prince without the consent of Congress. By custom, however, it is assumed that such titles have no legal standing under US or State law. Tom129.93.65.230 (talk) 04:19, 27 September 2008 (UTC)

Kawananakoa's political career
Yes, this article gives Mr. Kawananakoa's political career short shrift! We have no idea from this article what issues he ran for Congress on, which is a pity because some of them, for example his strong support for President Bush in regard to the Iraq war, may have contributed to his defeat in famously liberal Hawaii!

It is hardly appropriate to put the word "prince" in front of his name when one is giving election statistics--the number of votes he received in the 2006 Republican primary, for example. In some other contexts it's perfectly appropriate, as for example when one is calling attention to his position as Head of the House of Hawaii ("pretender" or "heir to the throne", if you insist). Certainly he has a role in the Hawaiian community that has to do with his ancestry, and presumably he's proud of it. But that is, as the saying goes, a different hat he wears. He sure as anything doesn't call himself Prince Kawananakoa on his election campaign website, and if he did he'd be making a fool of himself. Nope. The campaign site, after introducing him, calls him plain "Quentin".

Mr. Kawananakoa may be a "pretender" technically speaking, but there's a world of difference between the life he lives and the way men like Leka of Albania, or the grandson of Haile Selassie, or Urberto of Italy, or the Count of Paris carry themselves. The one thing a serious claimant to any lapsed throne NEVER does is to run for a partisan political office! These guys consider such things utterly beneath their dignity. Some of Mr. Kawananakoa's immediate predecessors as Head of the House of Hawaii did act very much like royal pretenders--one thinks of Abigail Kawananakoa, who served as chair of Friends of Iolani Palace, was usually referred to as "the Princess", and made history by infamously sitting on Liluokalani's throne for a photograph and later saying "I can sit anywhere I want." That's not Quentin Kawananakoa by any means.

Other posts here are correct in asking "recognized as prince" by whom? The head of the House of Hawaii is often called Prince So-and-so or Princess So-and-so. It's an informal social title applied to the descendants of Hawaiian royalty, and it has no legal standing; U.S. citizens can't have actual legal titles of nobility and royalty---not Quentin Kawananakoa, not "Princess" Lee Radziwill, not anybody. Tom129.93.17.139 19:48, 29 April 2007 (UTC)


 * Exactly. It can be argued that his first cousin once removed Abigail Kinoiki Kekaulike Kawānanakoa, is going to be the last of the Kawananakoa's to act like a royal. He as aspiring policitian cannot actually publicly endorse his royal status, but he can't disrespect the Hawaiian community which still view his family as the living representatives of the former monarchy. Whenever their is a parade, a national leader visiting Hawaii, or special event or anniversary at the Iolani Palace, one of his family members, alongside the governor of Hawaii, will be there since they are the closest relatives of King Kalakaua and Queen Liliuokalani. His aunt, who married an Italian aristrocrat, was invited to an event hosted for a Japanese prince and princess. However the younger generation might be losing the attitude and treatments of the earlier generations.--KAVEBEAR (talk) 01:07, 2 August 2013 (UTC)


 * "The one thing a serious claimant to any lapsed throne NEVER does...": consider Simeon Saxe-Coburg-Gotha for an extreme counterexample (he not only ran for office, he served). And he's not unique in running. See also Paul-Philippe Hohenzollern. - Jmabel | Talk 21:31, 28 April 2008 (UTC)

I stand corrected. I should have said SELDOM rather than NEVER. Yes, there are counterexamples. In addition to the ones cited by Jmabel, I should have thought of Louis Napoleon Bonaparte, a.k.a. Napoleon III. And while I'm not sure whether or not Dr. Otto von Hapsburg (for example) has ever been a candidate for elective office, it would not amaze anybody if he were to become one. (Come to think of it, Jonah Kalanianaole, though not a pretender, didn't exactly renounce all the perks of royalty and might have qualified as a borderline semi-exception.) My carelessness on that point deserves a slap on the hand at least. Tom129.93.65.230 (talk) 04:00, 27 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Otto van Hapsburg is, as his Wikipedia states, "a former member of the European Parliament for the Christian Social Union (CSU) party." --Mikedelsol (talk) 07:38, 21 December 2008 (UTC)

I've changed the introduction to make his royal status come second after his political career. The article body itself has little to nothing to say about his royal status.--KAVEBEAR (talk) 01:19, 2 August 2013 (UTC)

Compare Akahi Nui article
Seems to me the tone of this article is very different from that of Akahi Nui. I think the problem is probably there, not here. It starts right out with Quentin Kawānanakoa being called a "claimant" while Akahi Nui is called a "pretender". Both terms are equally valid for either, but "claimant" has more positive connotations. In any case, though, I'd expect the two to be handled more or less symmetrically.

I don't know the topic well. I came to this by way of WP:BLP issues in the Akahi Nui article. It would be much appreciated if someone who is working on this and has no ax to grind might come look at that other article as well. - Jmabel | Talk 21:26, 28 April 2008 (UTC)


 * I have now edited the Akahi Nui article to also use the term "claimant", and added each article as a "see also" in the other. - Jmabel | Talk 03:10, 19 May 2008 (UTC)

The difference with Akahi Nui is that if you meet him, he introduces himself as The King of Hawai'i, while Quentin Kawānanakoa does not use a title. However, above and beyond all this is the way Hawai'i establishes the King or Queen. They are chosen by the ruler and approved by the House of Nobles. Since both are currently absent, this would only affect one, Akahi Nui, as his title of King is self-given, while Prince Kawānanakoa's title is birthright. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.235.3.239 (talk) 01:30, 29 July 2011 (UTC)

removing POV tag with no active discussion per Template:POV
I've removed an old neutrality tag from this page that appears to have no active discussion per the instructions at Template:POV:
 * This template is not meant to be a permanent resident on any article. Remove this template whenever:
 * There is consensus on the talkpage or the NPOV Noticeboard that the issue has been resolved
 * It is not clear what the neutrality issue is, and no satisfactory explanation has been given
 * In the absence of any discussion, or if the discussion has become dormant.

Since there's no evidence of ongoing discussion, I'm removing the tag for now. If discussion is continuing and I've failed to see it, however, please feel free to restore the template and continue to address the issues. Thanks to everybody working on this one! -- Khazar2 (talk) 23:49, 20 June 2013 (UTC)

Descent
How do we know he is of Singaporean and Australian descent?--KAVEBEAR (talk) 04:13, 31 July 2013 (UTC)
 * They were added in these edits.--KAVEBEAR (talk) 04:17, 31 July 2013 (UTC)
 * I removed them because I see no source for it. His mother Carolyn Willison Branch was from Pennsylvania and grandfather Andrew Anderson Lambert was born in Honolulu while all other ancestors were Hawaiian or mixed Hawaiian with English and Irish blood.--KAVEBEAR (talk) 04:23, 31 July 2013 (UTC)

Hale o na Alii o Hawaii
I think he may be the Regent of the Hale o na Alii o Hawaii (House of Chiefs of Hawaii), founded by his grandmother Abigail Kapiolani Kawānanakoa, based the fact his float in the Kamehameha Day Parade preceded or led the group's float behind him.--KAVEBEAR (talk) 00:38, 2 August 2013 (UTC)
 * He is. I think the position reflects the headship of the family in Abigail Kapiolani Kawānanakoa's line, who was the first regent.--KAVEBEAR (talk) 02:28, 2 August 2013 (UTC)

who is 'he' in the last sentence?
It reads as if it is Riley, which is confusing, when it really means Quentin.--2607:FEA8:D5DF:F3D9:90A5:43E0:2661:3E2A (talk) 21:23, 20 April 2020 (UTC)