Talk:Ragnarok Online/Archive 1

Correction
-Corrected the information about the HP level which causes death, based on this self-taken screenshot. - 24.103.188.189

Seperation of Anime from Game
-Ragnarok The Animation needs to be seperated from Ragnarok Online. While the anime is based on it, it should deserve its own entry as a stub to eliminate confusion. -Akosygin

Wow...lots of vandalism on this page
It really needs to be cleaned up (along with various spelling errors). Now, I don't play this game, so I can't really change much, but this article could certainly use a lot of work.Redizhot 21:37, 23 Jun 2005 (UTC)


 * I'm really scared with your comment. That's not wrong with the article at this moment. I recommend you to read Neutral point of view before post an personal point of view about private servers and copyrights infrigment. --Mateusc 15:38, 25 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Private servers earn themselves a bad name which needs to be rectified. There is no such thing as a "neutral point of view" [which is my point of view, of course] because a point of view which does not favor either side of an issue is favoring its own side [that which is neither side]. Just stating that private servers are bad but not to be hated on. If I were to go personal on private servers, I could bring in the fact that Gravity does fairly little regarding the private server issue, more than likely [here comes my point of view again] because if it were to shut down everyone private server on the 'net then half of its loyal subscribers would be gone. Most private server players have an account on iRO or other official servers just to help support Ragnarok Online and keep it alive. Then I could start questioning Gravity, LLC's (the American-located server, i.e. iRO) motives [who knows Gravity was being sued? "Law Offices Of Charles J. Piven, P.A. today announced that a securities class action was commenced on behalf of purchasers of the American Depository Shares ("ADSs") of Gravity Co., Ltd. (NASDAQ: GRVY) pursuant and/or traceable to the Company's Registration Statement/Prospectus issued in connection with the initial public offering of Gravity ADSs (the "IPO" or the "Offering"), together with those who purchased their shares on the open market between February 7, 2005 and May 12, 2005, inclusive (the "Class Period")."]


 * On the subject of law, it is important to note the difference between Gravity Corporation and Gravity Interactive, LLC. The former is the parent company and the latter is the child (wholy owned subsidary) company. This distinction is important in that while Gravity Corp. in South Korea is being sued, it does not have any direct affect to Gravity Interactive, LLC., as it is a distinct and seperate entity. It is similar in fact that while your father (or mother, basically parent) may be sued for something they did, it doesn't directly affect you, the child, as you aren't the one whom is going to be punished. Therefore, when Gravity Corporation is being sued, Gravity Interactive, LLC. has nothing to do with the parent company's actions (unless they had active involvement, in this case they did not). The bottom line is, the suit has nothing to do with the company's subsidiaries or their affiliates whom licensed the game from the parent company. The point is: when making any statements about the suit, it is important to not let the event spill over to where it is not supposed to go. -- Akosygin 06:31, 18 July 2005 (UTC)


 * Er, yes, but IMO the tone and language used there seem more than a little bit biased. Yueti 28 June 2005 15:26 (UTC)

Cities
Seems like people got some wrong informations. Kunlun is based on Taiwan, not China. I changed that. The fatal error is Umbala. Umbala is not part of Global project. The gobla projects are Amatsu, Kunlun, Louyang, and Ayothaya. Louyang is the third of the global project, not Umbala.


 * Feel free to make changes. If are incorrect informations, you can correct it. --Mateusc 19:21, 2 August 2005 (UTC)

__Linked up the rest of the cities following the CITY (Ragarok Online) format, which is a good idea for housekeeping btw, whoever did the first 3. I suggest the bare minimum of informaton on each city, such as that information which directly relates the the location of job class and guild functions. Other information (various quests for headgear, weapons, etc) would be better served elsewhere and is WAY outside the scope of this entry. Besides, Gravity Corporation will probably change it in teh future. i plan on fleshing this entry out over the next couple weeks, input would be appreciated

Category...
Well, now with Poring and Jellopy articles we really needs Category:Ragnarok Online. I'm too worried if someone resolves build a database here. Something seemed already was attemped with Pokedex and many RPG games and didn't obtained good reception of the community. An predefinition/more notable link for Ragnaguide would be better. --Mateusc 19:20, 2 August 2005 (UTC)

Umm, it's in lines of what's being said above, but, I see it painful that this page has "recommended stats" next to character description. This page isn't a guide for Gods sake, if you want to tell people what stats to put where, those belong in GameFaqs. I think notable skills or something would do better as to introducing the game. There are separate RO Wikis around too. -- Atlasia

Missing information from Conduct
In http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Ragnarok_Online&diff=30213686&oldid=30060223 it shows that 219.90.67.213 removed the entire "Conduct" section. Is this vandalism? (Dec 8)

I am re-adding the Conduct section since there seems to be no good reason to remove it. 66.92.144.74 13:16, 13 December 2005 (UTC)

Defence
I've added a small item about defence in the WoE section, But I'm not sure if the dmg is first reduced from equips and then from vit as I wrote or if it's the opposite. Could I have some help there? Raquel Sama 16:41, 14 December 2005 (UTC)

You are correct, according to RO Data Zone. (http://rodatazone.simgaming.net) 66.42.183.158 01:30, 6 January 2006 (UTC)

Suggested Stats?
Is this really needed? It makes this seem more like a strategy guide rather then a encyclopedia entry... not to mention some stats suggestions are wrong (for example, falconer hunters normally have INT, as it increases damage increased by the falcon). - 72.59.54.13 04:37, 8 January 2006 (UTC)

I agree, it's not necessary to go that far into detail about the classes. - Stoph 05:56, 8 January 2006 (UTC)

Agreed. Raquel Sama 17:20, 11 January 2006 (UTC)

Agreed. It is not necessary. -- S iva1979 Talk to me  10:09, 13 April 2006 (UTC)

Agreed; every time I try to remove the cruft, an IP address just adds it. I copyedited it before, but it's due again. &mdash; Deckill e r 11:12, 13 April 2006 (UTC)

Agi Description?
I had never heard that Agility reduces skill delay as stated in the entry, and several RO websites I checked - RODatazone in particular - make no mention of this. Can anyone confirm or deny this?

It depends on the skill- Cast time skills such as Fire Bolt, Agi Up, etc. are reduced by just DEX, no stat reduces the skill delay. However, some attacking skills like Bash, Double Strafe, etc. have skill delay in relation to your own ASPD, thus affected by AGI, while others like Magnum Break have fixed after-cast delays. Not sure where you could find verification for this on the web, though.

War of Emperium
I can nee that most of WoE section was deleted. Was that vandalism? Raquel Sama 18:15, 17 January 2006 (UTC)

I removed much info on WoE here. I don't think we should include every tidbit of info on WoE, just a general overview so players can understand what it's about. If they want to know in depth stuff like WoE restrictions or character builds they should check a Ragnarok website.... - Stoph 20:58, 17 January 2006 (UTC)

I understand your point of view, but I wrote that WoE section that big because I wanted the article to be as complete as possible. If the size was not proportional to the other sections, I think we should make the other articles bigger instead of shrinking the big ones. I won't put it back but please consider my opinion. A game as big as RO deserves a big article. Raquel Sama 17:55, 18 January 2006 (UTC)

Towns
I think towns should be moved into one article for all of them. They really aren't that important to have seperate articles about... - Stoph 04:21, 11 February 2006 (UTC)
 * Agreed. I just put a merge proposal up, but I think it may make the main article too cluttered. The same should apply to items, creatures, etc. Deckiller 01:43, 18 February 2006 (UTC)

Cost?
How is there no section or even mention in the article of how much the game costs to play? 66.131.51.64 20:33, 3 March 2006 (UTC)

Why bother, if one wishes to obtain finacial information about the game they can simply go to the site nad look at the prices. Also it would be too difficult to update when a price change comes up and it would make the article more of a advertisment of the game rather then giving information.--Link25 08:50, 6 March 2006 (UTC)

and the problem is the price is diffrent. iro and euro are cheaper then kro etc.

Add to that the fact that a fairly large amount of players play on free private servers Daedalin 03:38, 17 April 2007 (UTC)

Ninja and Gunslinger
I've added the ninja and gunslinger section, I've added the main stuff but I still need help improving it. Raquel Sama 21:07, 9 March 2006 (UTC)

-- Not that much to add right now since it's a new class, IMO. Added a little bit of stuff, but I'm not sure if the Spirit Spheres part I added fits the section, so if anyone doesn't like it, take it off. Keero 06:10, 11 March 2006 (UTC)

I added what I knew about the Ninja class, but I feel it may need a little stripping or further editing as it feels a bit bloated now.

More Ragnarok Online Screenshots
For the article to look nice,i suggest professionals upload at least 5 screenshots.its based on good display and helps people get a better printable version of this article,which i think is marvellous.In that case,3 more pics rather than the 2 is better?Well that leads to people who wants to help.Thanks for letting me give out my opinion - sniperz March 25,2006

Hm... yeah, article is in serious need of pics. I'll add some Raquel Sama 22:54, 25 March 2006 (UTC)

article of the day
Do you think ragnarok could be the article of the day? it would be nice Raquel Sama 22:10, 1 April 2006 (UTC)

Remove the Crusader picture?
Why don't we swap that private server Crusader picture with an official Ragnarok one? A lineup of all the 2-2 classes would look better then an ugly one like that. <_< Keero 23:28, 6 April 2006 (UTC)

hmm quite agree with what you said. originals are always the best for printing~

I've added that pic more like an example of private server, to make the article look more complete, since all the others screenshots are supposed to be official. If you want to delete, go ahead, but the article already has few pics to it's size, I would sugest adding a regular crusader screenshot, or, at least, replacing the actual one. Raquel Sama 14:18, 10 April 2006 (UTC)
 * Nothing wrong ith Prontera image, nothing of Private server is for illustration pourposes, ok?--Ragnarok Addict 10:05, 13 April 2006 (UTC)


 * Fine, I'll move it down to where to private server part is at. Keero 06:47, 14 April 2006 (UTC)
 * Why this "private paranoia"? The image is a prontera screenshot and illustrating the cities (Prontera) section. Nothing wrong with the image, only your personal paranoia looking for details that justify a "private server". For a simply encyclopedia reader (and you should consider this) the image where is it is perfect. Re-think your concept of wrong or right in Wikipedia, we not follow what personal opnions about Private servers, we follow Encyclopedia guidelines and has nothing wrong with image because is perfect illustration of Prontera. --Ragnarok Addict 01:44, 15 April 2006 (UTC)
 * One of the problems with the picture is how little people are in the city, they are selling GM gear (Balmung) and the sprites have wings.The real RO's don't sell that gear, doesn't have wings, and has a whole lot more people. If you want to put up a Screeny of Prontera, I suggest making a trial iRo character, and take one like that. More official, and we don't give off a false appearence of what the real RO's look like in-game (measely amount of characters makes people interested in paying 15 bucks a month for it? -_-). And I have no 'paranoia', I played both iRO and a private server for over 3 years. ;) Why don't we just A) Remove it the picture, B) Put it back near the private server section. Keero 04:37, 15 April 2006 (UTC)
 * Please, stop with this stupid private server statement. It is Prontera, the article is well illustrated. I uploaded image first and is Screenshot in-game fully fair use compilant. Your image violates the iRO Website Copyright: has no HUDs and no authorization for you publish here. --Ragnarok Addict 00:06, 18 April 2006 (UTC)

Sakray merge
Sakray is more like a definition than something needing its own article. Only separate again if there's enough content to make it worth. --ren 03:27, 11 April 2006 (UTC)

History - To do
--Ragnarok Addict 20:58, 13 April 2006 (UTC)
 * Tristan Kingdom
 * The History of Munak
 * The Turtles Island
 * Iggdrasil Tree

Prontera screenshot
Why do you insist on putting the image up again and again? It's not official, you can't have wings, no one sells Balmungs, and it's not a real representation of what the real RO's look like. I say we have both the official, and the private one, but the private one moved down towards private section, and just add that it's a glimpse of what a P. Server looks like. =/ Keero 13:17, 16 April 2006 (UTC)
 * In kRO you can yes, have wings. And what's a problem with Private server? People that are reading Wikipedia wants know what Prontera looks like, they doesn't care if are wings in official servers or not. This is a reality, million of people plays in Private servers. They have the same Prontera from Official Servers. My image shows the architeture of the houses, the street, the merchants and your image show only merchants covering all parts of the image. Another thing: do not delete link for OpenKore, VisualKore and modKorearticles. The fact that you doesnt like doesn't mean Wikipedia can't publish. --Ragnarok Addict 00:10, 18 April 2006 (UTC)


 * Millions play. Right. Try 10~20 thousand TOPS. And you CANNOT get wings in KRO, all of that is custom from the Emulator boards. Show me an official picture of players with wings and I'll believe you. ;) And showing a picture of what people CAN'T get is like showing them a hacked version of Windows. And I won't remove the bot links. I don't care anymore, trying to come to a comprise with you is like talking to a brick wall. Let people waste their 15 bucks. -_-) Keero 04:26, 18 April 2006 (UTC)
 * Be more open minded... private servers are a reality, no need to hide them... if forbidden things weren't supposed to be on wikipedia, why is there an article for pedophilia, lol? Raquel Sama 00:37, 20 April 2006 (UTC)
 * I agree. Information can be bad depeding of their bias and private server screenshot has nothing wrong IMHO. For good reasons, it shows the reality of 50% of Ragnarok gaming around the world. --Ragnarok Addict 16:03, 20 April 2006 (UTC)

It's still illegal, and violates the iRO Private policy, since the screenshots that are supposed to be representing ragnarok are not under Gravity's control. I'm not biased BTW, I run a private server and know where not to advertise, like a site that gives out information.

Downsize?
Since we are at 41kb, we should remove pieces or make some changes. Input would be appreciated. Keero 06:00, 19 April 2006 (UTC)
 * A) Make a town article with just the main towns in this article.
 * B) Remove the stats section and just add a very small description of each stat underneath the game Basics in bulleted fashion.
 * C) Merge both Basics and Level and Class together.
 * D) Slim down the Conduct section some.
 * E) Clean up the community links. (I'll get to that later though. Relisting in bulleted fashion.)
 * I think is already fine. If you see articles such as World of Warcraft you will complain that simply Kbyte size is not determinant factor to slim/cut the article. --Ragnarok Addict 16:04, 20 April 2006 (UTC)
 * Yeah, don't mess it up Raquel Sama 00:03, 22 April 2006 (UTC)

MMOGCHART.COM Reference
FTI, I've removed the reference to some 17 million total registered players for Ragnarok Online from my analysis page, so perhaps that section could be deleted. I honestly don't know what the worldwide total is currently; you could try downloading Gravity's last financial report.

TaeKwon Class
Who removed the info on Taekwon, Star Gladiator and Soul Linker? Please put it back up. - Luminarie 00:45, 15 June 2006 (UTC)

"mob-training" an offense?...
Leading a multitude of monsters to another player, to allow them to cast an area spell and destroy the group of monsters, known as mob-training

I find this point ridiculous. If there are no comments withing, say, 2-4 weeks, I will likely remove this from the article. --Ashanthalas 23:25, 7 August 2006 (UTC)

STATS
BRING BACK STATS. THAT WAS INFORMATIVE AND HELPFUL. SUM OF HUMAN KNOWLEDGE MY DICK.


 * It may be infomative and helpful, but it doesn't belong here. If you really need those stats you may try searching in the article's previous versions (accessible by clicking "history" tab on the top of the page when using default theme) .--Kakurady 10:58, 9 August 2006 (UTC)

Classes?
Whatever happened to the info on RO classes? Isn't that important as well or was the article too big as it is?

I concur. Isn't the classes the original draw of RO? Besides, people need new info on the new RO classes. -Izaak

I'm going to add the classes again and remove the stupid "offenses" section; you don't see OTHER wikipages with that kind of crap. Why is it that a simple game like Maple Story have such a thorough explanation for their classes and this game have absolutely none and instead have an extensive "offenses" section. When all other games pages such as Guild Wars forgo such trifle things.

I agree. More information should be provided for each class.

bias on an encyclopedia??? Omg thats wrong
There are however, a few long running servers that have been known to last, and these just show what Gravity COULD have accomplished if they had bothered to put in any real effort. Comparison of such servers and Gravity's can be likened to comparing a genuine product to a exceptionally poor knockoff of said product in terms of quality. The irony being that the knockoff has better quality than the original.

Above statement bias towards gravity and utterly bashing them. remove.


 * I reverted all edits by Question2 while I was at it. Incredibly POV, but there may have been one or two useful paragraphs. Feel free to check the history and work with them if possible. --R. Wolff 10:34, 22 August 2006 (UTC)

How is bias when this is the perfect truth? There ARE a few long running private servers with vastly better content than Gravity's servers. This is a fact. Also thank you for reverting back the changes, now we have a article nearly full of rubbish. What is this nonsense about people breaking the rules and getting banned? It is a well known fact that gravity nearly all of gravity's bans are botters using trial accounts or people doing blatant stuff like speedhack in towns. The article in its present form is full of lies, half-truths and contains nothing about actual gameplay conditions. -- Question2
 * Yes, because describing gameplay conditions, advantages and disadvantages of a game is a reviewer's job and belongs in a review, not in what is supposed to be an encyclopedia article. --R. Wolff 08:12, 24 August 2006 (UTC)

Poll to delete the worthless "Rules of Conduct"
On second thought, I decided to do this poll (to stop numerous influential people on this site from banning me simply because I ticked them off for not submitting to their rule).

The "Rules of Conduct" is something more for the websites in question to enforce. I do not think that it needs to be reinforced in wikipedia.

Furthermore, I believe the topic about "private servers" already is already discussed in some other title, or atleast separate it from this article. If I don't see any reaction withing four days I'm deleting it myself.

-User:Izaak, Lord of the Lotus Clan.

Okay, its been four days, I'm going to clean it up now.

-User:Izaak, Lord of the Lotus Clan.

Roles in WoE revision
I did an almost complete overhaul on the "Class Roles in War of Emperium" section. I felt it had too many POVs and colloquialisms. I've also added a few things in there based on my knowledge of the game. I'd like to know what people think of the changes.

Cheers.