Talk:Raven (DC Comics)

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Talk:Raven (comics)/Archive 1

Question About Animated Character's Biography
Okay, I've been noticing that someone keeps reediting a paragraph in the fictional character biography section about Raven's "romances" to say she has a close bond with Robin. Doesn't that count as posting shipper material? Especially considering the paragraph it's in and the way the sentance is worded? Also, shouldn't the notation about Raven's strange mental connection thing with Robin be under Powers and Abilities rather than fictional character biography? If someone can get back to me on that, I'd be very grateful. 71.96.41.209 01:02, 26 September 2007 (UTC)

Thank you to whoever reworded the article and fixed the problem with Raven's romances. It sounds much less shipper suggestive now. Can we please keep it that way? Thanks! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 207.181.11.62 (talk) 04:25, 1 November 2007 (UTC)

I prefer BBRAE more Nomsese (talk) 22:16, 21 March 2019 (UTC)

Merging the Articles
I don't know why the article was split, and I'm really annoyed that it was without discussion. There's way too much overlap between the two versions of Raven to warrant two articles. I'd remerge the articles myself if I knew how.D1Puck1T 17:03, 17 June 2006 (UTC)


 * Just copy/paste the content back and make the new page that was created a redirect back to the section. I definatly agree; there's a lot that can be edited out of the 'animated version' section to make it fit here. It does NOT warrant its own page. --InShaneee 15:16, 18 June 2006 (UTC)
 * I restored the animated section in the article and deleted that "relationship" header. Now, it's time to organize this. I will try to start with that mess about Raven's colors. --Neigel von Teighen 23:05, 18 June 2006 (UTC)
 * It would be nice to (perhaps) have a character profile thing for the Raven of the TV series as well as for the "original" Raven.  Also, it would be nice to make the "article" on the animated Raven rely less on the original one - as many of the younger readers are going to be familiar only with the TV series. --Tim4christ17 20:31, 12 July 2006 (UTC)
 * I personally think the characters are different enough to warrant separate articles. If anyone wants me to, I'll help move the animated Raven out and make Raven (television) (only in architectural design, I'm not a fan of the TV show). --User:TalonTheater


 * I'm with Talon. Things that go for the animated Raven does not go for the Comics Raven. Their characters are wholly different in terms of personality, powers and costume. This article seems cluttered and splitting them would make it less so... Takuyar 09:50, 31 December 2006 (UTC)


 * This has been discussed on several of the Teen Titans pages on several occasions, and the results have always been that they need to remain together. --InShaneee 13:50, 31 December 2006 (UTC)


 * It just seems really cluttered adding the animated Raven, especially when you keep in mind that the animated Raven just has alot of fans randomly coming on to add info.. And most of the readers who stumble upon this article are probably looking for information on the animated series' Raven, not the comic Raven. Takuyar 15:45, 31 December 2006 (UTC)


 * I think that's where we need to start; by paring down and patrolling that section. --InShaneee 20:30, 31 December 2006 (UTC)


 * I agree that with the person who agree with Talon. I think we should separate animated, comic, and real-life raven — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mariocartlover (talk • contribs) 17:48, 4 February 2021 (UTC)

Tags
I think that there are a number of obvious factual errors and inconsistencies in the article so I decided to double the tags so that someone will see it and fix it before it gets ANY worse. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.34.123.91 (talk • contribs) 21:14 July 13, 2006
 * Please never do that again. It didn't do anything except make the article look worse. --Chris Griswold 08:42, 14 July 2006 (UTC)

That was me
Fine, but this article is very, very poorly-researched and written. I can't go for more than a sentence without running into an inconsistency or a "fact" that is little more than hypothesizing and conjecture.

For example, look at this line:

In season three's episode "Spellbound", Raven dons her white attire as a result of her being attracted to the wizard Malchior.

This line implies that the sole reason for her white robes was that she was attracted to Malchior, when the episode itself strongly stipulates that she wears whites whenever she is in a particularly positive and happy mood. I find that this statement, along with all the others surrounding it, is very very inarticulate and clumsy. Personally, if this is the kind of sloppy, incompetent work that is put into Teen Titans articles then maybe tehy shouldn't be wrtten at all. I mean, what kind of garbage is that? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Smith Jones (talk • contribs) 20:19 July 16, 2006


 * Maybe you should put your energy into improving the article rather than insulting the people who have worked on it. CovenantD 00:27, 17 July 2006 (UTC)


 * Seriously, dude. You seem really into this, so fix it. Also, please sign your comments. --Chris Griswold 01:29, 17 July 2006 (UTC)


 * I might try to clean that up, along with all the articles on the animated Raven. I agree it's sloppy there but we should try to edit it if we can post on the talk page. Takuyar 14:58, 31 December 2006 (UTC)

When Raven gets powerful in the t.v show, she has a white costume. Malichor gives her a power up-if you will- and thats why she has white.Legolad3451 17:50, 16 February 2007 (UTC)Legolad3451

Powers Section
I've put in a list of the powers that where used either once or rarely. For reference: teleportaion (Go!), time manipulation (Birthmark), precognition (forgot the episode), rapid healing (Beast Within), magic spells (duh), creation of monsters (Fear Itself).

To CovenantD: If you want to revert my edit you MUST tell my why! I`m putting it back in.

To CovenantD: You've reverted it TWICE! Both times without telling me why. That is a violation of Wkipedia policy.


 * Now that it doesn't read like a 5 year old wrote it from memory... CovenantD 04:07, 1 September 2006 (UTC)


 * HUH?!! It's exactly the same as when I first created it!!!

I've heard from many sources that in the animated series Raven is seen several times to phase through solid objects. Could someone please tell me an episode in which she does this so I can include it in the "Other Powers" scetion? 200.31.197.194 21:29, 24 October 2006 (UTC)

This section is an eyesore. It takes up half the Contents box, making it harder to navigate the article. I do think most of what's there is notable, but does every individual power need its own section? Is there no way to organize it better?D1Puck1T 07:48, 9 November 2006 (UTC)

Didn't she also perform Telepathy (in the animated series) when she entered Robin's mind in Haunted? DCincarnate


 * I would rather think of demonic possesion in that case (remeber where does Raven come from), but maybe also Telepathy. --Neigel von Teighen 13:54, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

Perhaps the soul-self power should be linked to the Etheric_body wiki page, as that page is more explanatory Arqueware (talk) 17:10, 1 September 2015 (UTC)

OR?
In the Mantra (Animated) section there is are a couple paragraphs beginning one theory holds that sounds like WP:OR or speculation. Do people feel tehre is enough support to keep it in the article? RJFJR 20:26, 29 August 2006 (UTC)


 * Hmph. Not really. There seems to be a lot of that, though, in relation to the animated version. ACS (Wikipedian); Talk to the Ace. See what I've edited. 20:32, 29 August 2006 (UTC)

Speeking of her mantra someone states that metrion means state of mind or calm,relaxe but if so then what language is it

It isn't really a language, just something made up by writer/creators of the animated series. Should the article be edited to reflect the theories as Fan Theories to show that it's speculation? --Takuyar 15:29, 31 December 2006 (UTC)

Time
Raven latest mini series seid to start in september but is that this year or the next, we need to put that in there so people arent making idots of them selfs

TNTT, Wolfman's Run
This article needs to contain more information on Marv Wolfman's run of The New Teen Titans, as that's where she was created and used best/most often. I'm working on that at the moment. - Talon

Umbrakinesis?
What in the world is Umbrakinesis?--Dil 23:29, 7 October 2006 (UTC)
 * Control over shadows. --InShaneee 23:42, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

Shouldn't the Umbrakinesis power tag be removed? Raven's powers are classified as Teleportation and Telekineses. The shadow/darkness aura in the animated is most possibly just an aura and coloured representation of her moving the objects, just like Jean Grey in X-Men: Evolution, not a power of hers. And from articles I've seen on umbrakinesis, it's more of a psuedo fictional power than real. Takuyar 14:52, 31 December 2006 (UTC)

Talon's update log
I'm going to be working on this article over the course of the next week or so, so I'm going to add here any changes/additions I make. Feel free to reword or correct my edits if I'm wrong.

- Added Flight to abilities list.

- Added Limited Precognition to abilities list.

- Added this paragraph to Character History:


 * Raven's chronology is typically separated into three lives; her first life, 20 years, was spent in the Temple Azarath and creating The New Teen Titans. Her second life began once she started wearing the garb of White Raven, and lasted under two years. Her third life, which started in issue #3 of The Teen Titans III, is her current form; unlike the transition between her first and second lives, with her third life came a new body, that of a 18-year old.

- One thing I want to get across is that Raven is not a moody character due to her personality, but simply because her heritage demands that she remain emotionally stable. She herself is not dark, but her origins are. Going to change that first sentence now.
 * Original sentence: "A dark, moody character, Raven is the half-breed daughter of a human mother named Arella and the demon Trigon."
 * Updated sentence: "A character with morbid past and origins, Raven is the half-breed daughter of a human mother named Arella and the interdimensional demon Trigon."

- Added Give Emotion to abilities list.
 * Changed it to Force Emotion because if she is utililizing this ability, the reciever doesn't have a choice but to feel what she wants them to feel.

- I think the main page picture should be one representing Raven in her most well-known outfit, as opposed to the current one. This sketch by Mike McKone was on the issue #8 cover, so it is legal to add here (and is on many web sites legally); and while George Perez's and Mckune's designs have subtle differences, Mckune's sketch should be used simply because it was done in the modern age of comics, with more precise detail in the artwork:

Image:RavenTitans08.jpg

- Added this image to "Infinite Crisis and 'One Year Later.'":



- Added spacers in the Character History article to represent and separate her three lives.

- Changed SuperheroBox to include "flight."

- Added this to "Infinite Crisis and 'One Year Later:'"


 * It will take place during the missing year.


 * Raven has also appeared as a minor character in "52" issues #1 (art only) and #21 (art and dialogue).

- Edited the SuperheroBox to comment that Arella is not deceased, but merged with the Souls of Azarath (and Danny Chase) to make the current Phantasm (who is in comic limbo at the moment, but apparently is in "New Azarath," a la hints from TTT #35-39).

- Added this image to the Powers section:

Image:RavensPowersTNTT07.jpg

- Added this image to Raven's First Life:

Image:EvilRavenToT.jpg

- Added "Absent during Crisis on Infinite Earths":


 * Between the periods that we know to be Raven's first and second lives, Raven's whereabouts were unknown even to The Monitor, a character who has knowledge of all beings in all parallel dimensions that contain Earth. This suggests that during this period, Raven transcended Earth for a non-parallel dimension. Raven was briefly mentioned in one frame (Issue #2, page 22), suggested as an alterative to Psycho Pirate as an empath in the Monitor's plans. She was also mentioned as an alternative for the Anti-Monitor in Issue #5, page 2).

- Added the "interviews" section with these three:


 * MacDONALD: Raven's powers are very vague.


 * WOLFMAN: Not to me. She's the empath who can cure some illnesses, some problems. She can't cure death, or any major disease. She failed when trying to cure the Russian Starfire's girl friend. If it's small pains or hurts at least she can cure them, but it affects her. She can move through dimensions, which is the effect of teleportation


 * MacDONALD: How far can she go with that?


 * WOLFMAN: I would say about 100 miles. That's about it. We really haven't played with it or have her go more than 10 miles at any given point. But I'd say 100 is about the most. But it's not really teleportation, I was trying to get away from that. If Raven comes from an inter-dimensional place, I wanted to play on her origin. What else can she do? Her soul-self, that's the part of her that's Trigon, her father, the evil part of her, and that's also the part that's the aggressor, the one that actually stops all the villains. She's not able herself to fight. But the soul self does most of that for her, because it has all her aggressive tendencies.


 * MacDONALD And just what happens to those people when they get inside there?


 * WOLFMAN: Usually they are either sent away, teleported away, or they fall down and faint, or she learns something from them.


 * MacDONALD: lt's nor very nice in there is it?


 * WOLFMAN: No. It's awful (laughter]. In fact, in issue #29,1 believe, because of what happens to the Brotherhood of Evil, the character Phobia who sets up her greatest fear - she sees Kid Flash as her father and the soul self goes after Kid Flash and virtually kills him. Raven's not very happy about that.


 * The Art of Raven (George Perez)


 * "Raven is very angular, very high cheekbones, very straight-nosed, with an upper lip slightly larger than her lower lip, and, of course, an incredibly large forehead. "


 * "Raven has developed, recently, a dancer's body in which her breasts have gotten smaller. I gave Raven a body based on a young lady, Fran McGregor, who's built with a very attractive dancer's body. She goes to the same school as my wife, Carol."


 * Developing Raven (George Perez)


 * "I'd like so deal with she religious aspects of her. She was a high priestess, so she has a certain feeling toward religion. She probably even disagrees with a lot of it. I guess after doing Wonder Woman for so long, religion is something I've come to understand more. I was dealing with somebody who I had to infuse with a religious belief based on some things I did not know about. I've never been a Pagan."


 * "I'd like so deal more with Raven's mother. What was her mother's real name? I figure it's not Arella, as that was the name she took. Does Raven have any other relatives? Where is her mother now? One thing we'd like so deal with in the Titans-and Raven is a part of it as is Joey, although most of the others have shown is already-is sex. To her, sex is rape. She grew up with that, constantly reminded her entire life that she was a child of a rape. A thing like that can scar someone. I'd like so work a little more on investigating her rationale. It's not unusual. There have been lots of children who have had to go through that, but in this case we have Raven, who was not only the child of a rape, but was the daughter of a demon who tried to destroy everybody and corrupted her!"


 * "Now that she doesn't have that influence, maybe she'd like to have a relationship, but it will always stop when sex becomes involved. It's something she cannot handle. Realize that a woman like that, to give up her virginity, is would have to be someone she could trust so implicitly that that memory of a rape could be eradicated, or at least ignored. Bus having seen so many other people, including Titans, go through relationships that were more frivolous or hurt when the break-up occurred, it's not going so be easy for Raven to open up so someone that way."


 * "Things like that, and other investigations into Raven's personality, will be fascinating. Having done so many female characters from Wonder Woman and the Titans, that type of delving into the female psyche I find fascinating, particularly when there are certain things that no man can really identify with. Even if a man was the child of a rape, he would not have so worry about himself being caught pregnant, even if he were raped. Raven's is a totally different point of view, and I look forward to delving into that."


 * "If more men would try to understand that, that would be the only way to truly understand why a woman would take such pride in the things that make her unique. It would explain what happens when we as a male species corrupt that, violate that. It's like someone coming in and cutting off our penises. We don't know what we've lost until we've lost it. Virginity is something that a woman either treasures or abandons as quickly as she wants to, but it should always be her choice to do so. When a man takes away that choice I can imagine that it is an incredible violation of one of the things that makes women feel unique."


 * Raven Mini-Series


 * NEWSARAMA: Now you are working on a Raven mini-series, what it the story about?


 * Marv Wolfman: Emotionally, it's about a young girl who has found herself reborn in a new body and is trying to figure out her place in life. Story wise it picks up on the bit in the recent Titans Annual that I came up with that shows Raven getting an unexplained influx of emotions and what they do to her. It also asks where they come from and how it will affect her and everyone else in San Francisco. It deals with her new life in school and establishes the new parameters for her character. And it takes an old DC villain and completely changes him.


 * NRAMA: Is Raven still one of your favorite characters?


 * MW: She always has been. Still is.


 * NRAMA: What is it about Raven that strikes a chord with you?


 * MW: More than any of the other Titans, her rich and detailed origin allows me to get into a very complex character. There are lots of levels to her that make her fascinating to explore. I wish, I could replicate that with new characters, but some characters seem to be created just right and there's no knowing why, or duplicating it. I see endless possibilities with Raven that don't always exist in other characters, even ones I've created. Her stories flow from her origins and character rather than just having her fight meaningless bad guys for no real reason.


 * NRAMA: Does this story fill in the one year later gap for Raven?


 * MW: I think so, but it also establishes her new status quo.


 * NRAMA: Is this the same Raven from the current Teen Titans series or has she been changed by the continuity wave?


 * MW: She is the same Raven from the current series.


 * NRAMA: Is this an attempt to see if there is enough interest in Raven for an ongoing series?


 * MW: I don't think so, but who knows? I think some characters are perfect team members, but you can always do a series of mini-series with them. We'll see if there's any interest in that once the first series comes out.


 * NRAMA: Did you pitch this idea to DC or did they ask you to do a Raven mini-series?


 * MW: They asked me to come up with a Raven mini and I pitched the story that slowly morphed into the one you'll read here.


 * NRAMA: How many issues is the mini-series?


 * MW: Five.

- Added this image to "Absent During 'Crisis on Infinite Earths'":



TalonTheater, 5:39 PM EST, 27 October 2006


 * I think we're now getting the problem of too many images. Also, for the title image, I'd think it'd be best to go for 'current' rather than 'iconic'. --InShaneee 17:21, 9 October 2006 (UTC)


 * I agree with InShanee; the OYL title image was more appropriate. But I would keep all the other images you uploaded. --Neigel von Teighen 19:49, 9 October 2006 (UTC)


 * I personally think the article should use a higher ratio of pictures-text, as it's a picture-based medium. I also think that the main picture should be iconic as opposed to modern (especially as she's only been on one page in the new outfit), as when people come to this article for reference, the Raven they'll be most familiar with is likely the most oft-used Raven; that of Perez.


 * Of course, if more people come saying it's better to be current than iconic, then of course I'll go along with changing it. It's everybody's article. TalonTheater 18:18, 9 October 2006 (EST)


 * Note that I say both of those things as a comparison to other comic character articles. --InShaneee 23:32, 9 October 2006 (UTC)


 * Alright then, if you want to change the picture, go for it. I'm probably a bit biased in this because I personally don't like the new costume (the "raven crest" and nonsense gem belt are just plain annoying). Just know that I plan on adding much more text to the article, so the picture-text ratio will balance out eventually. TalonTheater 7:25, 11 October 2006

I think we should cut either "Raven, as she looked pre-Infinite Crisis" or "Raven Rising". Pictures should add content to the article, and I'm not seeing enough difference in the two designs to warrant having both. We should do a straw vote on which to keep though. Excellent call on the scan with her explaining her powers btw Talon, I'd been looking for that earlier but couldn't find it.D1Puck1T 07:33, 9 November 2006 (UTC)


 * Yeah, I had to edit the pic as well, though, to include all the dialogue bubbles. It was in TNTT #6 (I think). - User:TalonTheater

Regarding the interviews, while I suppose there might be some reason to include the others, the one about the upcoming mini doesn't seem to have enough content to warrant being printed in its entirity. I suggest a summary of the major points, and a link to the original instead.D1Puck1T 07:33, 9 November 2006 (UTC)

- Added this to "Infinite Crisis" and One Year Later:
 * In #39, we see that she is in possession of the diskette containing Jericho's soul; at the end of the issue, Jericho's soul has been cleansed by Raven's incantation and has a new body.

- Replaced the profile picture picture:



with this one:


 * Ok, why did somebody change the profile picture? The one I posted is a much better one; it shows the new costume, but in better context. Heck, it's even metaphorical (Raven running).
 * I didn't do it, but I agree with it; the older one is clearer and gives a better view of things. --InShaneee 00:46, 17 November 2006 (UTC)

Stop lying here's proof []. Brian Boru is awesome 13:34, 2 December 2006 (UTC)

Again, I think we should cut either "Raven, as she looked pre-Infinite Crisis" or "Raven Rising". Pictures should add content to the article, and I'm not seeing enough difference in how Raven is drawn in those 2 images to warrant having both. Is there an image that can add content that we can use instead? Something Trigon-related perhaps?D1Puck1T 02:35, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

- Changed "Force Emotion (First and Second Lives only)" from this:
 * Raven's has had the ability to force outside emotions into other people, consciously or otherwise. She first used this ability on Wally West, making him fall in love with her in order to join her newly formed Teen Titans group, as Kid Flash. Later after being freed from her father's powers, she forced a short-lived romance with Nightwing, which was also induced by the fact that Raven was experiencing her own emotions for the first time. Raven also had tipped the scales in her favor and had "almost made" Nightwing fall for her.


 * to this:


 * Raven has had the ability to force outside emotions into other people, consciously or otherwise. She has used this ability many times, first notably on Wally West, in order to save his life (see Legends of the DC Universe #18). Later, after being freed from her father's powers and starting her second life, she unintentionally forced a short-lived romance with Nightwing, which was also induced by the fact that Raven was experiencing her own emotions for the first time, but Starfire/Koriand'r, who became her close friend , told that she wasn't really in love with him as the way she thought , so Dick and Raven remained friends,though at the end of the incident, it showed that Raven cried in sorrow when she saw Dick and Koriand'r flew away together . Whether or not she still possesses this ability (pre- or post- Infinite Crisis) is unknown.
 * There was some misinformation in the previous version (particularly involving Wally West), and generally just too much text. --TalonTheater 20 February 2007

Writer interviews?
Are the writer's interviews really neccesary for this article, and the very long section on animated Raven? Also, does her Powers section need info on animated Raven? I feel that this is a comics article (hence the title Raven (comics)), and should not have so much info on her cartoon counterpart. NeoCoronis 00:27, 15 November 2006 (UTC)
 * I agree with you, but I don't think the people who actually like the cartoon will. There should be a separate article for the cartoon version; the only resemblances between the two are the name and cloak. Personality and powers are different. TalonTheater
 * Name, cloak... origin, team membership, etc. etc. etc. Regardless, as I said before, at the  minimum  the interview on the upcoming mini should be cut and replaced with a brief summary of the interview and a link to it.  You could make an argument for the other interviews, but there's nothing in that interview about the mini that couldn't be summarized for space concerns.D1Puck1T 02:18, 7 December 2006 (UTC)

This entire section needs to go. The most absolutely essential quotes can stay, but the rest can simply be referred to. --InShaneee 18:57, 16 December 2006 (UTC)

Returned to the team?
".. Jericho's soul is cleansed by Raven's incantation and has a new body. She returns to the team during TTT #40."

I don't recall her officially returning to the team in #40. Can someone correct this?

Raven's Mantra in the animated series
Fansites such as Titansgo.net and Titanstower.com animated fan site have listed the mantra as "Azarath Metrion Zinthos", not 'Azarath Metreon Zinthos'. It's the most widely used version of Raven's mantra by fans and websites alike, so anybody mind if I change it? Takuyar 15:08, 31 December 2006 (UTC)

No.But I guess my ideas doesnt count.

No if its on TV leave it there are many fans such as me who like that mantra Nomsese (talk) 22:18, 21 March 2019 (UTC)

Page Layout
Just something minor, but shouldn't Powers and Abilities be put ahead of Animated Series Counterpart? It just seems weird touching on the comic Raven but not talking about powers until we scroll through another whole chunk of information. They're also more focused on comic Raven.

Also, for Powers, Animated Series, Artist Interviews, etc. Shouldn't they be cut into sections for easier separate editing? I'm a newbie to wikipedia editing, so I don't know how to do it. Takuyar 15:26, 31 December 2006 (UTC)

Further Insight to Raven's Mantra
In the episode Spellbound, she learns many things from reading Malchior's books, and when combating the heart-like robot with the other titans, chants an altered three-word mantra that causes umbra-like energy to flow from her mouth and start to envelop the machine. When Robin tells her to stop, due to the risk of injuring the child the robot had abducted inside of it, she says that she can't control it, and then confronts Malchior, accusing him of it being "dark magic". This might indicate that her mantra is a means of spellcasting.

What a MESS!
First, what are the sources of the Writer/Artist Interviews section? Can I trust? Please cite sources and integrate the section into other appropriate areas of the article.

And, I think Powers section needs clean up. Everything in that section is in pell-mell.--JSH-alive talk to mesee my worksmail to me 11:28, 31 March 2007 (UTC)


 * What's wrong with the powers section? It's as organized as it can be while still separating the comic Raven (and her multiple lives, which have had varying abilities) from the animated version. She's had a lot of powers in her time, and they're being covered here. TalonTheater (DTF) 12:06, 24 April 2007 (UTC)

Titanstower.com is the source for the interviews. And yes I agree, but I'm still a newbie to wiki editing and all those formats.. -Tak

First appearence
I have read the first issues of the New Titans since reformed by Raven, including the DC Comics presents one (in wich those Titans do not exist yet, but Robin is "taken" by Raven into taking part in a future adventure with them), but I have noticed that the encounter of Raven with the Justice League is already referenced as a past event, previous to even the events of DC Comics Presents (as the idea of reforming the Titans was made after being rejected by the League).

Was this a narrative trick, an event made up for explaining her origin, or has Raven really appeared at some comic book issue of the League asking for help and being rejected by Zatanna? Perón 18:09, 2 July 2007 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Raven in Teen Titans TV show.jpg
Image:Raven in Teen Titans TV show.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

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BetacommandBot (talk) 22:36, 5 December 2007 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Raven-classic.jpg
Image:Raven-classic.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images uploaded after 4 May, 2006, and lacking such an explanation will be deleted one week after they have been uploaded, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot (talk) 22:38, 5 December 2007 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Red and white ravens.jpg
Image:Red and white ravens.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

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BetacommandBot (talk) 09:15, 21 January 2008 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Ravenacolor.jpg
Image:Ravenacolor.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images lacking such an explanation can be deleted one week after being tagged, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot (talk) 04:12, 24 January 2008 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:EvilRavenToT.jpg
Image:EvilRavenToT.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images lacking such an explanation can be deleted one week after being tagged, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot (talk) 20:52, 13 February 2008 (UTC)

Soul power
I removed this speculative OR: "This is seemingly contradicted in the episode "Switched", where her powers remain in her body when she switches bodies with Starfire, the latter gaining control over them instead." No reason the powers themselves can't be connected to the body while using whichever soul is inside her body to supply the "mojo". Noclevername (talk) 19:27, 16 February 2008 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Raven's Meditation.jpg
Image:Raven's Meditation.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to ensure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images lacking such an explanation can be deleted one week after being tagged, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot (talk) 04:57, 18 February 2008 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:RavenTitans08.jpg
Image:RavenTitans08.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to ensure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images lacking such an explanation can be deleted one week after being tagged, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot (talk) 04:58, 18 February 2008 (UTC)

Raven's Miniseries
Why isn't her current miniseries mentioned in this article? Supergrimm (talk) 17:15, 6 March 2008 (UTC)Supergrimm

maybe cause people want to forget the horror of it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 63.3.5.129 (talk) 03:55, 3 May 2008 (UTC)

Animated Raven's Ancestry
There has been a mini-argument going on involving the animated Raven's ancestry. I believe that Arella's facial features suggest an Asian background, which would apply to Raven as well. The most common counter-argument is that Arella's appearance is the result of the anime-inspired art style. This is illogical as the art style does not automatically make characters look Asian. Arella is one of the only characters on the show with these features and it is not because of the art style; it is due to an intentional attempt to represent Asian facial features. It is obvious and deserves to be in the article. Farm_Zombie (talk) 20:49, 26 April 2008 (EST)

It's not illogical at all when almost all the characters look Asian due to the artwork with that perspetive and it does not need to be in the article. Unless you wish to add "But this is debatible" Jerky Chid (talk) 02:00, 29 April 2008 (UTC)

The far majority of characters most certainly do not look Asian, unless you somehow consider the enlarged eyes and such so prevalent in the art-style to be synonymous with Asian facial features, and why would you? The anime-inspired design was originally inspired, decades ago, by the Japanese mimicking the works of Western animators; not their own features. Compare Arella to most other characters on the show. She is distinctly different. I stand by my analysis. Farm_Zombie (talk) 16:05, 29 April 2008 (EST)

I guess the question is whether or not you can cite sources suggesting this, or it'd just be original research? Nave.notnilc (talk) 06:31, 23 July 2009 (UTC)

Wow. This topic popped up again. Okay, when Teen Titans was adapted from comic to animated series, all the characters were redesigned. Raven's design was the most dramitically altered. Now, let's just say you had never heard of the character's unusual parentage. If you were shown a picture of the original comic book Raven, you'd probably just assume she was a caucasian person. However, determining the animated Raven's racial background is far more difficult because of her unusual appearance (grey skin, violet hair), but few would say she looks caucasian. Studying the character's design for a while, she does have some vaguely exotic facial features. This is backed 100% by the appearance of her mother who had distinctly Asian facial features. This is not just speculation; its pretty obvious when you look at the different adaptations of the characters in question and it is at least worth a sentence in the article.

Here's another example: In the original TMNT comic, the character Baxter Stockman was African-American. When the show was adapted into an animated series, he was depicted as a caucasian man. In yet another adaptation, he was again African-American. In the Baxter Stockman article, the racial shifts between adaptations are mentioned several times. The same principal applies here.

It really isn't a big deal, but why not be honest about the change that took place between adaptations? (Freed223 (talk) 06:24, 29 July 2009 (UTC))


 * It's not being honest, it's inserting your opinion. All of that is your opinion. What's in the article now is the extent of the facts. Once you start adding nonsense about exoticness then you get into original research. — Trust not the Penguin (T | C) 08:17, 29 July 2009 (UTC)

The Raven
Does information on this character really belong here? Or, at the very least, at the start of this article? I don't really think it's needed and it makes the start of this article seem very crowded.

Other Ravens
There have been four characters prior to the Titan to call themselves Raven (OSS, Golden Age Hawkman Carter Hall, Silver Age Katar Hol, agen of MAZE); what about mentioning them?

Quality Comics character
Why is there a paragraph on a different character in the lead? I can't see the connection and it could potentially be confusing (well I'm confused so I suspect it must be). (Emperor (talk) 20:19, 12 November 2008 (UTC))

Infobox image
Although WP covers knowledge regardless of individual tastes, and has does not shy away from showing anything that is necessary to illustrate its articles, I suggest replacing with, moving it into the body of the article. "Ravenacolor" has its place in showing how the character is often/usually portrayed, but Ravenoyl is more recent and less erotic, and I think it makes for a better first impression. I'd do it myself, but I can't be bothered figuring out the best place to put Ravenacolor and all that (plus this'll definitely avoid a stupid edit war).

Just in case anyone decides to play into a stereotype and claim that the above paragraph is just excessive feminism and I must be a woman who's annoyed by the unbalanced sensualisation frequently found in comics, complete with similarly run-on sentences (which would be rather disappointing to see here on Wikipedia): I am actually a young straight man who simply has the reasoning stated above. 217.23.4.105 (talk) 02:17, 3 September 2012 (UTC)

Disjointed, overly long, and in need of a lot of work
I added a number of references and made some edits, but the info box at the top of the page is correct in that it has "multiple issues" and is in need of some good editing. The history is overly long and detailed. It's too "in universe" and far too detailed especially on events of the past few years. Someone who is more familiar with recent events should edit this down.

Shoeless Ho (talk) 19:43, 8 November 2013 (UTC)

Requested move 17 August 2017

 * The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section. 

The result of the move request was: moved  Dr Strauss   talk   21:12, 23 August 2017 (UTC)

Raven (comics) → Raven (DC Comics) – The use of the word "(comics)" in the title ambiguous. The current title could also refer to Raven (Ace Comics). Steel1943 (talk) 06:17, 17 August 2017 (UTC)
 * Support. Given that we have articles on multiple characters in comics named Raven, identifying one simply as "comics" is unclear.  ╠╣uw [ talk ]  19:31, 17 August 2017 (UTC)
 * Support - seems pretty straight-forward Argento Surfer (talk) 12:37, 21 August 2017 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

Image Art
Can we get a new photo for Raven? Countryking2001 (talk) 01:53, 30 June 2021 (UTC)

Justice League Dark?
Since when has Raven ever been a member of the Justice League Dark? To date, she has not ever been a member of the team.JayAaerow (talk) 02:20, 25 June 2022 (UTC)