Talk:Realization (climb)/Archive 1

Maybe
Maybe the list of 'proposed 9a+ routes' should have it's own article — Preceding unsigned comment added by 90.163.20.91 (talk) 18:06, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

Name
The ordering of the "name" and "also known as name" have repeatably been switched. I realize there is some controversy over the proper name of this route, as clearly and respectfully discussed in the article. This is the English Wikipedia and as a result follow language/naming conventions of English speaking nations, such as England, Australian, New Zealand, Canadian, and US, take precedence over other conventions. In this case the conflict is between an American and French convention. In France a route setter names the route's they set. In the US a set route is referred to as "so and so's project" but for practical purposes the route remains nameless until an individual climbs and then names the route. Unless there is a convincing argument to counter this repeatedly reverting the intro sentence to read "Biographie, also known as Realization" rather than "Realization, also known as Biographie" is petty vandalism. Its childish so please stop.--OMCV (talk) 01:19, 29 January 2009 (UTC)
 * I just checked the french WP and it calls the climb "Realization, also known as Biographie" (or at least something to that effect in french). On top of this the french WP page for Chris Sharma is much better than the English WP (well at least it has pictures).--OMCV (talk) 01:25, 29 January 2009 (UTC)

the first sentence sounds very bias —Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.113.160.60 (talk) 04:36, 3 March 2009 (UTC)


 * I just switched from "or rather" to "also known as" which is the old language which I prefer. That seems to be the only aspect of the first sentence that could contain bias unless the climbs location is debated.--OMCV (talk) 12:46, 3 March 2009 (UTC)


 * 1) The fact this is wikipedia in english language is irrelevant, only location of cliff matters
 * 2) What Sharma says is irrelevant, in France name of route is given by route setter
 * Version you keep reverting back to is widely circulated, but wrong. (Pbla4024 (talk) 16:30, 26 March 2009 (UTC))
 * To the best of my knowledge Wikipedia does not have an official policy to resolve disputes between French route naming conventions and US route naming convention. The relevance is disputable considering 1) "what Sharma says", 2) the fact that wikipedia is English language, 3) the routes location, and 4) the fact the article's creator abiding by US convention.  What ever consensus is reached is fine but if you change the titles the article needs to be rewritten to reflect the change.  Again I think the "naming" dispute is covered pretty well in the article.


 * I am certain that "or rather" is fine spoken English but "also known as" is better written English.--OMCV (talk) 01:13, 27 March 2009 (UTC)

Incomplete list of proposed 9a+ routes or harder
Here's the list mentioned above, moved out of the article:


 * Orujo FA by Bernabe Fernandez.
 * Realization FA by Chris Sharma. Repeated by Sylvain Millet, Patxi Usobiaga, David Graham, and Ethan Pringle.
 * Flex Luthor FA by Tommy Caldwell.
 * Flat Mountain FA by Yuji Hirayama.
 * La Rambla original FA by Ramón Julián Puigblanque. Repeated by Edu Marin on 2006-11-30, Chris Sharma on 2006-12-01, and Andreas Bindhammer.
 * Violent New Breed FA by John Gaskins.
 * Definicion de Resistencia Democrata FA by Dani Andrada. Repeated by Tino Lois.
 * La Novena Enmienda FA by Dani Andrada.
 * Coup de Grace FA by David Graham.
 * Es Pontas FA by Chris Sharma. Sharma has never formally graded this route and also said that it feels physically like 9a.
 * Overshadow FA by Steve McClure on May 28, 2007 at Malham Cove in Yorkshire. The route is an extension to Overnite Sensation (8a+/5.13c).
 * Corona FA by Markus Bock on October 5, 2006, in the Frankenjua, Germany. The route shares the first part with "Burn 4 u" (8c/14b). The hardest part is a 6-move 8B/V13 boulder sequence involving big moves on bad two finger pockets with bad feet.
 * Jaws II FA by Vasya Vorotnikov on Oct 14, 2007 at the Waimea crag of Rumney, New Hampshire. See Dave Graham.

67.101.5.75 16:27, 10 October 2007 (UTC).

Akira and Chilam Balam have been removed. —Preceding unsigned comment added by S Providence (talk • contribs) 21:45, 9 February 2010 (UTC)

removed nicholas smith
have no idea who this is and the link was for "boston.com" ?? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2001:56A:78C8:AD00:A17C:4C61:F3E2:5FAC (talk) 04:15, 21 October 2021 (UTC)

Title
The climb appears much better known as "Biographie" in the sources. czar 03:49, 29 August 2022 (UTC)
 * Technically, Biographie is the name of the climb to about 2/3rds way up, and Realization is the final 1/3rd (which is the hard part). Calling it just Biographie would be a potential confusion as there are sources who call the original 8c+ route by that name.   I think it could be called Realization/Biographie, but I don't know if that is allowed by Wikipedia naming conventions.  There are quality climbing sources that use that naming convention (e.g. Climbing Magazine, PlanetMountain, and the Mountain Project).  It is the least offensive (to all), and would probably result in less challenge or dispute imho (as there are sources who use both names, and sometimes interchangeably in the same article per Rock & Ice).  78.19.234.110 (talk) 22:49, 8 September 2022 (UTC)
 * Biographie is the first 70% of the route, the rest is from Sharma. It is known by both names, but I am not sure that calling it Realization/Biographie is a good route as it is an awkward search term. Aszx5000 (talk) 12:08, 2 April 2023 (UTC)