Talk:Redmond Caves

why no coordinates?
So the original version of this page said "please no coordinates". I assume that's because the location is hidden to preserve the caves and anything found in them. Is that correct?

If so, it should be possible to give an approximate location- I mean, it isn't chance that it's in the 40-acre Redmond Caves Park and has been "well known to the local population recently as well as historically". tedder (talk) 23:17, 1 December 2009 (UTC)


 * Further, the infobox "access" field is public, so .. it should definitely have coordinates. tedder (talk) 23:22, 1 December 2009 (UTC)


 * Coordinates for caves is a topic of discussion at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Caves and no standard has been set. Until then, coordinates are not welcome on the article and eligible for deletion without references. You are correct that coordinates are often withheld in an effort to preserve their contents. This is an issue that is ongoing with any cave. While the Redmond Caves are well known to the local populace, people outside of the populace looking to deface or steal artifacts (those people are called pothunters) would have an easier time locating artifacts if coordinates were given, especially for specific caves, rather than just a park.


 * I see your point and the possibility of an exception being made for the Redmond Caves, however, I try not to make exceptions when a general policy toward cave location disclosure is discouraged. Leitmotiv (talk) 23:30, 1 December 2009 (UTC)


 * I can (somewhat) understand the argument of security by obscurity, and know that's a tradition by grottos. Keep in mind the WT:WPCaves discussion you linked states it could only be removed by arguments of no WP:RS for the coordinates. However, it goes against the ethos of Wikipedia of sharing information with all. If a reliable source locates the caves, it should stay. tedder (talk) 23:49, 1 December 2009 (UTC)


 * Duly noted. As I understand, that means unless the source for coordinates is reliable, it's eligible for removal. Most publications as far as I'm aware of, don't publish locations by coordinates if at all. So how does one make the jump from a location on a map, to coordinates on wikipedia? Also the infobox may be changed to reflect no field for coordinates, am I right? Making this all a moot point, I'm hoping. I could go into the specifics behind the ethical reasons for not disclosing coordinates, but that is beyond the scope of this argument. Leitmotiv (talk) 07:51, 2 December 2009 (UTC)

The template for cave infoboxes has been updated to omit the coordinate field. See the discussion for more details. Leitmotiv (talk) 19:27, 5 December 2009 (UTC)