Talk:Refrigeration

Definition
While "refrigeration" can easily be defined in relation with the generic term "cooling", the current definition implies that natural cooling is also included, which is not correct. Hence, I would propose a simpler definition, as follows:

'Cooling means removal of heat from an object or system, which results in lowering its temperature or in phase change. Artificial cooling down to temperatures lower than the ambient one (which spends human generated or harvested energy) is called refrigeration.'

Please focus on the suggestion and do not argue with my anonymous IP! I am an expert in the area and play a role in many refrigeration-related organizations around the world. :) --212.73.146.73 (talk) 09:25, 15 June 2016 (UTC)

REFRIGERATION
At what temperature does a frige become a freezer? (unsigned)
 * At a temperature that allows you to operate a computer, press Backspace and type the letters "r" "e" "e" "z" "e" "r". Micasta (talk) 14:51, 28 February 2009 (UTC)

Micasta, that was a cruel and pointless comment. I don't think you made anyone laugh but yourself. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.107.181.33 (talk) 10:09, 28 March 2009 (UTC)

The two dead links in the ICE HARVESTING can be rectified. I found a few related links. User:Naninnewetuah 8-15-2011 —Preceding undated comment added 06:24, 15 August 2011 (UTC).

Refrigeration
Perhaps some clean up of the first line "Refrigeration is the process of removing heat from an enclosed space, or from a substance, and moving it to a place where it is unobjectionable."

That the space is enclosed does not cause the effect to be refrigeration, it could be anywhere. The place to which the heat is moved is not a determinate either. Consider a cascaded refrigeration system, the condenser of the first system is part of a liquid to liquid heat exchanger that is the evaporator of the second system.

Suggestion, Refrigeration is the process of removing heat from a localized area. SteveOak25 (talk) 21:20, 5 January 2009 (UTC)

Sentences should focus on refrigeration
This came from the "First refrigeration systems" section:


 * Meanwhile, James Harrison who was born in Scotland and subsequently emigrated to Australia, began operation of a mechanical ice-making machine in 1851 on the banks of the Barwon River at Rocky Point in Geelong, Victoria.

If I were doing a research on refrigeration, I wouldn't care if James Harrison were Scottish, Australian or Martian. I would be interested in what he contributed to the technology of refrigeration... and in the event that I become more interested in who James Harrison was, I'd just check out his article (there's a link to that). The phrase "who was born in Scotland and subsequently emigrated to Australia" distracts the reader from the subject of refrigeration. I've decided to re-word the sentence to "James Harrison from Scotland began operation of a mechanical ice-making machine in 1851..." His emigration to Australia need not be highlighted. Micasta (talk) 14:44, 28 February 2009 (UTC)

Warehouses
We have pages on refrigerated/reefer ships and containers, but nothing on cold storage/refrigerated warehouses. Could someone either link a page, add a section here or create an article??71.236.26.74 (talk) 22:00, 16 September 2009 (UTC)

Pretty Weak
This whole article is pretty weak, technically deficient, and it reads like an introduction to commercial refrigeration in the U.S.A.

189.188.166.197 (talk) 05:44, 3 February 2010 (UTC)

Units of Refrigeration
The section of called "Units of Refrigeration" has some good historical information in it. However, it is largely incorrect for the current industry. 1 Ton of Refrigeration (TR) is defined as precisely 12,000 BTU/hr. Secondly as this unit is defined in English Units, and is really only used where English units are used. It is rather nonsensical to have multiple SI equivalents, especially seeing as most of the rest of the World uses the Kw as the standard unit of refrigeration. I would recommend a rewording as follows.

''The units of refrigeration are always a unit of power. Domestic and commercial refrigerators may be rated in kJ/s, or Btu/h of cooling. For commercial and industrial refrigeration systems most of the world uses the kilowatt (kW) as the basic unit refrigeration. Typically, commercial and industrial refrigeration systems North America are rated in Tons of Refrigeration (TR). Historically, one Ton of Refrigeration was defined as the energy removal rate that will freeze one short ton of water at 0 °C (32 °F) in one day. This was very important because many early refrigeration systems were in ice houses. The simple unit allowed owners of these refrigeration systems measure a days output of ice against energy consumption and compare their plant to one down the street. While ice houses make up a much smaller part of the refrigeration industry than they once did the unit of Tons of Refrigeration has remained in North America. The unit's value as historically defined is approximately 11,958 BTU/hr (3.505 kW) has been redefined to be exactly 12,000 BTU/hr (3.517 kW).''

''While not truly a unit, a refrigeration system's Coefficient of Performance (CoP) is very important in determining a system's overall efficiency. It is defined as refrigeration capacity in kW divided by the energy input in kW. While CoP is a very simple measure, like the kW, it is typically not used for industrial refrigeration in North America. Owners and manufacturers of these systems typically use Performance Factor. A systems Performance Factor is defined as a system's energy input in horsepower divided by it's refrigeration capacity in Tons of Refrigeration. Both Coefficient of Performance and Performance Factor can be applied to either the entire system or to system components. For example an individual compressor can be rated by looking at the energy required to run the compressor versus the the expected refrigeration capacity based on inlet volume flow rate. It is important to note that both Coefficient of Performance and Performance Factor for a refrigeration system are only defined at a specific operating conditions. Moving away from those operating conditions can dramatically change a system's performance.''

Please provide feedback on this post. I plan to change the "Units of Refrigeration" section to this sometime after 10/18/2010 if no one has any objections. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 198.36.95.12 (talk) 14:21, 4 October 2010 (UTC)

As no one has commented on this post I am changing the section in question be be what is written here. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 198.36.95.12 (talk) 19:50, 27 October 2010 (UTC)

Refridgeration in history
Many old emperors had ice house: ie Zimri-Lin, Yongsheng Shensi, Tj'n Sje Hwang-ti, ... The "ice house" built at Yongsheng, in Shensi had a lock-mechanism and was situated near a river. I'm wondering whether none of these used a system similar to the Pot-in-pot_refrigerator, that would also be a very important thing to mention then.

91.182.251.170 (talk) 14:26, 20 November 2010 (UTC)

As far as I know many large houses in the country in Britain had and "ice house". They were usually made as a smallish building over a cellar. The cellars were insulated for the best effect. Ice was harvested from any local source and stored in these cellars for use when cooling was needed. 2.102.129.125 (talk) 15:22, 26 December 2013 (UTC)Luke Wiseman

Introduction
Removing the third sentence as it is a slightly more technical and largely more ambiguous restatement of the first. Additionally the "this" does not refer to anything specific. Moving the last sentence to be the second sentence.

Original

Refrigeration is a process in which work is done to remove heat from one location to another. Refrigeration has many applications including but not limited to; household refrigerators, industrial freezers, cryogenics, air conditioning, and heat pumps. In order to satisfy the Second Law of Thermodynamics, some form of work must be performed to accomplish this. The work is traditionally done by mechanical work but can also be done by magnetism, laser or other means.

New

Refrigeration is a process in which work is done to remove heat from one location to another. This work is traditionally done by mechanical work but can also be done by magnetism, laser or other means. Refrigeration has many applications including but not limited to; household refrigerators, industrial freezers, cryogenics, air conditioning, and heat pumps.

food storage optimum temperature
"Optimum temperature range for perishable food storage is 3 to 5 °C (37 to 41 °F)."

It seems that for most food the ideal optimum storage temperature would be just above freezing, about 1C, 33F. Is this true? Where can one find detailed facts, tables and graphs of storage time as a function of temperature for various foods? What temperatures are used for ideal commercial storage of various foods?-96.237.13.111 (talk) 14:33, 19 November 2011 (UTC)

William Cullen
The WikiPedia article states Cullen made the first public display of refrigeration in 1756, but many other sources state this event happened in 1748. Some fact checking may be in order. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 180.68.43.188 (talk) 14:03, 9 September 2013 (UTC)

Should we propose merger with Ton_of_refrigeration?
It appears that this article's section Refrigeration has a more extensive discussion of the history of Ton_of_refrigeration. Should that page be merged into this page, or should that information be merged into Ton_of_refrigeration page, and here provide a "see main article" link?

There are benefits of maintaining a unique page for Ton_of_refrigeration.
 * Search engine hits lead directly to pertinent info
 * The unit belongs to the broader category of heat transfer, not refrigeration alone

Any thoughts? Nfette (talk) 23:37, 30 June 2014 (UTC)

non-cyclic refrigeration
Since the "non-cyclic refrigeration" section was empty, I took the liberty of putting some basic information in there. Hopefully someone with more knowledge on the subject will expand it if there is more to the topic. - Marcus erronius (talk) 21:11, 29 February 2016 (UTC)

Merge concepts of "air conditioning" and "refrigeration"? Comments requested
Please see I think that descriptions of "air cooling" are all the same concept but somehow started to be described in multiples places. I am seeking advice on what can be merged together and where.  Blue Rasberry  (talk)  16:23, 6 March 2017 (UTC)
 * Comments requested on merging "air cooling" process descriptions from multiple Wikipedia articles

External links modified
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Grotesque
One of the most grotesquely overdetailed and discursive articles I've ever encountered. If I weren't phone-bound for another week I'd take a hatchet to it. EEng 21:19, 14 May 2018 (UTC)
 * This are a lot "cooler", you know. Martinevans123 (talk) 15:18, 15 May 2018 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 27 July 2018
Suggest add Institute of Refrigeration to external links section as show below:
 * Yes check.svg Done L293D (☎ • ✎) 18:55, 28 July 2018 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 25 November 2018
Change: From point 1 to point 2, the vapor is compressed at constant entropy and exits the compressor as a vapor at a higher temperature, but still below the vapor pressure at that temperature. to: From point 1 to point 2, the vapor is compressed through an isentropic compression process and exits the compressor as a higher temperature vapor, but still below the vapor pressure at that temperature. Lab95 (talk) 22:11, 25 November 2018 (UTC)
 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: You've made the text less concise but said the exact same thing. Why? Izno (talk) 23:19, 25 November 2018 (UTC)

Suggested Correction to Article
I suggest, based on personal knowledge and, well, science, that the following statement in the main article is not completely correct in all normal use cases:

"Non-cyclic refrigeration ...Regular ice can maintain temperatures near, but not below the freezing point....".

I will add that the cited assertion/claim cites no supporting reference material. I will also add that "regular ice" should just be "ice" or - to set it off from the item it is to be contrasted with - "water ice"; and that "dry ice" be a link to that article or at least be described: "dry ice (frozen carbon dioxide)" or similar.

At the risk of offering "original research" (or just settled science), I posit: water under normal pressures freezes at a temperature. Below that temperature, perhaps even down to near absolute zero, it remains frozen; and anything packed in it will transfer energy to it and cool until the system (volume of material within the containment) reaches a (dynamic) temperature equilibrium; so if the ratio of masses between very cold ice and a packed item that was at "room temperature and air pressure" is large enough (if there is enough ice) and the ice is cold enough, it will freeze the water portion of the item that was packed in it. 170.63.67.40 (talk) 15:13, 3 May 2019 (UTC)

Any serious discussion on refrigeration history should mention the Einstein–Szilard refrigerator
See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Einstein_refrigerator

I am not tech savvy enough to do any editing... 69.172.158.166 (talk) 20:57, 13 December 2020 (UTC)

"VAHP" listed at Redirects for discussion
An editor has identified a potential problem with the redirect VAHP and has thus listed it for discussion. This discussion will occur at until a consensus is reached, and readers of this page are welcome to contribute to the discussion. Steel1943 (talk) 05:56, 14 December 2022 (UTC)

Mobile refrigeration
I suspect this article displaces other possibilities that might have been more helpful. Really quite a shame. -SusanLesch (talk) 15:14, 24 May 2023 (UTC)

Artificial and natural refrigerator
new section 43.225.23.30 (talk) 17:58, 27 December 2023 (UTC)