Talk:Rhapta

Intriguing article! Keep up the good work! &mdash; mark &#9998; 01:28, 16 Feb 2005 (UTC)

The opening quotation
The edits concerning this passage are getting a little silly, so let me lay out the facts behind these five words.

When I wrote the first draft of this piece, I had G.W.B. Huntingford's translation of Periplus of the Erythraean Sea before me (published 1980), wherein he translates the original Greek as "the last mart of Azania". Because "mart" is a distinctly obsolescent word, & Huntingford consistently translates the Greek emporia as "mart", & substituted "emporium" for "mart" (assuming this word was familiar enough to the average reader not to need an explanation) & launched this article on its merry way.

I noticed a few days later that this passage had been amplified not only to state that it was rendered into English thusly in one specific translation, but with a link on the word "emporium", which led to an article that did not explain the word. Okay, since I'm the author of this "translation", I changed the word to "marketplace" (which is less high-fallutin' than "emporium") & removed the misleading information. Now I look once again at the article, & someone has decided to invent her/his own "correct" translation! And so I reverted it.

To the next Wikipedian who feels compelled to augment these five simple words, keep the following in mind: This precise translation never existed before the beginning of this article. The whole point of quoting the Periplus was to show this was as far south as traders of the first two centuries AD had reached; not all of sub-Saharan Africa was unknown to the intellectuals of the Ancient World.

If you really want to add to this article, you can flesh out some of the debate over the location of Rhapta, or create the articles this one points to. Otherwise, this obsession with these five words for this many people is either an expression of the need to be an authority rivalling David Brent's most unrestrained efforts, or pure vandalism. -- llywrch 02:38, 18 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Periplus of the Erythrian Sea

 * I commented there on the sailing directions given in the Periplus to the port of Rhapta in Tanzania. Its likely that by the time of Neco II, 600 BC the Phoenicians were circumnavigating Libya and returning trough the pillars of Hercules as an Atlantean ocean empire larger than Libya and Asia combined because their empire was the waters which surrounded those continents.
 * The trade with "Punt" goes back to "the pre and proto history of the Arabian peninsula" Nayim and others. Juris Zahrin University of Missouri has looked at some of the sites in Yemen and discuses the bab al mandab.


 * http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pepi_II_Neferkare Pepi II (2284 BC – after 2247 BC, probably either c. 2216 or c. 2184 BC[2][note 1]) was a pharaoh of the Sixth Dynasty in Egypt's Old Kingdom who reigned from c. 2278 BC. He sent out an expedition which brought back a dwarf from Nubia.
 * "The Tale of the Shipwrecked Sailor" is 12th dynasty record of a voyage to Punt (as far as Yemen).
 * In the 18th Dynasty Hatshepset built a fleet to provide supplies for the mortuary trade at Karnak,
 * Karnak was locate across the Nile the 18th Dynasty capital Thebes.
 * Hatshepset's fleet is reputed to have sailed to Punt, but most of the trade came from White village, Leocos Come.


 * Linen from Byblos, Ben Jamin (juniper berries) and cedar from Mt Hermon Lebanon.
 * Natron and Bitumen from the Dead sea brought down the wadi Araba past Petra where copper ore and other minerals were added.
 * Those cargos were then delivered to Ailia (Phoenician Elat)
 * There it was joined with trade in Gems such as Carnelian from Sri Lanka and Lapis Lazuli from Afghanistan
 * This trade came through Lothal on the Indus to Makkan in Oman there picking up Frankincense and Myhr.


 * The cargo then either went
 * 1. By ship up the Persian Gulf to the Tigris and Mari on Euphrates in Syria to join the northern cargo at Kadash in the mnountains
 * 2. By camel across the empty quarter to the crystal plateau where it added gold.
 * 3. By sea back along the southern coast of arabia in the gulf of Aden or along the northern coast of Somalia.
 * Then the cargo passed up from Yemen through Khamis Mushat in the south joined that from interior Arabia
 * That cargo brought over the mountains through Taif to Abha and joined at Yanbu with that shipped up along the Red Sea through Musa.
 * At White Village the cargo from the north shipped 500 miles back east across the Gulf of Aqaba joined the others
 * It went from there back across the Red Sea to Philidelphia, Biblical Pi Ha Haroth (the mouth of Hathor) modern Quasir (Elim)
 * Elim was Thebes Red Sea Port, the place where the cargo was paid for with Nub (gold) from Nubia coming up from Bernice
 * It then went inland along the wadi Ham ma ma'at to Thebes and Karnak.


 * This trade made Solomon rich and led to Alexander beseiging Tyre to learn the Parthian stations trade route.
 * Alexander followed that plus the Periplus route back down the Arabian gulf with his navy to join up with Chinas silk road.
 * By Roman times (Ptolomy's geography) there was Roman gold spread from Britain to China and as far south as Rhapta.
 * Eventually the Somais cut out the middlemen dealt directly with China and India, Rome and Ptolomaic Egypt.
 * This then all became the Gupta and Persian and then the Ottoman and Hun empires.142.0.102.9 (talk) 06:24, 29 May 2014 (UTC)

@Canterbury Tail should this article not include the recent discoveries near Mafia Island?

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-3664442/Has-2-000-year-old-lost-city-Rhapta-Ancient-ruins-coast-Tanzania-Roman-market-town.html (It pains me to link the Daily Mail) Alexanderkowal (talk) 20:04, 13 April 2024 (UTC)
 * Not sure why you're pinging me, but I don't know anything on this topic. And anyway Daily Mail is not a reliable source per WP:DAILYMAIL. Canterbury Tail talk 20:40, 13 April 2024 (UTC)
 * @Canterbury Tail I pinged you by mistake, sorry, meant to ping Alexanderkowal (talk) 20:52, 13 April 2024 (UTC)