Talk:Rodney Mullen/Archive 1

What about Games?
Rodney Mullen was in Tony Hawk's Pro Skater 2, Tony Hawk's Pro Skater 3, Tony Hawk's Pro Skater 4, Tony Hawk's Underground, Tony Hawk's Underground 2 plus remix, Tony Hawk's American Wasteland, Tony Hawk's Skateland and Tony Hawk's Project 8.

clean up
I've done some work here removing most of the POV stuff and generally cleaning it up. I've left the NPOV check inplace and I'll remove it in a week or so if no one complains. I've also added a little to the later career section and expanded the video list. Some of the stuff here still needs to be cited and when I get round to reading Mullen's book again, I can better cite some facts. Steve-g 12:21, 2 September 2006 (UTC)
 * POV check removed. The page is looking a lot better now. Steve-g 15:11, 6 October 2006 (UTC)
 * Well we've got the older version back including all the POV stuff mentioned above. Anyone care to revert or discuss which edit is best? Steve-g 20:24, 14 November 2006 (UTC)

Geez Louise, what's with the anal retentive complaints? Who started the whole "doesn't meet NPOV" thing? It's common knowledge that Rodney Mullen invented nearly every board trick that matters in skateboarding and has been the most innovative skateboarder in history. Someone just attach the youtube link of part one of Mullen's ON Video and that'll shut up the wikipedia nazi.
 * Nominay - please be polite. You know the rules here: WP:NPOV, WP:V. Steve-g 08:54, 16 November 2006 (UTC)

"besting" vs. "beating"
Besting makes more sense than beating when referring to Mullen's win over Rocco, since they were not competing head to head, and there are multiple placements in a competition of that nature.

Besting - "Surpassing all others in excellence, achievement, or quality; most excellent: the best performer; the best grade of ore."

... just a thought.


 * I'd say 'beating' was more appropriate as the conext is Mullen 'beating' Rocco, not Mullen 'besting' all the competitors. The sentence is in the article as it was a big event when mullen won against Rocco as Rocco was the champion. The focus is on that win against Rocco, rather than a win against all skaters in the comp Steve-g 10:12, 26 November 2006 (UTC)

What about the competitions?
I don't know much about Rodney Mullen's history in competition skating, but I see no mention that he was in any competitions at all, has he ever competed in the X-Games or anything?
 * The article mentions Mullen's competition run from the late '70s until the late '80s. He won almost every comp he ever entered. After he moved to World Industries he didn't compete again. Steve-g 18:58, 29 November 2006 (UTC)

steve rocco
the link to steve rocco redirects to a politician... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 121.97.81.131 (talk) 14:31, 11 September 2007 (UTC)


 * That's right, it appears we have a need for a new bio article on Steve Rocco (skateboarder). --Chikinsawsage 07:32, 16 October 2007 (UTC)

How About a Picture?

 * Pictures need to be non-copyrighted. So if anyone has one... --Liface 03:02, 1 July 2006 (UTC)


 * I added Don Walheim's photo of Rodney in 1988 (the only CC photo I could find). Someone else has just replaced it with a newer photo, but is it CC licensed? --Mr. Stein (talk) 00:17, 18 August 2009 (UTC)

Pigeon-Footed
If you had read his autobiography he is pigeon-footed meaning his feet point inward and when he was little he would go to bed with his "torture" boots that formed in a V-shaped position. Their have been rumors than Rodney has a eye-problem or a brian prblem but it could be in his feet though he skates excellent.


 * There is no mention of eye or brain problems in Mullen's autobiography, though his pigeon-toed-ness is well documented.--Mr. Stein (talk) 17:12, 28 September 2009 (UTC)

Reverted to older version.
I've reverted this page back to an older version. Many of the sections were missing including all the history, trick lists and references, I'm guessing this is on account of having to constantly revert vandalism and nonsense. Steve-g (talk) 08:39, 30 May 2008 (UTC)


 * I've again had to revert to an older version to restore sections of this article. Does no one monitor this page? Steve-g (talk) 16:35, 16 June 2008 (UTC)


 * I saved an old version today because the vandalism was so pervasive. And, no, not very many people monitor this page. Hopefully that is changing! --Mr. Stein (talk) 00:03, 5 October 2009 (UTC)

Not Ollie!!
Rodney Mullen did NOT invent the Flatland Ollie. Pickfordissecksy 09:54, 26 September 2007 (UTC)
 * Yes he did. But I'd like to know who you think did. Steve-g 15:07, 26 September 2007 (UTC)


 * Proof of Rodney Mullen not inventing the Ollie.
 * "Ollie," invented by Alan Ollie Gelfand.
 * http://web.mit.edu/invent/iow/skateboard.html
 * Pickfordissecksy 21:27, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
 * You're right Mullen did not invent the ollie. But we're talking about the flat-ground ollie and Mullen did invent that. Steve-g 07:18, 16 October 2007 (UTC)
 * The ollie you are thinking of is profformed on a halfpipe. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.105.179.37 (talk) 23:43, 12 May 2008 (UTC)


 * Alan Gelfand invented the "ollie"(a no-handed air, and he did it using a supporting obstacle, i.e. a pipe/ramp). Rodney Mullen on the other hand invented the "ollie pop" (a no-handed air performed with no supporting obstacles) which was performed on the "flat ground". There are major differences between the two, although the "ollie pop" is considered by many to have come from the "ollie", Rodney Mullen said somewhere that it was accidentally created from a freestyle trick (i don't have to much info on that at the moment).


 * what i'm trying to say is that Gelfand invented the "ollie" and Mullen invented the "ollie pop" not the "flatground ollie" because the "ollie pop" can be executed on almost anything and is not confined to the "flatground". --Panyé El Skat-é-board-ér 09:01, 21 June 2008 (UTC)


 * I doubt you'll be able to convince many people that a flat-ground ollie and an 'ollie pop' are any different. Mullen used both terms in his trick tip article in Thrasher in 1983. But I'll make a little edit to include 'ollie pop'  Steve-g (talk) 15:23, 22 June 2008 (UTC)


 * It can only be called a "flat-ground ollie" when performed on the "flat-ground". It has major differences when compared to the ollie when performed on a pipe/ramp, but it's biggest difference is the "pop". I mean, how can it be refered to as a "flat-ground ollie" if it's performed on a bank/obstacle and/or anything that isn't flat. It should be noted that Rodney Mullen only invented the "ollie pop" on the "flat-ground" and that it was later taken to new levels. Not that anyone actually calls it either the "flat-ground ollie" or the "ollie pop" - it should be added that it is most commonly refered to as an "ollie". --Panyé El Skat-é-board-ér 09:01, 21 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Arguments over pure semantics, really. That Mullen invented the flat-ground/flat-land/pop ollie is generally accepted. In modern skateboarding parlance, few people discuss an "ollie" with respect to air pipes and bowls, yet "ollie" is commonly understood as the key trick for street skating. This latter is what Mullen invented, i.e. transferred and perfected. Nuff said.--Mr. Stein (talk) 00:10, 5 October 2009 (UTC)

Invented tricks
I was WP:BOLD and removed this section in its entirety. 1.) It's completely unreferenced and likely to be challenged 2.)It's been tagged with WP:NOR for some time now and 3.)Users simply add obscure trick monikers without sources. For this section to exist, it absolutely requires reliable sources.  Wisdom89  ( T |undefined /  C ) 20:26, 12 May 2008 (UTC)

to finish Rodney Mullen is the best street skater of all time. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 62.30.159.72 (talk) 19:18, 16 May 2008 (UTC)


 * I'm going to work on finding sources for at least his major tricks not yet sourced. --Mr. Stein (talk) 00:25, 18 August 2009 (UTC)


 * I'd like to note that a 360 flip is not a ollie, then a kickflip, then a 360 shov-it. It is all of that at one time not each trick after the other. just thought I'd add that little bit[user:nthnptts]October 8, 2009. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.239.192.88 (talk) 16:01, 8 October 2009 (UTC)

Out Of Interest
Hello, sorry I was gone but I got a minor editing ban because I was doing editing on my school network, I'm not doing it now and I won't again but I need to know what is so bad about editing from my school. Mcjm4796 (talk) 15:42, 21 October 2009 (UTC)

Status of this Article
I've just changed the article to "B" Class. In general, this article is now solid, and though we could add a few details and references (esp. to tricks), I am satisfied with "B" class, especially as we have at least a couple folks monitoring it regularly. Even "A" class is possible, because I don't see "major issues". Thoughts? --Mr. Stein (talk) 00:07, 5 October 2009 (UTC)

FYI, I noticed that a significant amount of facts about Mullen's early career have disappeared since I last visited this article--probably as vandalisms have been erased. I've added these and suggest that today's revision be a good "revert to" point if we see more vandalism.----Mr. Stein (talk) 05:40, 26 November 2011 (UTC)

Early History Corrections
Today I corrected inaccurate information that has been in Rodney's early history for many years now. A long time ago I provided accurate info for Wikipedia and it's been changed over time and I finally got tired of looking at it. I sponsored Rodney after watching him skate the 1978 U.S. Open Championships (not to be confused with the 1977 All Florida Pro Championships) at Kona skatepark. He placed 5th in Boys Freestyle, not 3rd. I was more interested in him for my team than those who placed ahead of him, because he was clearly more advanced than them, but simply had a couple of bad runs, possibly from being nervous. I think the U.S. Open was probably his very first contest, but it was clearly his very first large scale event with major competitors from around the country, including many well-known Californians. I noticed Rodney was already riding a Walker skateboard in the contest, which he had purchased from his local shop sponsor Bill Murray of Inland Surf Shop in Gainesville. After joining the Walker team he won every single amateur event he entered for the next 2-3 years, totaling 30 wins, including his win at the Oceanside Nationals in California. Prior to turning pro at the Oasis contest in San Diego in summer of 1980, Rodney had entered his first two pro freestyle events in Florida, both at the Clearwater Skatepark. I had him enter those two pro events but made sure he retained his amateur status. He needed to be challenged by higher level opponents as he had gone far beyond the level of amateur skaters he was routinely skating against. He was still not ready to officially turn pro, even though his skating was already more advanced than the pros he went up against. In both pro events at Clearwater, he placed 3rd among a field that included Jim McCall, Tim Scroggs, Joe Ayers, Kelly Lynn, Stuart Singer and many others. While 3rd was a respectable finish both times, especially for an amateur, his mindset prior to these pro events had still not caught up with his skating ability. He saw himself skating against his long-time hero Jim McCall and wasn't mentally prepared for the fact that he had already surpassed McCall technically. I used these contests to show him it was possible to beat many of these pros he'd been looking up to, and that he belonged competing at their level. These two events brought his mental outlook up to the level of his physical skating. From there, it was finally time in 1980 to start a serious discussion and plan to finally launch his pro career. Unfortunately this all coincided with the United States and the rest of the world falling into a deep, worldwide recession. With skateboard companies falling left and right, there ended up being maybe 10 or so companies left in business in the entire U.S. skateboard industry. While Walker Skateboards was one of the survivors of that recession, it was clear that Rodney needed a larger company with greater resources to support his launch into professional skateboarding. Powell Peralta was the strongest company of the time and it was only natural that Rodney needed to go that route, especially after Stacy Peralta showed great interest in getting him onto his team. From there, others besides me can help tell the Rodney Mullen story. It's important however, to include SIO Barry Zaritsky in Rodney's early and later history as Barry became a large influence to Mullen's later success as a pro. Barry is skateboarding's most prolific trainer and rehabilitative expert who guided nearly all the legends of the sport. He was on hand, around the country and around the world, at nearly every major pro event, to help Rodney maintain excellence throughout his career.

On a separate note, it was Rodney Mullen who most likely brought skateboard deck outlines into the parallel-railed shapes that evolved into the "popsicle stick" shape used by nearly every company on earth for so many years now, still being the most viable and common shape being used by professional skateboarders worldwide. His early riding of the Walker McCall Pro Model freestyle boards showed us that there was too much rail curve in the boards. When he started doing what became known as "rail tricks", he found that the common rail curves used at the time were too unstable due to too much rocking when on rail. We evolved the sides of the decks into straighter lines in order to accommodate Rodney's advanced skating. Jim McCall was completely in favor of the design changes brought about in the McCall model from the demands of Rodney's skating. Take a look at Rodney's very first pro model deck from Powell Peralta, with the mechanical dog graphic. It's almost exactly the same shape as the McCall deck from 1979 and 1980, which makes perfect sense, as Rodney had pretty much become the designer of the McCall freestyle board.

Aaronbwalker (talk) 05:54, 29 November 2011 (UTC)Bruce Walker Aaronbwalker (talk) 05:54, 29 November 2011 (UTC)

Can't change stance!!
I am erasing the ridiculous section about Rodney having "changed" his stance from regular to goofy due to an injury.


 * 1. Please sign your posts, and 2. it wasn't a section, it was part of of the section CAREER: 1990s TO PRESENT DAY, and it CLEARLY STATED VIA SOURCED MATERIAL that he has to learn the Regular Stance because this injury made his special stance no longer possible. Somehow, this injury actually half-corrected a problem his had since birth, to do with his legs and back. The problem is why he had such a unique stance, now he has had the injury, his lost the problem, and thus lost the abillity to use his trademark stance. And now, he must learn the regular stance so he "switch" from regular to goofy, thus he will have to learn goofy as well. It may be hard to believe, I don't believe it either, but somehow it's true....
 * Mcjm4796 (talk) 11:52, 21 September 2009 (UTC)


 * I was the one who added the original stance change info with a source. I've just reverted back to keep it. I don't know the details, but from "The Mutt" it's clear he has had at least two major injuries--one to an ankle and one to a knee. Whether or not this has anything to do with his childhood disabilities, I can't say. It may be more precise to say he has 'erased' his stance.


 * I personally have had such a severe knee injury that I've tried to change or erase my stance several times. It has a huge impact on your skateboarding, and thus I think it's relevant to keep it.
 * --Mr. Stein (talk) 01:22, 22 September 2009 (UTC)

You're absoulutely correct Mr. Stein, and I thus agree with you. Mcjm4796 (talk) 10:52, 22 September 2009 (UTC)

Article was greatly improved. But It's really weird to say that Rod changed his stance in a case of injury, and use a video link as a prove. There was only a rumor that Jamie Thomas said someone that Rodney injuried his pelvis, and now started to skate in goofy. I think it's better to write that from after august 2007 (there is a demo for Gametrailers.com interview about Tony Hawk's Proving Ground where you can see Arto Saari and Rodney Mullen skating, and Rodney skating in his regular stance there) Rodney started to skating in switch (or in goofy stance) more to erase difference and became twin stance. Off course I can say it only proving by his latest videos and interview from Daewong Song in may 2008 issue of Thrasher magazine.

By Pavel (paulishere@mail.ru); sorry, I'm not registered here as a user.


 * I agree we could have a better source on this. I would be surprised if it was not due to an injury, since Mullen already seemed competent in switch stance.--Mr. Stein (talk) 17:16, 28 September 2009 (UTC)
 * Mullen is certainly in the process of erasing his stance and, yes, it came about because of an injury. This can be verified by the man himself in a German video interview from 2011. I have used it as an article citation.--Soulparadox (talk) 16:16, 5 October 2012 (UTC)

"Godfather" or no?
He has also been known to be regarded as the "Godfather" of Skateboarding because he played a big part in the creation of what Skateboarding has become today. - I also think that this should be added.

--Panyé El Skat-é-board-ér 08:56, 23 June 2008 (UTC)


 * The article describes Mullen as "one of the most influential freestyle skaters in the history of the sport" as this is a quote from the book by Jocko Weyland that is in the sources list. If you want to say he's the "godfather", you'll have to find a source that mentions that. A magazine article or book would suffice. Regarding the ollie versus the ollie pop - I think we may be splitting hairs. Steve-g (talk) 07:38, 24 June 2008 (UTC)

In the credits at the end of The Questionable Video he is referred to as "the great one"

--Panyé El Skat-e-board-ér (talk · contribs) 10:58, 21 July 2008 (UTC)


 * I'm not sure if that would be considered a reliable and verifiable source given that Mullen rode for them and they were owned by World who Mullen had 50% shares in. Read through WP:RS, WP:V and WP:BLP. Steve-g (talk) 12:09, 21 July 2008 (UTC)

In Tony Hawk's Pro Skater 2, Rodney Mullen's 'bio' says that he's the 'godfather' of Technical Skateboarding or something like that. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 124.179.39.125 (talk) 03:50, 21 December 2008 (UTC)
 * This can now be verified with the Transworld "30 Most Influential..." list. I have used it as a citation.--Soulparadox (talk) 16:21, 5 October 2012 (UTC)

Everyone, please read.
Right, I know a little about skateboarding and stuff, now, the earlier link, from the section PLAGIARISM!!!!! (section 2 of this talk page) was to Rodney Mullen's biography, not all the information coming from this official source is on his wikipedia article, there is a request on the article that the article is expanded with additional information, so I was wondering if we can add the information from his bio to the article.

I do, however, suggest that if you can you ask Rodney first say, for example, via E-mail if for instance, his site would let you and give you a fan-mail link or something, I would do this myself, but I need one's confirmation that this sort of thing is allowed, I am new, you know, so I need a some enlightenment.

Sorry about this!

Mcjm4796 (talk) 09:06, 16 August 2009 (UTC)


 * Just a note, rodneymullen.net is NOT his official site; it is a fan site.
 * --Mr. Stein (talk) 00:22, 18 August 2009 (UTC)

Oh and steve-g, you asked if anyone will monitor the page, I will be happy to do that for you.

Mcjm4796 (talk) 09:11, 16 August 2009 (UTC)

One more thing, I think there should be a section of the Rodney Mullen article that has a list of all the tricks he invented, make sure it's sourced, and also, if you can, get the information from the guy himself, tell him to put the list on his official website so the source is there, copy and paste the information in and stick the the link to the source in the references. I will try my best but I need help, especially because I don't know how to add references yet.

Mcjm4796 (talk) 17:36, 17 August 2009 (UTC)
 * I'm reading Mutt and will look for references. The photo reference is a good one, though, and I know there's a strong video biography of Rodney on YouTube that mentions some of this. A few hours of research should yield good, WP:V sources.
 * --Mr. Stein (talk) 00:22, 18 August 2009 (UTC)

Thanks, mate! Mcjm4796 (talk) 07:34, 20 August 2009 (UTC)

Hey, thanks for adding the trick list mate!

Thank you very much! Mcjm4796 (talk) 07:25, 5 September 2009 (UTC)


 * My pleasure! --Mr. Stein (talk) 01:18, 22 September 2009 (UTC)

Also, Kickflip Underflip?! I think that's supposed to be a Nollieflip Underflip, which was invented by Rodney Mullen, I believe. Mcjm4796 (talk) 07:43, 5 September 2009 (UTC)


 * It might be both! I know he did a kickflip underflip, but I guess the real question is whether he invented the "underflip". Just as it's a question in my mind if we (or whoever) can add "Ollie 180" to the list. Combining tricks is not really a big deal to me...


 * FYI, I finished reading "The Mutt" and will add some references and bolster some facts. Lots of good stuff in there... just need to find the time!
 * --Mr. Stein (talk) 01:18, 22 September 2009 (UTC)
 * No, it is definitely a kickflip underflip and it was definitely invented by Mullen.--Soulparadox (talk) 16:23, 5 October 2012 (UTC)

Referencing
I removed the referencing tag as the article has many citations. Anyone disagree? Steve-g 20:34, 10 March 2007 (UTC)

Thx, I was working on that before but forgot to take it down
 * I have postes the "refimprove" tag, as it is appropriate.--Soulparadox (talk) 16:27, 5 October 2012 (UTC)

TED Talk - Rodney Mullen
Rodney Mullen: Pop an ollie and innovate! TED talk (FILMED MAY 2012 • POSTED JUN 2012).--Jml3 (talk) 06:42, 27 June 2012 (UTC)
 * While I have not yet written an article on the TED talk, I have used it as a citation. I will start the section today.--Soulparadox (talk) 16:18, 5 October 2012 (UTC)
 * Kinda late by 21 days, so I've removed it for now.  Zappa  O  Mati   04:13, 27 October 2012 (UTC)

Mullen Bio height ref
Mullen has an IMDb page, which comes up first (or so, maybe, depending on your browser's earch history) in a search for ″rodney mullen height.″ I don't think it is necessary to put the citation in a bio box, but here it is if you insist: Mullen's IMDb page sourceing his height as 5' 11" (1.80 m)
 * Is it Wikipedia policy not to cite information that is contained in infoboxes? Can we just put whatever we want in the infobox sections without verifying the content? Please let me know, as this will be useful for future copyediting. In the meantime, I will await a reliable citation, as IMDb is user-generated and is, therefore, unreliable—Wikipedia has also identified this issue. Regards, Soulparadox (talk) 00:20, 28 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Isn't wikipedia kind of user generated...? IMDb appears good enough for Tony Hawk, who has the same foot/inch and (meter) format. I don't know why height is significant, anyway: G.Washington, J. Adams, Carl Sagan, etc don't have heights, so I'd remove the information before slapping CN tags and box on the article... As to referencing bio boxes, I remember that it is to be avoided, and it is rarely done. For our own decisions: Manual of Style/Infoboxes
 * Grye (talk) 07:39, 28 January 2013 (UTC)

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