Talk:Royal College of Art

Conservation
What is this "conservation" listed under "Profile": "Degrees are offered in [...] conservation"? Art conservation perhaps, as this is an Art college, or conservation of architecture or design or antiques or something else? - Ben (talk) 06:25, 5 February 2010 (UTC)

Definite article usage
When a sentence contains a list of proper nouns, it is debatable whether the definite article should litter the list unless it is used by the particular names.

In other words:
 * Also close by are Hyde Park, Kensington Palace, Royal Albert Hall, Imperial College and Royal College of Music.

Not
 * Also close by are Hyde Park, Kensington Palace, the Royal Albert Hall, Imperial College and the Royal College of Music.

– Pádraig Coogan 23:45, 10 September 2006 (UTC)


 * It is certainly debatable - the second sounds much better to me (and is what people say - eg http://www.rcm.ac.uk/content.asp?display=Courses&wp=7&pt= "Musicians from all over the world train at the Royal College of Music"). However life is perhaps too short to worry unduly about a 'the' here or there. roundhouse 01:29, 11 September 2006 (UTC)

I am referring to a list, not to single-instance usage in sentences such as the example you are quoting here. – Pádraig Coogan 09:15, 11 September 2006 (UTC)


 * Yes, I thought of that as soon as I'd saved the comment. (I was at Imperial College once upon a time.) Surely one says 'I am going to the Royal Albert Hall' (single instance). In 'I am going to the Royal Albert Hall and the Royal Geog Soc' the second 'the' is optional, but the first 'the' seems required (to me). I did a google search on "Royal Albert Hall, royal" versus "Royal Albert Hall, the royal" and got the impression (there are examples with no 'the's, 1 'the' and a plethora of 'the's, and a few with the first 'the' and one or two intervening 'the's) that the cognoscenti do put in a minimal number of 'the's whereas most of us put in all the 'the's. Eg Albertopolis has an example of 2 Royals with 1 'the' in the penultimate para (plus a nifty way round the problem at the beginning). Another example is http://www.aim25.ac.uk/cgi-bin/search2?coll_id=6065&inst_id=64 which contains examples of one 'the' and maximal 'the's in paragraph 2. Anyway I now know much more about Albertopolis than I picked up in 3 years at IC, and am almost inclined to take a train to look round the place properly.


 * I've removed some 'the's in the article; and I wonder whether the phrase in the article 'and in 1896 received the name The Royal College of Art' is correct in the light of your remarks. roundhouse 11:19, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

Not sure whether it acquired The at the beginning or not. However, if it did, the advice concerning university names at When definite and indefinite articles should be avoided is worth considering. – Pádraig Coogan 21:34, 28 September 2006 (UTC)

List of degrees
There is room for improving this article – especially the "lumpy" feel of the top – but this edit is not the way to achieve it. I fail to see the point of dumping a long vertical list of MA courses in an article such as this (see 18:25, 13 November 2006 edit). What is the context? It is misleading, for example, to imply that there is an MA in Film & TV, that really being a degree at National Film and Television School which RCA ratifies. And what of the research degrees such as MPhil and PhD? Should there not be a long list of courses for these degrees too, in the interests of balance? Other university articles in Wikipedia do not have long course listings. Please do not add information simply for the sake of it. – Pádraig Coogan 09:20, 18 November 2006 (UTC)

University ratings
(I'm posting this to all articles on UK universities as so far discussion hasn't really taken off on WikiProject Universities.)

There needs to be a broader convention about which university rankings to include in articles. Currently it seems most pages are listing primarily those that show the institution at its best (or worst in a few cases). See Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Universities. Timrollpickering 23:52, 21 December 2006 (UTC)

Alumni
I have deleted the name of Tom Barker from the list of notable alumni. TB may, in his own opinion, be a notable alumni of the RCA, but he appears to have added his own name to the list, possibly for business promotional purposes, and it does not appear on the RCA alumni list published by the RCA which is at http://www.rca.ac.uk/pages/study/alumni_2725.html

Londoner1961 06:35, 16 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Barker's name was added by this edit: . However, I'm unable determine what college Barker graduated. --Ronz 16:57, 16 October 2007 (UTC)

Oops, my mistake for jumping to conclusions as to the author. But was Athaenara not posting a bit of original research there? And as the RCA actually publishes a notable alumni list why not use that rather than having a different notable alumni list on Wiki? To answer your question, TB graduated from Edinburgh and later did a post-grad course at RCA. Londoner1961 22:38, 16 October 2007 (UTC)

Always difficult to edit lists of notable people - i suppose, but i would not necessarily trust the Royal College of Art list: in the present one there are a few I would certainly strike off ... and some I would certainly add. I belong to the graphic design camp and I would strongly argue for the inclusion of Alan Fletcher, David Gentleman, Brian Haynes (perhaps less known but a milestone in British graphic design (see Burning the box of beautiful things, by Alex Seago, Oxford University Press) and perhaps a few more from that generation. More recent years: Why Not Associates (Andy Altmann, David Ellis and Howard Greenhalgh), GTF (Paul Neale and Andy Stevens), FUEL (Peter Miles, Stephen Sorrell and Damon Murray), Jannuzzi Smith (Michele Jannuzzi and Richard Smith), Kerr/Noble (Frith Kerr and Amelia Noble). Grafista (talk) 18:50, 7 March 2009 (UTC)
 * "Notable" here should mean notable for WP purposes, and any alumnus with an article should be included. The college's own very short list, with a strong bias towards recent people, should not worry us. Equally no redlinks should be allowed. Johnbod (talk) 20:02, 7 March 2009 (UTC)

Sounds sensible. There are a couple of old-timers I am in the process of writing an article about (Max Huber, Herbert Matter) but as soon as I got those out of the way I'll work on the list ... unfortunately my time is limited so it'll take a while. I will limit my edits to the graphic designers (as it is my area of expertise), check the existence of a notable articles for those already included and add some notable new ones. Grafista (talk) 12:41, 8 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Great - I've added some in the past, but eg David Gentleman surely has an article. Johnbod (talk) 13:25, 8 March 2009 (UTC)

I don't know how an alumni works, but I think former professor of Design Research L. Bruce Archer should be mentioned somewhere in this article. Mdjaere 13:25, 27 July 2011 (UTC)

Sorry, there's no way Adam Ant went to the Royal College of Art. You should be so lucky. Ant dropped out of Hornsey, and went straight into music.JO 24 (talk) 21:03, 5 February 2012 (UTC)

Royalcollart 's edits
This was a massive edit (his 2nd) that looks to me like the college brochure, replacing nearly all the text with a peacocky, link-free version, and the edit summary:"have replaced previous infomation with accurate, up to date information. I am from the RCA)". To Royalcollart: You should gain more experience editing before making a change of this size. Please also be aware of WP:COI and some of WP:GLAM will be relevant.  Is your text original, or will I find it on the college website?  All contributions here must be released from copyright - see WP:COPYVIO. You added almost no links (and removed dozens), and your/the college's style is very WP:PEACOCKY. In general you should look to adding and integrating new material, rather than replacing the old, unless there are particular problems with it. The list of alumni you used, for example, is very biased to recent years, which may be useful to the college in attracting students, but is not what we need here. Johnbod (talk) 18:07, 9 March 2010 (UTC)
 * Yes, it is all off the website, mostly completely unchanged, and all "© 2009 Royal College of Art all rights reserved. Material published by Royal College of Art on these web pages is copyright Royal College of Art and may not be reproduced without permission."

Johnbod (talk) 00:38, 10 March 2010 (UTC)

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