Talk:S4C

Logo
S4C now has a new logo

Programmes on S4C
I have now added several links from the S4C article to articles (which I have written) about notable programmes on S4C. Could someone add to them? Would it be an idea that I translated them into Welsh as well? Here are the articles:
 * Con Passionate
 * Wedi 7
 * Cowbois ac injans
 * Newyddion

Also could someone make an article about Y byd ar bedwar, I don't know much about that programme)

Programming
The infobox says:
 * Terrestrial Analogue: Usually channel 4 (Wales only)

But this can't possibly be true, since use of channel 4 ended with the termination of VHF television broadcasting in the UK, and in any case the actual channel 4 (as opposed to Channel 4 and S4C) would have been 405-line BBC1 service. What I think the author means to say is "usually television receivers are programmed to identify this service with the number 4" since most UK receivers do not identify the actual channels on which stations are received. If I understand the UK national bandplan correctly, however, it should be possible to identify a specific set of analogue broadcast channels on which the S4C service is transmitted. 18.26.0.18 14:36, 23 Apr 2005 (UTC)
 * You're correct to say that tv receivers are normally programmed to identify the service with the number 4. The actual UHF channels used in the Wales and West of England transmitter region can be found here, but as you can see, the number of repeater transmitters makes it wholly impractical (and pointless) to list in Wikipedia. -- Arwel 17:42, 23 Apr 2005 (UTC)
 * But nearly all of those repeaters are flea-power fill-in transmitters; there appear from that list to be only three or four "primary" stations operating with a meaningful ERP (for UHF we can arbitrarily define that as being more than 50 kW peak ERP). To consider a similar situation from a country I know more about, one could write, "CBC Montreal broadcasts on CBMT, channel 6 in Montreal, on CBVE-TV, channel 5 in Quebec City, both with 100 kW peak ERP, and a network of more than 50 rebroadcasters in Quebec and three in northern Manitoba."  In the UK, since almost all transmitter facilities are shared by all the terrestrial broadcasters, it probably makes more sense to simply link to a list of the principal transmitter sites, with the services they carry, rather than repeating this information in multiple articles.  (There's a guy in SE England, whose name I don't remember, who has a huge Web site with photos of all the important facilities in the UK; he might be persuaded to allow reuse of some of his content here.)  18.26.0.18 04:30, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)
 * Those repeaters are important! My childhood home was only six or seven miles from the main transmitter at Moel-y-Parc, but thanks to badly-sited mountains it was absolutely useless to us even in the days of VHF television broadcasts - BBC Wales on channel 6 and TWW on channel 11, I think, were absolutely unwatchable through the snowstorm. We used to watch BBC North, Leeds, on channel 2 and Granada TV, Manchester, on channel 9 so I grew up knowing a lot more about north west England and Yorkshire local news than I did about what was happening in Wales! It wasn't until the Llanarmon-yn-Ial retransmitter opened in the late 1970s that we could get UHF, including BBC2 and later S4C, that made it worthwhile for us to get a colour tv (and I was about ready to leave home then, anyway!). See the HHG website under "The Seventies" to see what happened when HTV had to list its transmitters when the station opened up each day. -- Arwel 12:43, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)
 * Well, that's little different from what (to use my example) CBMT used to do (it took five minutes to do the whole thing, from "A tradition in broadcasting, we are CBC Television Montreal 6, proudly serving the province of Quebec" to "Good morning, and welcome to another broadcast day.") In any event, this rather obscures my main point, which is that the "analogue terrestrial" row in the infobox is misleading, and should probably just point to a central article about the UK TV bandplan.  18.26.0.18 22:41, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)

A choice on S4C2?
I am surprised to read about S4C-2 that "It has two audio feeds, allowing viewers to select between an untranslated version and an English-only version where all Welsh spoken is translated into English." I never get a choice! I remember when I first saw it, when people spoke Welsh, they were drowned out by the translation. But just recently, I noticed that the Welsh was no longer being translated. Some time between the two events we gave up on Sky or NTL or whatever we had and dropped back to Freeview. I don't know whether that is related? --Telsa 09:47, 22 November 2005 (UTC)
 * Really? I'll have to check it out again - I gave up watching S4C2 because the forced dub into English made me want to kill kittens.  I seem to remember the Welsh speeches on the Senedd opening day were all dubbed into English on S4C too. (This was on Sky) Vashti 16:04, 8 May 2006 (UTC)
 * I watched parts of the opening day thing on S4C-2 (via Freeview still, we haven't missed NTL or Sky or whatever it was). Welsh (what little there was: part of the poem, and some croesos in speeches was it, really) wasn't dubbed into English, and English wasn't dubbed into Welsh. Whenever I channel-hop and get the assembly coverage, I get English at the moment, though, so I can't confirm that this is still going on. Telsa (talk) 17:16, 8 May 2006 (UTC)

Contradictory!
S4C does not produce programmes of its own; instead, it commissions programmes in Welsh from the BBC and independent producers (although the quantity purchased from HTV has greatly reduced since the early years of S4C), and it has particularly developed a reputation for producing cartoons

So does it produce its own cartoons or has it just developed a reputation for commissioning good cartoons? garik 12:57, 11 August 2006 (UTC)

Garik, thanks for that. You point out something even I had missed. Sianel Pedwar Cymru does not produce any in house material at all. It is a commissioning broadcaster, and only commissions cartoons from other sources. I will make sure that the main article is corrected, and I thank you for bringing this to our attention. Thor Malmjursson 13:26, 11 August 2006 (UTC) Thor's multilingual talk page

The selection of notable programmes
We seem to have acquired a section of "notable programmes" with their own pages, and a section of "English-language programmes shown on S4C analogue". Why? Why on earth do we need the second, and what are the criteria for either? Ok, I grant Pobol y Cwm, but an entire article on the S4C Closedown Screen? Hip neu Sgip?? ''O Na! Y Morgans!''? Can we hammer out some criteria for these? At the moment they're a bit arbitrary -- where is Cefn Gwlad, for example, or any of the arts programmes? I was tempted to add them, but at this rate we'll be including the entire contemporary schedule (and there are surely some older programmes that might have a claim to fame), and I think some sanity is called for.

My first thoughts were: either high viewing figures within Wales (Pobol y Cwm); or award-winning (films, some of the cartoons); or they are particular to Wales. (Almost every channel in the world carries football, for example, but how many channels show the trotting?)

Even after they are mentioned on this article, do these all need their own articles? Almost all of the articles created so far need a lot of clean-up for a variety of reasons. (Help needed there, I think.)

Telsa (talk) 15:58, 3 September 2006 (UTC)


 * I've gone through and snipped a lot of them. While TV series are inherently notable, I agree that in order to be listed here programmes should have distinguished themselves in some other way.  I've also had a go at the children's TV list, but since I don't watch children's TV I may have cut things that are very notable - please put them back if I have! I also feel that since we're talking about Welsh-language broadcasting, programmes should be listed by their Welsh names, which are also usually the original broadcast names, and I've done the best I can to achieve this.  I also cut the Channel 4 programming list, as especially with the advent of digital TV this is becoming less and less relevant, and Channel 4 covers this topic in excruciating detail. Vashti 22:56, 26 September 2006 (UTC)


 * Wouldn't you agree that programmes such as Con Passionate and Cowbois ac injans which have won awards, deserve an article and a link from the S4C main article just like any other notable programme? (Cepb 12:58, 13 December 2006 (UTC))


 * [reformatted previous comment] How many S4C programmes have won awards since 1982?


 * To be honest I've got a good mind to do away with the lists entirely. A list of titles is meaningless and breeds nothing but everyone wanting to add their exceptional favourite programme to it.  Anyone with me? Vashti 01:23, 14 December 2006 (UTC)


 * Definitely. There is a nice clearly-written paragraph or two about some programmes. Someone spent some time doing that. Adding long lists to it doesn't look good, and it seems impossible to keep the list short. Since so many of the programmes apparently have their own articles (and, as before, I would suggest that quite a few need some polishing), I wouldn't object to creating a separate page: "List of programmes produced by S4C". In fact, I think it might be worth doing. (Ye gods, I can't believe I just suggested a "List of.." page.) But, yes, let's lose the lists from this article. Telsa (talk) 08:29, 14 December 2006 (UTC)


 * I've done the zappage, and very cathartic it was too. :D I'll create a list at the suggested location now which I urge people to add to - go wild. :) Vashti 18:57, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

Tipit - Notable?
I don't know much about S4C, except for watching it whilst there on holiday!!! However, in the listed: "Pobol y Cwm," "Dechrau Canu, Dechrau Canmol" and of course "Tipit" - are three different programmes, a soap, a religious program and a game show respectively, meaning there is some notability in it being that it is one of the only game shows broadcast in Welsh. Richard n 21:13, 29 October 2006 (UTC)


 * As the person who added it, my rationale was that if it was notable enough to have a Wikipedia entry, then it might as well go on the list. Remove it if you want, I'm beyond caring. --Q4


 * The thing is that many TV programmes have Wikipedia pages, as they are all notable. However, they are *not* all notable beyond that, at a level that merits them being listed on the page with the channels that broadcast them - imagine what most TV channel pages would look like if that were the case! Vashti 20:27, 6 November 2006 (UTC)


 * Is it also possible therefore that the channel listing should have an entry for Mastermind Cymru, since that is from what I can find, alongside Tipit, the only other game show to be broadcast in the Welsh language? Thor Malmjursson 11:43, 7 November 2006 (UTC)


 * I would think that anyone who has seen Jacpot, Risg, Cinio Caru, Siôn a Siân or the variety produced for the Planed Plant children's programming stream might take issue with the statement that in 40 years of Welsh-language television those are the only two Welsh-language game shows in existence. :) Chris talk back 19:12, 15 November 2006 (UTC)
 * Note to self: Don't edit Wikipedia whilst also posting to a message board Chris cheese whine 14:01, 5 December 2006 (UTC)

WHO GOT RID OF THE S4C ARTICLE?
Why? Who? When? Please Respond. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Cepb (talk • contribs) 13:23, 5 December 2006 (UTC).

Notice
Can anyone add an article about Y Byd ar Bedwar? Please Respond. (Cepb 13:04, 6 December 2006 (UTC))
 * Comment moved from article. Gareth 13:44, 6 December 2006 (UTC)

On screen identity?
Would this make a good "basic" on-screen identity paragraph...?

From the original launch to the early 90's, S4C's ident was based off their colored logo, featuring a stylized form-up which then morphed into the logo. But, around the early 90's, S4C began using an ident based off a Dragon Kite, representing the dragon on the flag of Wales. In 1995 (alongside the launch of their new logo), S4C expanded on this idea with idents based around the idea of suggesting the Welsh Dragon without actually showing it, by utilizing fire and flames stylized alongside household items, such as Scissors, a Trombone, a Lawnmower, and a Computer Mouse. The theme would last until 2007, where a major rebrand occured based around the magnetisim of the Welsh sociey, where objects would "gather" in a specific place.

ViperSnake151 14:35, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

S4C SE
What's the story with this sat/internet only channel? matturn 13:22, 30 July 2007 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:S4C.png
Image:S4C.png is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

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BetacommandBot (talk) 04:53, 24 January 2008 (UTC)

Programmes
The programmes currently listed seem to be entirely children's programmes. I'm going to change the section to include news, sport and entertainment programmes.

If there's a problem with this then you can revert my edit. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.148.232.192 (talk) 09:04, 15 April 2010 (UTC)

No interest in S4C?
Is there any good reason to continue including this phrase: Those who have no interest in Welsh-language television have been known to point their aerials at the nearest English transmitters to avoid S4C, as well as BBC Wales and ITV Wales it seems to be saying that people who want to watch another channel, watch another channel - eh? I propose its deletion. Geopersona (talk) 05:13, 29 May 2012 (UTC)
 * The wording does seem a bit POV, and also since digital switch over, is this still an issue? I support it's removal.--Rhyswynne (talk) 08:29, 29 May 2012 (UTC)

Digidol?
Is this just Welsh for "digital" - it isn't made 100% clear... --Τασουλα (talk) 01:39, 22 June 2012 (UTC)
 * Yes, it is. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Cymru123 (talk • contribs) 00:13, 22 July 2012 (UTC)

Name
The name of the presently existing independent statutory corporation as established by section 56 of the Broadcasting Act 1990 – although it derives, of course, from the earlier Sianel Pedwar Cymru – is simply S4C (pronounced "es pedwar ec" in Welsh and "ess four see" in English). I therefore propose revising the intro and info box accordingly. --Picapica (talk) 20:46, 10 August 2012 (UTC)
 * Support, per proposer. Rangoon11 (talk) 21:04, 10 August 2012 (UTC)

Done. --Picapica (talk) 09:05, 17 August 2012 (UTC)

S4/Croeso
I notice that it my online TV guide, S4C appears as S4/Croeso. Is this a temporary rebranding or an extra service or something? There's doesn't appear to be any mention of it in the article. danno_uk 20:58, 8 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Can't find it. Link please? Llywelyn2000 (talk) 11:16, 9 September 2020 (UTC)
 * There's no such channel - "S4/Croeso" seems to be something invented by these low-quality scammy websites that claim to let you watch thousands of TV channels online for free, but usually they're actually just web clips or nothing like what they claim to be. The entrance to S4C's headquarters in Carmarthen does bear the legend "S4/Croeso" - Croeso is Welsh for "Welcome" - but that's quite obviously not the name of the channel. Bonusballs (talk) 11:54, 9 September 2020 (UTC)
 * It's from TV Guide (https://www.tvguide.co.uk/), not an overly scammy website as far as I'm aware! If you click on the Freeview tab in the Channel Selector, the S4/Croeso logo represents S4C. The fonts all look correct, so I'd assumed that S4C had given that to them to use for some reason. The only other use of that particular logo that I can find (aside from photos of the headquarters building) is connected to an article on techdigest.tv about Ofcom issuing Channel 4's HD licences. danno_<b style="color:#336633">u</b><b style="color:#003300">k</b> 21:40, 10 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Hello, I'm Tomos, a Communications Officer for S4C. Thank you for bringing this to our attention, we will contact the website with an up-to-date logo, the one which is seen on the S4C page. For those who may be interested, there is also a WikiProject currently underway, where we are submitting press articles to help update entries which are directly and indirectly associated with S4C -cy:Wicipedia:Wicibrosiect S4C. We hope to develop this project further in the near future. In relation to any matters concerning S4C, please feel free to contact me any time. Diolch! Tomos S4C (talk) 11:17, 11 September 2020 (UTC)