Talk:Sailor Jerry

Yeah the intro to this thing sucks
Just saying. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.194.101.164 (talk) 01:40, 12 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Yep, you're just saying, not contributing.

What's going on?
Me thinks there's some kind of bias going on out there. Someone keeps removing references to Sailor Jerry as Old Ironsides, a well known radio personality that has been established in a documentary:

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1185598/

and websites:

http://www.tattooarchive.com/history/collins_norman_sailor_jerry.htm

and journalistic print:

http://www.citypaper.com/film/review.asp?rid=15433

Every time I try to add this information in the article, it gets excised out. Why is this guy being white washed? This guy was prolific and very active in pursuits outside of tattooing. Something is going on here. It is not every encyclopedic to repress information on a historic and influential figure. Can we get some rewrites here?

--65.113.35.130 (talk) 21:47, 18 December 2009 (UTC)
 * The reasoning is this; it's a total copyright violation. You've lifted the text wholesale from another site, which is both against our policies and against the law. Ironholds (talk) 23:45, 18 December 2009 (UTC)


 * firstly, what i entered:


 * Norman "Sailor Jerry" Collins (Born January 14, 1911 - Died June 12, 1973)in Reno, Nevada, January 14, 1911. As a child, Norman hopped freight trains across the country and learned tattooing from a man named Tatts Thomas who is credited for showing him how to use tattoo machines. Practicing on the weather-worn skin of drifters, he then sailed the Pacific before settling in Hawaii. But for all his adventures, he was hardly cosmopolitan. A big brute with a dirty mouth, he often wore plain white T-shirts that exposed his ink-sleeved arms. And his politics were as forward thinking as his buzz cut. Or as Mike Malone, who took over Sailor Jerry's shop after he died, puts it, "He was a class-A pirate."


 * At age 19, Norman K. Collins enlisted in the US Navy. It was during his subsequent travels at sea when he was exposed to the art and imagery of Southeast Asia. He remained a sailor for his entire life thereafter. Even during his career as tattoo artist, he worked as licensed skipper of a large three-masted schooner, on which he conducted tours of the Hawaiian islands. Sailing and tattooing were only two of his professional endeavors. He played saxophone in his own dance band and for years, Sailor Jerry was the ultra conservative, frequently controversial host of his own night talk show on KTRG radio, where he broadcasted as "Old Ironsides". He had a late-night radio talk show wherein he lectured against the impending(as he saw it) downfall of the American political system by infiltration of liberals. He was a prolific writer and carried on in-depth communications with many pen-pals throughout the world.


 * does not appear in any of the references that i cited. now, it's true i didn't write it, i merely resurrected it from previous versions.  now, indeed this information maybe copyrighted, but, so far, i can't see from what reference or citation it is has been "lifted" "wholesale."  please indicate from where it was lifted from.  secondly, this line: Norman "Sailor Jerry" Collins was a prominent American tattoo artist located in Hawaii and later in live a right wing radio personality under the name "Old Ironsides," i wrote myself, so there's no copyright violation there.  so, before going off on me about the "law," please take a moment to read what i wrote and show me the errors of my ways; and also read what is in the article.  if it is indeed a copyright or close to copyright violation, let's work it out and discuss it here to create some language that we can enter in the article.


 * --65.113.35.130 (talk) 01:26, 22 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Try this. Ironholds (talk) 01:52, 22 December 2009 (UTC)
 * uh, i did. i went to that page read it, and did not find it as the source of the "wholesale lifting" of the text above.  I entered the following words in search and did not find them on that page:
 * Reno
 * Nevada
 * Radio
 * Iron
 * Ironsides
 * Pen-pals
 * those are some key words from the resurrected text above, none of which were found on that page; key words that talk about his birth, his reputation, his homestate, and his nickname. once again, i respectfully ask you to show me where that text was lifted from wholesale to indicate that it was a copyright violation.  and if not, then can we craft some language to reinstate into the article?  are you an arbiter?  i think we need some arbitration here.
 * [note: i did find that one line of similar, that entering the navy at 19, but that line does not make it necessary to reverse the entire entry. why not just excise out that line?]
 * --65.113.35.130 (talk) 02:01, 23 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Hah; this isn't an arbitrator's area. I seem to have misread the source, my apologies - I was sure it was a copyvio :S. Ironholds (talk) 02:31, 23 December 2009 (UTC)

Old
This is a total fluff piece and is totally POV. This is the kind of crap that makes wikipedia totally unusable. It might as well be called freakopedia

"From his XX’s to his late 50’s, he stopped tattooing entirely as a part of a disagreement with the IRS." What exactly does "XX's" mean? --Skullfission 12:43, 1 November 2006 (UTC)


 * You're right - this needs a total re-write. I've been meaning to do it, but haven't had the time.  Feel free to "Be Bold" and hack away. Glowimperial 21:23, 17 January 2007 (UTC)

Article needs citations and the tone of the writing needs cleanup.

"among them tattoo legends Don Ed Hardy, Cliff Raven, Don Nolan, and Mike Malone, to whom he entrusted his legacy of flash designs" - what in the heck is a "flash design" - one of the worst articles I've ever read... 69.212.157.12 (talk) 04:39, 29 December 2008 (UTC)


 * A "flash" design is stock tattoo art - the stuff you see hanging on tattoo shop walls. It is an industry term. Julieisthebest (talk) 18:59, 30 January 2009 (UTC)

It seems to me that this article is in dire need of a re-write. It's out of focus and rambling...the man deserves better. Then again, it could just seem that way to me since I've had quite a bit of his fine rum prior to writing this... Whind Soull (talk) 06:23, 12 September 2009 (UTC)

What's the point about Ed Hardy's MFT?
Is there a significance to this point that's relevant for Sailor Jerry? Or, is there a citation for this claim? It's not even mentioned in the Wiki article on Ed Hardy. Jeffme (talk) 05:12, 27 April 2013 (UTC)

Sailor Jerry Ltd. as Separate Article
Sailor Jerry Ltd. should be its own article, or at least stub. Everything else about this page is a bio, but Sailor Jerry Ltd. is about a business inspired by Jerry, not founded by him. Not to mention the fact that Sailor Jerry Rum is a huge national brand at this point and should really have its own article for simple significance's sake. Thoughts? The Cap&#39;n (talk) 21:27, 31 March 2014 (UTC)
 * I agree. -- HighKing ++ 11:49, 1 April 2014 (UTC)

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