Talk:Salvador Dalí/Archive 2

Mike Wallace
Wallace's interview with Dali wasn't for 60 Minutes, but The Mike Wallace Interview, on July 26, 1934. http://www.hrc.utexas.edu/multimedia/video/2008/wallace/dali_salvador.html 209.242.234.122 (talk) 17:44, 26 July 2008 (UTC)

Dali's mother/housegirl?
Regarding the sentence from the first paragraph of the biography: His father, Salvador Dalí i Cusí, was a middle-class plummer and notary[6] whose strict disciplinarian approach was tempered by his housegirl, Felipa Domenech Ferres, who encouraged her son's artistic endeavors.

Unless I'm missinterpreting "housegirl", this sentence claims that Dali was the maid's son, or that the maid also had an artistic son, whose endeavors she encouraged? Anrie 13:57, 31 May 2007 (UTC)
 * It's confusing. I think it may be saying he was influenced by the maid, but someone's incorrectly put in the word "son". --Counter-revolutionary (talk) 09:06, 27 April 2008 (UTC)

Infobox
I suggest to change the infobox picture to Image:Salvador Dalí 1939.jpg, in my opinion it's not as creepy as the current one. -- Andersmusician  VOTE  05:31, 7 July 2007 (UTC)

Lawsuit
Should be some mention of the incident where he plagiarized a pixellated portrait of Abraham Lincoln right off the cover of Scientific American magazine (see Leon Harmon), and was sued over it... AnonMoos 02:59, 12 October 2007 (UTC)

Dali's writing for the Marx brothers and friendship with Harpo Marx
I just thought it should be mentioned somewhere in this article that Salvador Dali knew the Marx brothers. He was friends with Harpo Marx and even wrote a movie for them. This would surely be interesting and relevant to anyone who is interested in Dali. - flipjargendy 14:00, 24 October 2007 (UTC)

Politics
The politics section is subjective because it tries to analyse Orwell's opinion on Dali and calls it misunderstanding. Orwell was clear that he was against moral relativism when it comes to artists. There is no misunderstanding in it. The article should be neutral on this point and not trying to excuse Dali or explain Orwell. --N.N. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.108.250.170 (talk) 14:50, 21 December 2007 (UTC)


 * That's why Wikipedia has "fact" tags. JNW (talk) 15:10, 21 December 2007 (UTC)

'Secret life' is not a true autobiography, it's a bunch of made up stuff intended to shock and/or amuse. Why anyone would base opinions about the man on this work is beyond me. Technically it should probably not even be referred to as an autobiography, as it is mostly fictional. I would have thought this would be common knowledge after 60+ years LOL24.5.188.169 (talk) 01:10, 8 January 2008 (UTC)


 * Since Orwell was a wishy washy Socialist, its "perhaps" not neutral to include a line like "One ought to be able to hold in one’s head simultaneously the two facts that Dalí is a good draughtsman and a disgusting human being." Who cares what Orwell thought of Dali? Its irrelevent. - Gennarous (talk) 01:20, 29 March 2008 (UTC)

Names
I'm pretty sure that he wasn't called Domingo. As appears in "Salvador Dalí" by Fidel Cordero : " Salvador Felipe Jacinto of full name (Felipe because of his mother "Felipa", and Jacinto was his uncle's third name (uncle Rafael)). I think "Domingo" is a wrong translation of his second surname Doménech, wich he received from his mother. It's just a doubt I have, please correct me if I'm wrong and leave a reference where I can check it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 190.19.152.235 (talk) 00:22, 14 March 2008 (UTC)


 * Many google hits, including the biography on Spanish Wikipedia, confirm 'Domingo' as part of his full name. JNW (talk) 00:52, 14 March 2008 (UTC)

Orwell's crisitism is portrayed inaccurately
From part 4 Politics and personality section of the Dali article:

"In his critical review of Dalí's autobiography Secret Life, the socialist George Orwell wrote "One ought to be able to hold in one’s head simultaneously the two facts that Dalí is a good draughtsman and a disgusting human being."[67] The misunderstanding probably arises from Dalí's deliberately provocative scorn for the communist leanings of his peers, and the fact that he painted Hitler on more than one occasion.[citation needed]"

This is totally inaccurate as you'll discover if you simply read Orwell's critique here:

Benefit Of Clergy: Some Notes On Salvador Dali: http://whitewolf.newcastle.edu.au/words/authors/O/OrwellGeorge/essay/CriticalEssays/salvadordali.html cited at [67] in the wiki article.

George Orwell's criticism is a statement against Dali's own professed acts in his autobiography based on acts ranging from kicking his little sister in the head when she was three years old and he five, to his obsession with necrophilia and other obscene acts and artistic work in the early and middle parts of the 20th century.

Orwell made this statement based on his conclusions about Dali's skills as a painter, which the author praised. However, he also condemns the painter for his perversity, flaunting of immorality and extreme narcissism.

The author also questions the society and its structures that would produce such an artist with such popularity promoting such obscene and perverse actions through art and in life.

This critique was based on much more than any disdain on Orwell's part against communism, or Hitler. As neither are mentioned in the essay itself except only in indirect ways.

An excerpt from the text:

"But if you talk to the kind of person who CAN see Dali’s merits, the response that you get is not as a rule very much better. If you say that Dali, though a brilliant draughtsman, is a dirty little scoundrel, you are looked upon as a savage. If you say that you don’t like rotting corpses, and that people who do like rotting corpses are mentally diseased, it is assumed that you lack the aesthetic sense. Since ‘Mannequin rotting in a taxicab’ is a good composition. And between these two fallacies there is no middle position, but we seldom hear much about it. On the one side KULTURBOLSCHEVISMUS: on the other (though the phrase itself is out of fashion) ‘Art for Art’s sake.’ Obscenity is a very difficult question to discuss honestly. People are too frightened either of seeming to be shocked or of seeming not to be shocked, to be able to define the relationship between art and morals. 

''It will be seen that what the defenders of Dali are claiming is a kind of BENEFIT OF CLERGY. The artist is to be exempt from the moral laws that are binding on ordinary people. Just pronounce the magic word ‘Art’, and everything is O.K.: kicking little girls in the head is O.K.; even a film like L’Age d’Or is O.K. * It is also O.K. that Dali should batten on France for years and then scuttle off like rat as soon as France is in danger. So long as you can paint well enough to pass the test, all shall be forgiven you.''

''One can see how false this is if one extends it to cover ordinary crime. In an age like our own, when the artist is an altogether exceptional person, he must be allowed a certain amount of irresponsibility, just as a pregnant woman is. Still, no one would say that a pregnant woman should be allowed to commit murder, nor would anyone make such a claim for the artist, however gifted. If Shakespeare returned to the earth to-morrow, and if it were found that his favourite recreation was raping little girls in railway carriages, we should not tell him to go ahead with it on the ground that he might write another King Lear. And, after all, the worst crimes are not always the punishable ones. By encouraging necrophilic reveries one probably does quite as much harm as by, say, picking pockets at the races. One ought to be able to hold in one’s head simultaneously the two facts that Dali is a good draughtsman and a disgusting human being. The one does not invalidate or, in a sense, affect the other. The first thing that we demand of a wall is that it shall stand up. If it stands up, it is a good wall, and the question of what purpose it serves is separable from that. And yet even the best wall in the world deserves to be pulled down if it surrounds a concentration camp. In the same way it should be possible to say, ‘This is a good book or a good picture, and it ought to be burned by the public hangman.’ Unless one can say that, at least in imagination, one is shirking the implications of the fact that an artist is also a citizen and a human being." 

This entire section of the article needs to be rewritten in my opinion. The way it is worded now is entirely misleading, and easily refuted.

I welcome discussion on this important part of the article, and on George Orwell's well written critique of Dali which I tend to agree with.

The wiki could be well improved here I believe.

Graphic lucidity (talk) 05:35, 6 April 2008 (UTC)


 * Well spotted, though it doesn't surprise me that the subversives have tried to twist such a thing and use Wikipedia to try and attack a person's legacy. Clearly the review has nothing to do with Dalí's stance on Franco, despite the fact that in this article its been made to look as so. The whole sentence should just be removed.


 * Any case, I don't think Dalí was really a fascist, if I had to hedge a bet.. I'd say he was an anarchist. The unfortunate thing about the artform he was part of is, so many of them are boring communists and PC socialists. The mere fact that Dali didn't care at all what his so called "peers" though of him, to the point that he'd try to get under the skin of boring communist/athiests like Breton by pretending to be a fascist is hillarious to me and a testament to Dalí greatness. - Gennarous (talk) 04:11, 8 April 2008 (UTC)

Dali's Fascism status is incorrect
The statements about Salvador Dali being fascist are incorrect. Please see "Surrealism and the Spanish Civil War", by Robin Greeley, Yale Univ. Press, 2006. p. 55. Dali himself proclaims that he is not fascist, or Hitlerian (p.55).

It is true that fascism held a particular fascination for Dali, but this fascination was more due to his eccentric nature, and relationship to Freudian sexuality - which he associated with narcisist in Nazisim. However, Dali studied these as an artist. Robin Greeley (above ref.) shows that Dali was not fascist himself. Dali says "I am hitlerian neither in fact nor in intention". Dali was tried before the original surrealists (Breton, etc), in question of his views of surrealism, but this result was not conclusive of him as a fascist (p.51-89). None the less, his views differed enough from theirs that they separated themselves from him.

Specifically, this paragraph is wrong:

"Instead of condemning Hitler as his fellow surrealists, Dalí developed an obsessive interest in what he called "the Hitler phenomenon" which was frowned upon by his predominantly Marxist surrealist colleagues. Then, when Francisco Franco came to power in the aftermath of the Spanish Civil War, Dalí was one of the few Spanish intellectuals supportive of the new regime[30] which eventually resulted in his official expulsion from the surrealist group.[23] At this, Dalí retorted, "I myself am surrealism."[18] André Breton coined the anagram "avida dollars" (for Salvador Dalí), which more or less translates to "eager for dollars,"[31] by which he referred to Dalí after the period of his expulsion. The surrealists henceforth spoke of Dalí in the past tense, as if he was dead. At this stage his main patron was the very wealthy Edward James. The surrealist movement and various members thereof (such as Ted Joans) would continue to issue extremely harsh polemics against Dalí until the time of his death and beyond."

It suggests Dali was supportive of Fascism, which is not true. He was "obsessively interested", and it was frowned upon by other surrealists, but he proclaimed himself not to be fascist (*see note below). Greeley shows that in his works, e.g. The Enigma of Hitler (1939), Dali portrays Hitler as a "tiny dictator" (p.83), and demonstrate "it clearly deviates from fascist constructions of paternal authority as wholesome and positive", the image fascism wished to portray. In other words, Dali is questioning, challenging fascism in his painting. Dali's fascinations with capitalism, fascism, and Freudian sexuality are all related to an interest in understanding greed and desire. To Breton, original surrealism was about political change, so he could not understand Dali's interest in these things (thus referring to Dali as "eager for dollars"). Yet neither his work, nor his speech, suggest Dali was actually fascist.

The sentence "Dali was one of the few Spanish intellectuals supportive of the new regime [30]" - actually appears no where in the reference it uses! In fact, the sentences "[Dali].. did not openly side with the Republic or with the fascist regime." and "Dalí preferred to remain apolitical" DO appear in that same reference [30].

This paragraph is also ridiculous:

"Dalí, having returned to the Catholic faith and increasingly religious as time went on, was almost certainly referring to the communists, socialists and anarchists who had killed almost 7,000 priests and nuns during the Spanish Civil War. Dalí sent telegrams to Franco, "praising him for signing death warrants for political prisoners.[37]"

The reference [37], by Vincente Navarro, is an article in Counterpunch - known for alternative opinions, not fact. Navarro is not an authority on surrealist art history. That article [37], provides no references itself, neither to direct works of Dali, nor to historical sources on Dali. None of the facts it states, which are clearly opinionated, have sources.

I would change these myself, but the page appears to be locked.

Referring to the last discussion above, and the comment: "The mere fact that Dali didn't care at all what his so called "peers" though of him, to the point that he'd try to get under the skin of boring communist/athiests like Breton by pretending to be a fascist is hillarious to me and a testament to Dalí greatness.".

This is pure speculation. Dali never "pretended to be fascist". He was obsessed with understanding particular forms of greed and desire, which included fascism. Did he intentionally study these to upset Breton? Also, what is "boring" about Breton? Miro, Breton, Masson and others developed the original surrealism, called "automatic drawing", in order to denounce the military coup d'etat of the Spanish Civil War. Hardly boring. (Ref: Andre Breton, "The Manifestos of Surrealism" and Robin Greeley, Ch. 1).. Of course, this was a side comment, not on the article page itself. The best way to show Dali's greatness is not to exaggerate or make up facts about him, but to be accurate. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.6.35.182 (talk) 09:04, 27 April 2008 (UTC)

My contact info: Rama Hoetzlein, rch@umail.ucsb.edu
 * Boring is an "artist" automatically being a leftist and anti-church. Is so passé, expected and yawn inspiring. Leftists whinging about "the man" are generally, the most boring people on earth... Dali would have being doing a diservice to the truely unique person he was if he bowed down and lowered himself to the leftist atheism elitism which runs through the arts like a virus. - Gennarous (talk) 19:14, 23 May 2008 (UTC)


 * I suggest you read Surrealism and the Spanish Civil War (Robin Greeley) and Dada & Surrealism (Matthew Gale). This is simple a matter of reading and understanding the historic facts. The true picture is much more complex than the duality you create between the "left" and the "right". -Rama, 28 May 2008 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.6.35.182 (talk) 07:22, 29 May 2008 (UTC)


 * note - One meaning of becoming "obsessed with" means to take on the nature of a thing for study, but not necessary to become that thing. For example, as when Clarice begins to think like Hannibal Lechter in Silence of the Lambs. She becomes able to catch Bill (the serial killer in the film), by thinking like him, but does not become criminal herself. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 4.38.52.54 (talk) 07:05, 27 April 2008 (UTC)

I'm not sure that Dali should be mentioned as purely a surrealist artist. While many of his works are surrealist, even to the point that some argue that he had no masterpieces after he was "expelled" from the movement, I believe he had plenty of relevant paintings in the Pop Art and Cubist movements as well. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.61.31.67 (talk) 21:37, 1 June 2008 (UTC)

Featured article status disputed
I think this article needs some work to maintain its featured article status. After browsing through the article, I noticed several things that I believe should be dealt with: – Ilse@ 22:32, 17 July 2008 (UTC)
 * the lead section is not a good summary of the article
 * not all content has source references
 * the article contains a gallery with six non-free images
 * it contains superfluous whitespace

When did Dalí die--in 1982 or in 1989?
``Count Münchhausen —Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.208.47.74 (talk) 04:07, 22 July 2008 (UTC)

The article states that "Gala died on June 10, 1982", but then later says "On January 23, 1989, while his favorite record of Tristan and Isolde played, he died of heart failure at Figueres at the age of 84". So, which is it? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 148.87.1.167 (talk) 07:21, 3 December 2009 (UTC)

Can't see the discrepancy. Gala died in '82 and Salvador in '89. 81.158.169.31 (talk) 19:24, 6 February 2010 (UTC)


 * The question is not that dumb as it may look at first glance. Many, many sources give 1983 as death date for Dalí. In some foreign-language article versions on WP even---check the [|Kurdu one|]---I found the 1983 date listed, I'm not kidding. Quick Google proves my findings that the 1983 death date is VERY common (and lo' and behold, even with sites or blogs that do know heaps about arts!!) ... http://www.siguemelatinta.com/?p=89 -andy 77.7.2.131 (talk) 16:09, 17 June 2011 (UTC)

Proposal to remove date-autoformatting
Dear fellow contributors

MOSNUM no longer encourages date autoformatting, having evolved over the past year or so from the mandatory to the optional after much discussion there and elsewhere of the disadvantages of the system. Related to this, MOSNUM prescribes rules for the raw formatting, irrespective of whether or not dates are autoformatted. MOSLINK and CONTEXT are consistent with this.

There are at least six disadvantages in using date-autoformatting, which I've capped here:

Removal has generally been met with positive responses by editors. Does anyone object if I remove it from the main text (using a script) in a few days’ time on a trial basis? The original input formatting would be seen by all WPians, not just the huge number of visitors; it would be plain, unobtrusive text, which would give greater prominence to the high-value links. Tony  (talk)  14:14, 24 July 2008 (UTC)

Weasel words and POVs in "Politics and personality" section.
- Some of Dalí's statements supported the Franco regime, congratulating Franco for his actions aimed "at clearing Spain of destructive forces" NEEDS A CITATION so I'll add

"Dalí, having returned to the Catholic faith and increasingly religious as time went on, was likely referring to the communists, socialists and anarchists who had killed almost 7,000 priests and nuns during the Spanish Civil War."

- 1) "Communists, Socialists and anarchists" not "communists, socialists and anarchists"

- 2) "was likely referring" is weasel-worded, POV and (possibly) original research. I propose to add notices to this effect at the start of the section, and to rewrite as:

"Dalí, having returned to the Catholic faith and increasingly religious as time went on, was likely referring to the Communists, Socialists and anarchists who had killed almost 7,000 priests and nuns during the Spanish Civil War."

However, I think that there is a strong case for removing this altogether if no supporting evidence can be found. Wikipedia is not the place for conjecture and opinions on what famous artists may/may not have been "likely" to be "referring to". The place for that sort of thing is a thesis, a biography or a history book. Not an encyclopaedia.

Liquidcentre (talk) 16:19, 4 September 2008 (UTC)


 * I understand your concern. However, anybody who is acquainted with the Spanish situation/history and late Dali's stances on the matter, will tell you that, indeed, that excerpt rings true. It may be difficult to quote, but rather true all the same. That is why I thought that removing it is excessive.
 * So, as far as I am concerned, those tags are ok, except for the one regarding killed clerics, because you find those citations at the article linked, Red Terror (Spain). Mountolive   and the complications 16:22, 4 September 2008 (UTC)

Some valuable missing information on your Dali page
4yourinfo (talk) 12:57, 21 September 2008 (UTC)
 * This was interesting, but it was also a cut-and-paste copyright violation of the content of this web page, which is why I have removed it. If you could rewrite it in your own words, there is no reason why this information should not be included on the page, and you'd be welcome to do so yourself.  Ka renjc 13:08, 21 September 2008 (UTC)

Bisexual
Dali had a homosexual relationship with Federico Garcia Lorca, as well as having had heterosexual relationships; therefore he was bisexual. That he claimed he was not homosexual does not contradict that, as many bisexuals say that, and, strictly speaking, bisexuals aren't homosexual, they are of mixed orientation. It also has to be remembered that being LGBT when he was a young adult was not celebrated with gay pride marches etc as it is today. Catholicism was much stronger in Spain then, and, under Franco's regime, being LGBT was certainly not something to publicly admit. Werdnawerdna (talk) 01:26, 14 October 2008 (UTC)


 * I agree with Werdnawerdna. In fact, some valuable missing information on this Dali page... And no bibliography. Best regards. IP, 25 October 2008 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.89.67.131 (talk) 15:37, 25 October 2008 (UTC)


 * Agreed, too --24.21.148.155 (talk) 03:52, 8 December 2008 (UTC)


 * As far as I know, Garcia was well in love with him - but I doubt they had an actual (sexual) relationship. 62.47.52.134 (talk) 09:19, 19 April 2009 (UTC)

Removed from categories LGBT and Bisexual. There is no evidence that Dali identified as either. There is a citation on the Garcia Lorca page which quotes Dali on their relationship and although he is coy, the suggestion is that if Dali succumbed to Garia Lorca's seduction, it was coerced. Dali makes it quite clear in the quote that he has no sexual desire for men. It seems more likely that nothing happened. Steve Lowther (talk) 16:20, 26 January 2010 (UTC)


 * The book published by taschen includes an essay written by Dali professing his love of sodomy and watching others being sodomized. Make of that what you will. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.113.49.126 (talk) 06:26, 22 February 2010 (UTC)

Figueres, Spain
It is enough with "Figueres, Spain"; no need to add "Catalonia" and "Spanish Catalan". Ridiculous. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.31.72.232 (talk) 09:47, 8 November 2008 (UTC)

Jewelry under List Of Works
This needs to be added. Dali made a handful of prominent pieces of jewelry. I'd add it myself but the form isn't showing any changes. --24.21.148.155 (talk) 03:48, 8 December 2008 (UTC)

Born-Died stuff
I'd propose the common Wikipedia standard: Figueres, 11 May 1904 - Púbol, 23 January 1989 because this would make the phrase "born in Figueres" superfluous and thus the article more compact and more fluent to read. Agree? -andy 92.229.164.237 (talk) 09:25, 18 December 2008 (UTC)


 * See the Manual of Style section WP:DATE, which states: "Locations of birth and death are given subsequently rather than being entangled with the dates." - mandarax  •  xɐɹɐpuɐɯ   09:55, 18 December 2008 (UTC)

Dalí's Brother
The information regarding Dalí's brother's death is inaccurate. According his autobiography, his brother died at the age of seven, three years before Dalí was born, of meningitis.

The Secret Life of Salvador Dalí, pg.2

User246 (talk) 19:12, 23 December 2008 (UTC)

his wife
in one of his painings he drew to symbolise his love for his wife because he said when he kissed her he felt like he should be devouring her!

Dali's obscure comrade, the one depicted as the Moor in the piece entitled The "Battle of Tetuan".
Dali's obscure comrade: Were you aware that Salvador Dali had a very close friendship with an African-American gentleman who acted as Dali's rep., during the 60's. Reginald Lawrence Simmons (b. June 18, 1926 Dickinsen, TX) represented Dali in NY, at the United Nations in 1966 where he presented "The Salvador Dali Cachet UNICEF" design to the then UN Secretary General U Thant. It is said that on that same occasion Basil Rathbone was presiding during said presentation. Dad also appeared on the Joe Franklin Show with Monsieur Dali (circa 1963). Who was this Mr. Simmons? Mr. Simmons represented Dali in Stockholm at the Kunst Academy and at the Museum of Fine Arts Montreal Canada. It occurs to me that for history's sake (and during every Black History Month) it would merit some looking into. Few people know that Monsiuer Dali chose Reginald Simmons as the model for the face, arms, hand wielding the sword, upper torso being trampled and various other body parts to be featured in his painting entitled "The Battle of Tetuan?" Mr. Simmons is depicted as the Moor that is leading the battle against Dali, the Spaniard in the Northern Moroccan city of Tetuan. Thankfully, Simmons is yet with us. Mr. Simmons has insight into Dali that few still living have, and has much to share on his friendship with Dali and his beloved Gala. This has proven very interesting to those fortunate enough to have met him. This is a bit of history that should be made known to the so called Dalinians at large and to the black community for socio-educational and artistic edification. In my opinion this falls into the category of African-Americans who although instrumental in matters of politics, exploration, science, religion and in this case the arts, were kept in virtual obscurity or basically not often spoken of. Such as: Lewis Howard Latimer, Latimer was the only African-American member of Thomas Edison's engineering laboratory. Or Matthew Alexander Henson, who was the only African-American to accompany Robert E. Peary as personal assistant, dog driver, and interpreter on numerous expeditions to the Arctic. Mr. Simmons is in the process of producing a Docu/Art documentary on Dali that will give the viewer an introduction to the mind of Dali from the experiential knowledge of a friend and comrade. You may write Mr. Simmons at: 510 Main Street Suite 1914 Roosevelt Island, NY 10044 212-593-2616 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.214.1.1 (talk) 01:28, 28 March 2009 (UTC)

what's wrong?
Please tell, what's wrong with my added link? Georgiani (talk) 14:08, 1 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Please review WP:EL and WP:LINKSPAM. For more detail, look at my reply to your post on my talk page. Apparition11  Complaints / Mistakes  14:19, 1 May 2009 (UTC)

Uh, I think he might have done a few paintings in addition to his career as a moustache model.
Ya, so there are like ten photos of Dali, and none of his paintings. This is a major weakness of this article. I'd find a free use one to upload but then some 17 year old on a power trip would find a reason to delete it, so I suggest someone with more time to devote to wikipedia drama do this ASAP. Wormwoodpoppies (talk) 14:41, 22 May 2009 (UTC)

Anti-semitism POV in politics and personality
"In any event, he was not an anti-Semite, as he was a friendly acquaintance of famed architect and designer Paul László, who was Jewish. ". Doesn't seem to follow, other than to state someone's point of view that having a jewish mate precludes an individual from accusations of anti-semitism. Human relationships and prejudice are somewhat more complex, and that conclusion is demonstrably false!

In any case, that sentence appears to make no sense in context, there is nothing around it in the article discussing his alleged semitism. His fascination for Franco's fascism, for all sorts of reasons, doesn't necessarily illuminate his views on anti-semitism.


 * I've removed the passage. The political and anti-semitism issues are already covered, with cites, earlier in the article. If there is a need to re-introduce this passage, it needs to be placed in better context, with sources. Otherwise it does look like original research. JNW (talk) 15:32, 23 June 2009 (UTC)
 * That's a strange assertion in a cert way, because
 * the Jude iconography in Dali's production is quite important (>200 paintings)
 * because some people want to see in Gala a Jude women (... without any proof. Her life is quite opposed to this theory with a catholic wedding and a lot of Christian representations by Dali) v_atekor (talk) 06:15, 17 May 2013 (UTC)

Suggested Exhibition reference with image resource for artwork Daddy longlegs...
Available at http://artabase.net/exhibition/1824-salvador-dal-liquid-desire

Xiatica (talk) 06:48, 23 July 2009 (UTC)

FA Review
I think this article needs to be reviewed to see if it is still a Featured Article due to several issues.


 * Some of the links are listed as bare urls.
 * Many instances of [citation needed] listed in the article.

I just glanced over the article. Many other issues could exist.  miranda   02:49, 26 September 2009 (UTC)

Error in Birthdate

 * birthdate    = May 11, 1904

I supposed it needed to be | birthdate    = May 11, 1804

Thanking you in anticipation, Alex Chokler

Spanish Catalan?
This is superfluousness, right? I think the page is about a painter and not about politics... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.50.75.173 (talk) 18:25, 6 October 2009 (UTC)
 * I agree. I wonder if there's any discussion on this issue (either here or about another article). The Spanish article says 'Spanish painter' while the Catalan one doesn't say anything regarding his nationality in the intro. Depor23 (talk) 05:05, 26 April 2010 (UTC)
 * It seem's most of major (all ?) sources (Robert Descharnes & Gilles Neret, Dali, oeuvre complète ; Ian Gibson Shamefull life of SD ...) insist over various pages that Dali is Catalan played a major role in its artistic life. Descharnes says Dali is Catalan without precision of its nationality, explaining if he had been from anywhere else he wont have been Dali... I am not sure the nationalityof Dali is important (ie, the legal point of view on its origin)  since he spent as much time in France than in Spain, and much time in the US. We are talking about painting and influence of his origins on his painting. Critics accords to says his Catalan origin was much more important than the Spanish legal point of view despite assertion of Freud (what a [spanish] fanatic) and over all despite some self assertions of Dali under the Franco power.  v_atekor (talk) 14:50, 9 January 2014 (UTC)

Shouldn't the Salvador Dalí article have a few images of his paintings?
It's curious that an article on Salvador Dalí, the surrealist painter, doesn't have a single image illustrating his surrealist style of painting, not even Persistence of Memory. --Keith111 (talk) 19:49, 9 October 2009 (UTC)
 * If you can find some free images to use, then add them in. Have fun! Bonewah (talk) 20:10, 9 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Why does it have to be free? Does Wikipedia not allow low-resolution, fair-use images for illustrative purposes? For example: this image used in this article. The image even has a fair use rationale for Salvador Dalí, suggesting that it was once used in the article but someone removed it. --Keith111 (talk) 01:25, 12 October 2009 (UTC)
 * I dont pretend to know the fair use rules with regard to images and so forth. If you can get an image that is acceptable to wiki's rules then boldly add it in. Bonewah (talk) 13:03, 12 October 2009 (UTC)

The Secret Life of Salvador Dalí
I was surprised that The Secret Life of Salvador Dalí did not have its own article, so I created it. The Squicks (talk) 04:09, 12 October 2009 (UTC)

More Pictures
I didn't bother to read the Spanish page, but it has lots of pictures. :p OrangeAipom (talk) 05:52, 4 November 2009 (UTC)

Gala was almost 10 yrs older, not 11
Would you correct it? --71.247.231.74 (talk) 19:09, 6 February 2010 (UTC)

Avida Dollars
Avida Dollars is what he was called by his high art friends. It was a personal swipe that he embraced. While the other artists pretended to be love art for arts sake and enjoy being poor bohemians, Dali embraced the money and went where the money was, NYC & Hollywood. Why no mention of it? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.113.49.126 (talk) 06:30, 22 February 2010 (UTC)

Add Portrait
I would like to add a portrait of Dali in the 'Later years in Catalonia' section as I have done in the Spanish Wikipedia This is the photograph I'd like to add http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Dali_Allan_Warren.jpg It was taken in 1972 and I thought it might suit as it shows Dali in his later years. Herr uebermann (talk) 11:00, 28 February 2010 (UTC)

Grammatical Error
"A lean 1.72 m (5 ft. 7¾ in.) tall,[14] Dalí already drew attention as an eccentric and dandy. He wore long hair and sideburns, coat, stockings, and knee breeches in the style of English aesthetes of the late 19th century."

Just thought I should point out that the start of this sentence doesn't make sense. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Bmgillies (talk • contribs) 07:05, 6 March 2010 (UTC)


 * I am not sure what the grammatical error is. You can be both lean and tall. The number, 14, in the brackets refers to a referenced citation. You have to remember that most likely at that time, 5'7" was considered tall. The second sentence alone would be reason to call him eccentric and dandy (as in he dressed oddly). Can you explain your concern? The sentence probably could be reworked but due to this is a European article, meters are involved.--Morenooso (talk) 07:22, 6 March 2010 (UTC)
 * I think 'a' should probably be 'at'. Zazaban (talk) 07:55, 6 March 2010 (UTC)

_____________ I don't buy that stuff that 100 years ago someone who was nearly 5'8" was unusually tall. WS Gilbert was about 6 feet tall, born in 1836~.  From what I have read there is a lot of myth about people being so much larger in the past 75 years or so... All this baloney about better nutrition. Totally ignoring DNA/genetics, etc.   If we went by that kind of reasoning, Jesus would have been about 3 feet tall...  Humans haven't changed that much in millions of years.  68.71.8.57 (talk) 22:06, 6 August 2012 (UTC)
 * It was 1930s Spain. People were shorter. --Error (talk) 19:04, 12 May 2013 (UTC)

Photo 1960s
Viewers might like to know that Dali is holding a pet ocelot, not a domestic cat.Urselius (talk) 11:35, 19 April 2010 (UTC)

Edit request from Dhlsmith, 29 May 2010
Disambiguation of a link (currently goes to disambiguation page): Please change "For their costumes, they dressed as the Lindbergh baby and his kidnapper" to "For their costumes, they dressed as the Lindbergh baby and his kidnapper" Reason: According to Lindbergh baby article, Bruno Hauptmann was his kidnapper.

Dhlsmith (talk) 07:54, 29 May 2010 (UTC)


 * OK, thanks for the input. Graham Colm (talk) 08:12, 29 May 2010 (UTC)

Pending changes
This article is one of a number selected for the early stage of the trial of the Pending Changes system on the English language Wikipedia. All the articles listed at Pending changes/Queue  are being considered for level 1 pending changes protection.

The following request appears on that page:

Comments on the suitability of theis page for "Penfding changes" would be appreciated.

Please update the Queue page as appropriate.

Note that I am not involved in this project any much more than any other editor, just posting these notes since it is quite a big change, potentially

Regards, Rich Farmbrough, 23:56, 16 June 2010 (UTC).

Nirvana
What a great article. I never knew about

"1969 – Improvisation on a Sunday Afternoon, television collaboration with the rock group Nirvana"

Bonwit teller incident
I find it surprising that such an incident isn't already on his or Bonwit Teller's page. I think it is notable with the provided sources to add to both Dali's and Teller's pages. http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,931178,00.html http://www.smithsonianmag.com/arts-culture/dali.html?c=y&page=3 TacfuJecan (talk) 08:34, 12 August 2011 (UTC)

Dali's Sexuality
Whether he was straight, gay, or bi, Salvador Dali had a very flamboyant personality. This has lead to much speculation about his sexuality. Because such flamboyance is often associated with being gay or bisexual, it is therefore natural for people to wonder what his sexual orientation was. This is curiosity, not judgment. So why is there a very noticeable lack of mention of his sexuality in the article? Only by using Ctrl+F was I able to even find out Salvador Dali was married. The movie Little Ashes portrays him as gay or bisexual. Google searches produced accounts (notably from Cher) of his possible bisexuality. This Wikipedia entry makes no explicit mention this. The internet is a free and open marketb to express ideas and knowledge. But I have a strong feeling that this page has been under control of people who do not want to address Dali's sexuality. Someone please fix or address this. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 129.3.139.40 (talk) 03:05, 3 March 2012 (UTC)


 * Anyone interested in pursuing this further will find this paper interesting reading, from page 6 onwards. --Elen of the Roads (talk) 23:57, 6 April 2012 (UTC)

Universal Dali Tarot
apparently this was one of the final works of art he finished near the end of his life? Gertrude Stein Museum online has the original 78 (79? do they not know how many cards make up a Tarot deck?) paintings. Rachel Pollack wrote a book about the deck "Salvador Dali's Tarot", and several language editions of the deck itself have been printed with various books. I did not see any mention of Tarot or of this deck on Dali's page. please repair, just passing by! cheers!-- self-ref (nagasiva yronwode) (talk)

Did Dali fuck ducks? Catalonian ex-prostitute Senyora Rius discusses it in her book and in this interview. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GwiEOzj54ZY

http://enricllorens.blogspot.co.uk/2012/02/la-senyora-rius-la-zoofilia-den-dali-la.html

"Arab lineage"
The article mentions his "self-styled "Arab lineage" and that he claimed "that his ancestors were descended from the Moors". This certainly gives the impression that it is possible that he was not descended from the Moors. It would be highly unlikely that he was not descended from them given that they inhabited Spain for much of the Middle Ages. Surtsicna (talk) 11:39, 19 April 2013 (UTC)
 * Agree, and over all that does not mean nothing since the important point is what the artist had used has reference in his work, and how art people had considered him. on these point of view he is catalan (main work) and spanish (declarations of freud). To end : most of European people has moors ancestries at a cert point : the Roman Empire spread over all the mediteranean, including Cartage (Tunis), Syria, Egypt... v_atekor (talk) 08:40, 11 May 2013 (UTC)
 * Complement :  Es un nombre masculino de origen espanol, del municipio de Palma de Mallorca, que significa hombre de buen corazon, tambien se lo utiliza como apellido. here v_atekor (talk) 09:06, 11 May 2013 (UTC)
 * Um, the Moors inhabited Figueres for a scant 70 years or so. We're not talking about Andalusia here, but rather northern Catalonia. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 83.59.91.27 (talk) 12:25, 12 July 2014 (UTC)

Born in Catalonia
I think the Wikipedia's standards says that the birth place should refer to the political situation of each moment. In example: Mother Teresa was born in Skopje, Kosovo Vilayet, Ottoman Empire... but not in the Republic of Macedonia (current denomination). As well, Dalí was born in Figueres, Spain, because Catalonia dind't exist as any kind of political entity in 1904. Currently the article says "Figueres, Catalonia, Spain". --83.37.212.109 (talk) 19:24, 14 May 2013 (UTC)
 * Thank you, you have a good point. I have removed Catalonia from the birthplace (although he did die in the same city in Catalonia in 1989) and I have restored "Spanish Catalan" to his description in the lede sentence. Elizium23 (talk) 05:52, 15 May 2013 (UTC)

Interesting fellow
What would it take to get GA back? Seems like lots of content and ref notes.

Any main authors still working here (not gnomes, vandals or reverters)?

Was watching this video:

TCO (talk) 03:17, 5 July 2013 (UTC)


 * Somebody should do a GA assessment to identify what needs to be improved. Don't know who the "main authors" were, or if there were any. Note that the French, Spanish, and German versions of the article (see sidebar at left of article) all seem to have GA-equivalent status. Good material could/should be imported from those articles, along with refs. Google Translate can be used to get an idea of what is out there, though it is better to find editors reasonably fluent in these other languages. Reify-tech (talk) 12:23, 5 July 2013 (UTC)

References in Media
Coming to the Dali page, I was wholly surprised to find that there was no references to works that reference him. For example, in The Amazing Adventures of Kavalier and Clay Dali appears as a semi-fictional historical character (and he gets himself in a situation that the REAL Dali actually got into -- ie. getting stuck in a diving suit and almost diving...). But I think that there are likely other media references to him... I think this could help get the GA property back on this page, as well as do some good for research and information available for Mr. Dali. 2602:306:CD15:C130:7DFF:DE98:32EC:FF4F (talk) 17:21, 12 August 2013 (UTC)

Dali and Bonwit Teller & Co. was a department store in New York City.
This topics is missing Bonwit Teller & Co. was a department store in New York City founded by Paul Bonwit in 1895 at Sixth Avenue and 18th Street. Now this building doesnt exist it is Trump tower. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 12.166.104.221 (talk) 14:39, 17 September 2013 (UTC)

Doubt's about the body-length of Salvador Dali
1 I've read in trueknowledge.com (unfortunately this site doesn't exist any more). his coffin was 1.74m. when he was died in 1989. I've got my doubt's because his knees were a little bit hold up, when his body rests in his coffin. So he was absolutely taller than 1.72m. I believe he was in fact between 2.08 or 2.10m. 2 by http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_are_some_unimportant_facts_about_Salvador_Dali I knew this information: Salvador Dalí was 1.72 m (5ft 7-3/4 in), according to his prison record when he was 20 years old. However his hairdresser/biographer Luis Llongueras says Dalí was 1.74 m (5ft 8-1/2in) tall. I'm also not agree with this two "true"knowleges. I know he was in prison in New York, but that was in the late 1930's and he was already much older than 20. So I'm afraid I don't really understand this reference about he was in a jail when he was 20. What about his hairdresser: Well it could be that his wife Gala was indeed between 1.72m. Perhaps his hairdresser/biographer means in fact the length of Gala Dali. So it's not sure it is true if Salvador Dali was 1.72m. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 217.123.241.49 (talk) 19:55, 12 October 2013 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 22 August 2014
Please add the following information under "Theater and Film":

In the mid-1970s, film director Alejandro Jodorowsky cast Dali in the role of the Padishah Emperor in a production of Dune, based on the novel by Frank Herbert. According to the 2013 documentary on the film, Jodorowsky met Dali in the King Cole Bar in the St. Regis hotel in Manhattan to discuss the role. Dali expressed interest in the film but required as a condition of appearing that he be made the highest paid actor in Hollywood. Jodorowsky accordingly cast Dali as the emperor, but he planned to cut Dali's screen time to mere minutes, promising he be the highest-paid actor on a per minute basis. The film was ultimately never made.

71.167.44.135 (talk) 03:03, 22 August 2014 (UTC)
 * Yes check.svg Done -- ferret (talk) 17:36, 22 August 2014 (UTC)

Civil war
'Meanwhile, Spain was going through a civil war (1936-1939), with many artists taking a side or going into exile.'
 * This disembodied statement does not tell us anything about Dali's wartime loyalties. Valetude (talk) 16:00, 30 November 2014 (UTC)

Demoniacs
Does Dalí really belong in Category: Demoniacs? The category consists mainly of people who professed to be possessed by demons, or who were publicly exorcised. This does not seem to be the case with Dalí. Here is the only supporting text in the article: "An Italian friar, Gabriele Maria Berardi, claimed to have performed an exorcism on Dalí while he was in France in 1947. In 2005, a sculpture of Christ on the Cross was discovered in the friar's estate. It had been claimed that Dalí gave this work to his exorcist out of gratitude, and two Spanish art experts confirmed that there were adequate stylistic reasons to believe the sculpture was made by Dalí" (Catholic News, October 14, 2005).

The story sounds rather flimsy, nothing more than the word of one alleged witness. Have Dalí's biographers written of this? Ewulp (talk) 04:55, 12 March 2015 (UTC)


 * I agree that without more WP:RS, this story is dubious, especially if Dalí himself made no mention of being exorcised. Reify-tech (talk) 05:06, 12 March 2015 (UTC)

External links modified
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