Talk:Sam Shoemaker

Untitled
"It is difficult to explain Sam Shoemaker’s legacy to A.A. without knowing the depth and breadth of what Sam offered. Rev. Shoemaker wrote over thirty books, at least half of which were circulating before A.A.’s 12 Steps were first published in the Big Book in 1939. The book was circulated in New York, Akron, and the Oxford Group." Is pretty much word for word from the referenced website. Is this copyright violation? --Golden Eternity 17:39, 21 May 2007 (UTC)

I don't think the the clause "Sam was instrumental in assisting Bill W. in the writing of the book . . " belongs in the article. Both Shoemaker and Wilson have said that SS taught BW the basic OG teachings, and BW used those teachings in writing the book. There is also an AA story that Irving Harris had said Bill Wilson asked Shoemaker to write the steps, but the provenance of that statement is shaky, and there has never been another claim that the two men were in contact at the time the book was written (although they certainly were in contact years before and years after). I think that phrase should come out unless there is a good reference for it.Rose bartram (talk) 00:29, 24 November 2008 (UTC)

A huge section at the end was imported from an article by Karl Olsson, apparently unchanged. This looks to be a copyright violation. In any case it is not acceptable to add to a wiki article by cutting and pasting a large amount of an outside writer's work. I will remove it unless someone can think of a reason not to.Rose bartram (talk) 13:45, 9 November 2011 (UTC)

More editing needed
I don't have time to edit this to meet Wikipedia's standards. Still, I've started moving this into a more historical direction, using the brief page in the Episcopal church lectionary (which didn't even say when Shoemaker's ministry in Pittsburgh began) while updating a new laptop. For what it's worth, I've referred to Shoemaker by his surname rather than first name, and whacked much of the Olssen material which Rose Bartram above considered a copyright violation. I suggest cutting the block quotes further--at least they need to be sourced and I don't have time to look for the Olssen material, just made the inadequate sourcing a ref.Jweaver28 (talk) 21:08, 2 February 2014 (UTC)

I did some editing today and don't know when or if I'll be able to resume, so listed the 3 biographies at the end.Jweaver28 (talk) 23:41, 10 February 2014 (UTC)

Photo needed
I did some more editing these last couple of days, and stopped by St. Thomas' church in Baltimore County to take a photo of the gravestone and family obelisk, which I hope to upload tomorrow when I get my cables straightened out. I write today because I'm having trouble finding noncopywrite protected photos of Shoemaker, and hope someone from Pittsburgh or New York or a family member can donate them. Clearly, he did most of his work after 1923. Photos in the bio his wife wrote in the 1960s (which I've only had time to skim) are clearly copyright-protected, tho the copyright holder could donate them to wikicommons.Jweaver28 (talk) 03:46, 31 January 2015 (UTC)